To not allow BIL unsupervised access to my DS

[Hennyspennies]

I am seeking advice on this as I want to be sure I am doing the right thing by my DS and not for selfish reasons.

Warning : May be triggering, mentions sexual assault.

Back story - Strained relationship with BIL for the past 7 years. This was due to a breakdown in family relationships after BIL's DD sexually molested my DS. She was 11, DS was 1. My DS doesn't remember this, as he was unable to talk, we never found out what fully happened.

I believe there was no real responsibility taken, other than a quick sorry from my S & BIL when the incident happened. DN never spoke to me about it, or said sorry.
I believed DN needed help (another red flag incident when she was 6) but as far as I know never received any. It was swept under the rug.

Family were expected to get on as normal. My parents expected everyone to meet up as usual with no safeguarding issues re the kids or respect for my families difficult feelings at this time.
Things were strained.

I tried to speak with them about our feelings and concerns respectfully but nothing changed so I kept my distance.

Fast forward 7 years. My S & BIL have been in our lives on and off more frequently. Months in-between visits (they live near by). I still feel uncomfortable in their presence as they I've noticed they usually spend time with us when they want something.

My DS is really into football at the moment and BIL coaches a local kids team. Without asking me or my DH he told my son that he would take him to see football matches, teach him how to play etc. Has already bought him a football shirt.

Since BIL hasn't been involved in my DS life much and because of failure to safeguard him in the past, I feel uncomfortable with the idea of my DS going anywhere with him unsupervised. This applies to my S too. My DH agrees with me.

DS was super excited his U wanted to to all this with him of course. However, he is unaware of what happened when he was younger.

I felt it appropriate to agree to football trips and training so long as myself or DH are present. AIBU?

BIL keeps pushing for alone time with my DS. (He has 4 DD so appreciates my DS love of football).

I also have 2 older DD which he shows little interest in.

Any advice or thoughts welcome.

Coaches a kids football team? Worrying...

I feel so sad for you, your niece, your son. I think child abuse is much more common than anyone thinks. Trust your instincts.

When DN abused your son were the police involved.
Strange at 11 she did that.
Do NOT allow Bil alone time trust your gut.

Assuming that BIL is a risk for DS…

The problem with letting your DS have supervised time with BIL is that you are normalising the relationship. When DS is 13/14/15 and doing things on his own quite naturally it means that he is likely to be happy to meet up with BIL without you there. Its like BIL would be grooming DS in plain sight.

If you think that BIL is a risk to DS, you are going to have to talk to DS about it in an age appropriate way and explain why any relationship between the two of them is risky/needs to be controlled. I dont think you need to explain there is a sexual abuse question, just that BIL isnt to be trusted because of decisions he made AND that the greater family doesnt talk about it because it would cause upset to Grandparents etc as they naturally like everyone to get along. That DS should avoid being alone with BIL and that is why he wont be doing soccer with him etc

I agree with the others. You know this is putting your child at risk OP. Trust your instincts, don't be pressured or manipulated into putting your child at risk.

I hope you reported the incident with your DN and DS to social services. Poor girl is probably being abused.

There is absolutely no way I would allow this. There's no need for your BIL to have alone time with your DS, and I'm not even sure I'd allow the football trips even with one of you present. If your DS is into football, you or DH can do those things with him without BIL.
I think I'd be so uncomfortable after the previous incident that I'm not sure I would spend any time with him or your sister or their kids at all.
On top of that he focuses attention on your son but ignores your daughters. Even without the rest of it, this would be enough for me to say no.

I think you all failed your nice so much !! You do realise she has probably been abused herself and none of the grownups even called social services and reached for help ?? This is a much bigger issue than what you put here or just your son . Why didn’t you protect your niece too ?

It's a big NO from me. Find something else for DS. Explain that the family weren't to be trusted when he was tiny, & leave it at that, just assuring him you have his best interests at heart. BIL shouldn't even have discussed anything with DS without your approval. Massive red flags. Good luck.

If it was my niece I would be extremely concerned. I would happily damage any relationship with an adult over concern for a child.

Were social services involved at the time. It doesn't look like it but you are aware of two incidents regarding your niece so I'm just checking.

It looks like the whole thing has been swept under the carpet from the whole family, including you.

How is your niece now?

Not a chance ,why take the risk

No way, not a chance.
I would be explaining to my DS (age appropriately) the history behind the decision to block the development of this relationship, or he might twist your actions in your son's mind.
Red flags everywhere and building trust with someone who failed to react appropriately when you were assaulted as a vulnerable baby is a Big Fat Hairy NO.

I would start talking to your Ds about secrets and about how you don’t have any in your family. There is never any good reason for an adult to try and get a child to keep secrets from mummy and daddy. If any adult (teacher, family member, stranger) asks him to keep a secret he is to say “No, we don’t keep secrets in our family. I will tell my parents.” If they ask him if he wants to play a special game, but he has to keep it secret, what is he to say? “No. We don’t keep secrets in our family. I will tell Mum and Dad” etc. If someone offers to take you to the football but you have to promise to keep it secret what do you say? Etc…

*This was taught to me by a child protection police woman.

This is my opinion, too.

Sort the interest in footie out for your son yourselves. Keep BiL WELL away from him.

Similar situation here. It’s split the family in two and I’m seen as the black sheep for not allowing my DC to be in contact with DN. The lengths people will go to to cover up and deny is incredible! My own DM thinks I’ve been ‘over the top’ and is sympathetic towards DN, the teenaged abuser, as opposed to my much younger DC. It’s abhorrent and we will never see that side of the family again.

No no no.

Thank you to all who have replied. It's been refreshing to get opinions from those not involved.

Family means everything to me and this has been devastating. The safety of my children come first though. Thank you for allowing me to see clearly that he should NOT have alone time with my DS.

I agree with all who have suggested that DN has possibly been abused. I have thought the same. The incident was reported at the time and SS were beyond useless. I felt DN needed to receive help and be investigated further but as far as I'm aware this didn't happen. My family received no help or advice either. For our own sanity and safety we reduced contact drastically. Saw each other at big family functions only.

DN behaviour is still unstable now she is 18. Stealing, unemployed, strained relationships with bf's etc.

My S and BIL have both dealt with all of this by glossing over everything. Family image first, like all is fine. I tried to chat with S at the time of incident about help for DN for her behaviour and suggested maybe the same thing happened to her. This did not go well.

I never thought of contacting DN school as I believed SS would have done that? She does have the incident on her record apparently.

DS will join a different team etc to limit contact. I just couldn't believe how brazen BIL was to promise DS first. Like one poster said, to manipulate me into saying yes.
I was double guessing myself before you posted, so thank you for your help.

I personally do not get the vibe that BIL is an abuser. However, you never really know. I do not know his side of family well either. DN was cared for alot by his parents and siblings when my S and BIL worked.

I do know DN had been exposed to inappropriate content online at a very young age. She also played with older children alot.

You should have reported the assault to the police as 11 is the age of criminal responsibility. Or at least sought advice on what action to take.you cant just brush this under the carpet and pretend it never happened.

So many alarm bells ringing as I read this as a mother.
The buying of a football shirt, the trying to orchestrate time alone, tempting your DS with something it's hard for you to say no to. Also offering it to your son without discussing it with you first.
All sounds very much like grooming and coercion.
There is a reason your niece behaved in a sexualised way at such a young age and you are right to keep your distance.

As an adult survivor of child sexual abuse who was abused by my BIL (siblings are 16,18 & 20 years older than me) go with your gut.

There are many red flags in your post and you are right to place boundaries around BIL's access to your DS.

The NSPCC have a lot of information on their website under 'Keeping Children Safe'.
I would also ensure BIL doesn't have any way of contacting DS privately: via mobile (if DS has one yet) or online.
The football shirt and promises of coaching immediately triggered grooming in my mind. Also the fact he'd spoken with DS before running it past you - again, a disregard of parental consent and the potential to distance DS from you when you say 'No' putting him in the 'cool uncle' role.

Follow your instincts.

Ex child protection manager: red flags everywhere. I'd be worried about why your niece behaves like this...and I think your BIL is grooming y.
Trust your protective instinct. Keep them away from your children.

Say no thanks it doesn't work for us and keep your children away from these people whatever the fall out is

It would happen over my dead body.

This!

Thank you @GenExer. I am so sorry for what you experienced too.

Thank you for your advice, it is a great website. I have tried to teach DS about consent and safe adults as soon as he was old enough to understand etc.

I go back to doubting myself as 'they're family'. I am very much the black sheep now for having boundaries.