To wonder where Margot Robbie's internal organs are.... see Vanity Fair cover

[LoveMyPiano]

This is not an intention to body shame - but I find the cover shot of Margot Robbie on Vanity Fair quite shocking. And unnecessary 😥
I have been just as thin, and was classed as underweight and diagnosed with an eating disorder.
I hope I'm not the only one who wonders what the next level for stars might be, if this is an aspirational "look". And for us regular humans.

There is just so much more to eating disorder than the visual aspect. As @WestwardHo1 has said, menstruation stops, some hair falls out, and yet other fine hair growth develops, teeth become loose and nails weaken and stop growing. Chances of osteoporosis and other degenerative conditions - including mental - are increased. Absorption of vitamins, minerals and even basic nutrients becomes impaired and even impossible.
All of these things can happen whether or NOT the person appears "too thin"; therefore I do not want to categorically say that someone who is thin has an ED - just that I personally was "accused" of it when my ribs showed in the same way as the VF cover.

Whether or not I did, the statement was made based on what they could see, not what was going through my mind.
I thought I was being careful not to do the same thing, and still believe the use of the image for the magazine was unwise 😶

It's the "too thin" comments that pissed people off OP. Well, certainly me. It sounds perjorative and judgemental, even if you say you don't mean it. You mentioned ectomorphs as being a body type - I'm one, and find it impossible to put weight and bulk on. I maybe could if I spent hours in the gym and mainlined protein and carbs for much of the day, but I really don't have the time for that. Based on this thread, you would be highly critical of concerned about my shoulders, arms, ribs and collar bones. Sorry - can't do anything about it. Time and again on MN we see that blank refusal to countenance that any women can be naturally thin, without denying themselves all sorts of nice food and drink, or they have an ED.

Well everyone's too fat too thin too shy too big headed too rich too poor too extroverted or too introverted !
Except men of course- men just are what they are

This photo the other day just shows she’s ‘normal’ looking! Robbie Swaps Her Chanel Couture for the Boudoir Trend Margot Robbie Swaps Her Chanel Couture for the Boudoir Trend

It’s just how she’s standing

And many are underweight
I'm not sure why that can't be discussed and discouraged without saying everyone is jealous and needs to lose weight

How can you possibly know that? Willing to be most are within the average range on the lower end. If you're taller (model, maybe actress), your weight is distributed differently.

The issue at the outset was the use of a photograph that makes a certain emphasis. And I stand by that.
It was never to say that she categorically IS "too thin", or has an eating disorder.
The criticism was of the editorial decision, and the image itself.

And "too thin" has always been like that, in " ">
I cannot judge anyone, as I have been TOLD I was "too thin". And to repeat, that is not - see previous post - actually what I said about the VF cover, which showed a distorted image - in my opinion.

It is perfectly possible to be underweight (naturally, or otherwise) and NOT suffer from an eating disorder of course - but it is also possible to be underweight (or NOT) and actually suffer from an eating disorder.

I was critical of the VF choice. The ribs were a bit too much.
I am generally not concerned about critical of anyone's shoulders, arms, ribs or any other body part. Except my own.

But we are unfortunately in a world where that does happen.
I refer you to the BBC programme I half-watched last might.
Zara McDermott - Disordered Eating.

Didn't you say that woman in the photograph's arms were "too thin"?

Yes. As I said, I only criticise myself.

It's no secret how the acting industry chooses actresses based on their looks and size- why is that such a surprise to anyone? How many actresses have spoken out about being asked to lose weight despite being a perfectly healthy weight?

It's no secret how the acting industry chooses actresses based on their looks and size- why is that such a surprise to anyone?

You don't know if they're 'underweight'

You don't know if they were already that size before, or maybe it's more achievable. Some people gain or lose easier

Sure, what you said does happen. Just fed up of it being used as a stick to beat everyone else. Thin is always unhealthy so it's fine to shame for the greater good, basically

It is becoming impossible to write anything about "thin", "underweight", "slim", "skinny" or words to that effect, with the overuse of the " ", to avoid accusations.

The denial on here is bonkers.

I refer you to the BBC programme I half-watched last might.
Zara McDermott - Disordered Eating.

Do you think you might be a little bit too invested in this sort of thing @LoveMyPiano?

I think the reason that thin people feel defensive is the assumption that you must have an eating disorder, or at least be hyper health conscious. I've never calorie-counted, never restricted, never fasted, and I generally eat what I feel like. I don't think I have ever had a BMI in the "healthy" range, except maybe immediately after giving birth, yet I never felt underweight.

Having done the calculations, my BMI is apparently 14.6 - which sounds fairly horrifying! But it's not something I use to measure my health and I certainly don't look particularly gaunt or bony.

For context, I was diagnosed with AML in March 2020 and lost ca. 9-10 kilos. I've never been able to put it all back on despite being in remission and healthy now. I'd like to get back to my previous weight (although even then I had a lower than healthy BMI - I just have a very narrow, straight up-and-down frame) for bone health and feeling the cold less, and generally I think that's probably my set point where I 'should' be atq. But I've never managed to gain more than half of the lost weight back, unless I have Ensures or huge milkshakes twice a day and layer masses of peanut butter onto toast and have an extra bag of crisps alongside everything (and eventually I get bored and can't be bothered and then my weight just resets to this same level). I probably should be more concerned, but I'm quite happy with being generally healthy!

I don't think I'm making my point particularly well, but although I look skinny, I don't think I look gaunt (I did when I was sick). My face went so thin when I was ill and I looked all shrunken. Now I have my usual face and my body's filled out even though I never managed to regain my usual weight. The other day, I saw my consultant and he said I looked really healthy and well - which I don't think he'd say if I looked tortured and gaunt!

Yet people I know tangentially or through work will assume that I have a bird-like appetite and that I'm a religious dieter and health fanatic... and they don't half comment about it! And you can bet they'd never say to a large person, "I bet you like your food, don't you?"

Ugh, I don't think I'm making sense with what I'm trying to say at all. I work with students, some of whom are vulnerable or have mental health conditions. And sometimes, after I get comments from colleagues (^ as above) I'll worry that my appearance is going to be somehow triggering. But in truth, I don't think it is. (To be honest, I don't think most of them imagine I have a life and have probably barely noticed that I'm female, let alone what I look like 🙃).

No, not at all. I didn't know it was on and hopped through the channels.

HowEVER, having had (still do, truth be told) eating problems - and yet, an interest in nutrition, dietetics, fitness and health and well-being in general [also a mother to a daughter], I found it worth watching even though I had missed the start. More from another interest in how social media is affecting our society.

Very interesting to hear how things are for you. 14.6 seems impossible as a BMI - but as I have said before, BMI was created to use for groups of people, and now even the medical profession is starting to question the worth of it for an individual.

I have said repeatedly that I do NOT think that every person who is "thin" suffers with an eating disorder; equally, not everyone with an eating disorder is "thin". If people in general seem - to you - to make that assumption, I am not one of them.

I personally was told that becuase I was "thin", I must have anorexia, which at that time, I did not - but I DID have issues with food. I still have those issues - and more.

The hardest part was when I started to "gain" weight - from 6.5 stone at the lowest - even 8 stone made me feel "fat". I do remember though, when I was becoming a more "normal" (for my height) 10 stone, I made the mistake of wearing a lime green lambswool polo neck - and one of the lorry drivers on our site, being over-familiar, said "You're getting a bit beefy" (!!!!!) We were in the company restaurant, and I took his cake and pushed it, wrapper and all, into his cup of tea.

So, maybe a one-off, but people DO comment when people are, in their eyes "fat", eating too much, the wrong thing - or at all.

As I said earlier, the stepmother who labelled me anorexic, based on my appearance, a couple of days later, told me I was a pig for eating a dessert. She is also unfortunately married to my father who, although no Adonis, has always expected his wives to meet certain standards - and even me, as his very part-time daughter. Only a few years ago, we went out for lunch (he and I) and he said afterwards, he would not be seen with anyone ugly (!!!!!! - again). Luckily I don't see him very often (that was 2010, and I have only seen him/them once since - by his choice, but thank the Lord - in 2016 when he, and she, once again, criticised my appearance without knowing anything about me at that time).

@Jourdain11 And, I'm so sorry - I should have said that I hope you continue to be in remission, so sorry about your illness x

You said in an earlier quote that you didn't say she was underweight, she just looked 'too thin.'

Now you're throwing around 'probably has an eating disorder' and 'BMI under 18' (in another post).

This isn't logic, or anything to do with MR. It's about your own eating disorder, and that's ok, but it's something for you to work through. It's not about another woman's body parts.

I think it is perfectly OK to question the role of magazine covers like Vanity Fair in contributing to ideas about ideal body shapes, LoveMyPiano. It's a huge deal for famous women to make the front cover of Vogue, Vanity Fair etc. The lighting, photography and styling are all designed to make the image as different as possible from a social realist photographer's depiction of ordinary people sitting at home watching TV. Add a large dollop of photoshopping and the images present an ideal that few women can emulate. Even the accompanying photographs in the article about Babylon are different to the cover.

I admire Margot Robbie a lot. She is a great actor known for the punishing fitness and diet regimes she undergoes when rehearsing for roles like Tonya Harding or Harley Quinn that require a lot of physicality. How Hollywood reflects the diverse reality of women's bodies is a legitimate question, particularly in terms of physical changes like motherhood or ageing. It's not that the image is of a woman who is 'too thin' (it just looks very photoshopped to me), it's how images like that impact on our own sense of self.

I want to finish by saying how hurtful your stepmother's comments about being a 'pig' for trying key lime pie and your father's statement that he wouldn't want to be 'seen out with anyone ugly' are.

Looks like she's just sucking in her tummy or bad airbrushing. Doesn't look good though. If I pull my tummy in I can get that look too with all ribs protruding. I am slim but not underweight or anything and I'd say she is the same.

Where on earth did I say Margot Robbie probably has an eating disorder, or that she - particularly is "too thin", nor did I refer to HER BMI, just that, as is widely known, a BMI of 18 is considered technically "underweight" (and repeat that I do no subscribe to using BMI for the reasons stated).

As I have also said, many times, this is not an attack on Margot Robbie herself - although I assume as major star, she could have vetoed the use of that image, or any digital adjustment.

I have freely admitted seeing it through my own lens of having had an ((imaginary, apparently) eating disorder - but also as I have just said, from the perspective of being a woman in our society - a society that is setting ridiculous "standards" for women and girls, and causing physical and psychological difficulties IN the form of eating disorders, which is one form of self-harm, amongst others.

Personally, I think that those who think it is OK need to have a think about the world they or their daughters are living in and will grow up in.

I absolutely agree with what you are saying 😍

I know she learnt the skating, but she did apparently wear "padding" for the part in I, Tonya. I am not even so much of a movie watcher any more, but have always been aware of the power that they try to exert over us mere mortals. I am not swayed by it and actually do think we can get tired of seeing certain faces - there are at least three MR films out or coming out soon, and I shall not be watching them - apart from maybe Babylon for the reasons I stated above.

And yes, if course - the magazine industry has always been that way - and I very very rarely even buy one nowadays, as they are just full of advertising. I think Vogue has about 50 or more pages of them, before anything worth reading starts!
I just happened to notice it on the Co-op, as it was set out from the rest of the rack, otherwise, I would have walked right past in my own little world, like a dope. I certainly do not browse the shelves, and although I went online and read the article in full, I used the free one to do so; I doubt I shall take out a subscription.

Thank you for noticing what I said about my dear papa and his wife: she in particular is dreadful for it, and has played apart in my difficulties with food. Combined with his narcissism, general dislike of me and massive focus on my (or any woman's) appearance, and it's no wonder I am hyper-focussed on these things 😥
(Fortunately, I do not see them often - and they might think it's their choice - but it is now my decision - although it has taken a lifetime.)

Apart from everything I else I said, it made me think of that special breathing that bodybuilders (I think) do, with which they are trying to improve the muscles in that area, Or even when they do the posing competitions.
It does not seem long ago that airbrushing was not allowed in advertising; it should be outlawed altogether.
Heck, even I can make my ribs look like that, but my face would be beetroot red, and it would not be a good look!