To be annoyed and angry with DH

[Topoftheworldtonight]

on a 2 night trip to London with DH and the kids. Our first day here. We’re still out now. Since it went dark earlier this evening DH has not stopped saying “we need to go back to the hotel”, “it’s too dark”, “it’s not safe” and so on. I’ve told him to stop and he won’t. Aibu to be angry and annoyed with him? We’re on our way back to the hotel now but earlier I had to keep explaining to him for hours that just because it’s dark we don’t have to go straight back to the hotel. He’s been making the same comments for hours and hours since it went dark

That isn’t the argument anyone has been making.

The question of whether it’s okay for a 6 year old to be up late one night, with his parents, when away on holiday is different from the question of whether it’s okay for a parent to allow their anxiety to dictate what everyone else does on holiday.

"They are on holiday. When you are on holiday is your family all tucked up by 8pm or do you let loose a little? The children weren’t sitting in a crack den fgs. They also weren’t dragged from their beds and taken out at 11pm…"

No. We're not tucked up at 8pm 😅 talk about missing the point.

I think both the OP and her husband are unreasonable here tbh

"That isn’t the argument anyone has been making"

It's the second most important thing if we're discounting her husband getting in a flap at 4pm. Which we all are.

Well, the threads are frequently about how their DP really ought to be picking them up instead of them walking 10 minutes, or their boss ought to let them leave early, so…

This.

Oh no, god forbid, sightseeing.

OP I hope you’re saving up now for your kids therapy now because I can already envision the 6 year old in 20 years time describing to a shrink the trauma of having to stand outside Big Ben at 10:37pm on a Friday night.

This level of uptightness is on par with the moist husband.

You are right. The OP is dragging miserable children and an anxious husband round London, she loves it, who wouldn’t? Crying kids in one ear, hyperventilating husband in the other…
Could I point out the OP at before 11pm said they were on their way back to the hotel, not heading in to old Compton street

Why are you discounting that since it’s the one thing the OP posted about?

I would say that claiming the streets are unsafe because it’s dark, in front of children, even at 11 pm is bad parenting and a lot more important than flapping about a bed time.

Where as a one off being out late when you’re on holiday is probably a good experience for a 6 year old, even if they’re a bit cold and tired.

Ha ha ha ha! It’s crazy. I would have thought it was Christmas to be one of those children out with my parents in the evening in London.

Why do you think the OP is unreasonable to be out with her family while on holiday in London at 11 pm?

Without making up anything that the OP hasn’t said, what is the harm in it?

Mumsnet likes to infantilise women using catastrophisation and hyperbole.

Gosh I wonder how he thinks those of us who live in London cope

Why do you think they are not? My siblings and I were often out at that time on holiday. The break from routine was a huge part of the fun and excitement.

I completely agree that it's safe and reasonable to be out after dark in London with kids. But that's irrelevant and not the issue.

It's a communication problem between two parents who disagree on whether something is safe for their children or not. You have been completely dismissive of his opinion and are angry and refusing to listen to him. Would you be OK if he drove in a way that you thought was dangerous, and refused to listen to you and kept on going? Or if he did something else that you genuinely thought was unsafe, and told you to to be quiet and defer to his authority?

Safety in numbers of children?

Presumably we are part of the problem! All either gangsters or vampires.

DS is five. He walks home from school in the dark every day, because at this time of year it is dark when afterschool club finishes. We do live in Brixton though, which many non-Londoners imagine is like living in Attack the Block.

Is he usually anxious about being out after dark at home? I’m guessing maybe where you live is very quiet/rural, and he’s not used to the combo of lots of people, busy streets, etc in the dark? I don’t blame you for not wanting to spend half the trip in the hotel, as there seems little point in going just to do that, but probably a good idea to go for a city break in the summer next time if it’s such an anxiety trigger for him.

What is your point though? You say you think both parents are unreasonable so what actually is your point?

Bizarre as it is, many seem to think walking on their own is riskier than with kids.

I’m not defending the mindset. I’m simply pointing out that the threads where most posters seem to support this fear of the dark are about women being out solo, not walking their kids home from the childminder.

I must be either brave or stupid, as I was in Kentish Town for a gig in November 2019, walked from the hotel to the venue and then back again, in the dark and by myself. Seemed like an okay area and it was mostly residential streets, so I felt perfectly safe. There are areas in my home town where I wouldn't do the same (small market town in Cambridgeshire.)

There is a LOT of hysteria on here about walking at night. Unfortunately there have been tragic deaths of women and many have been at night, I’m not diminishing that in any way. However, I’ve walked countless city streets at night alone and very very rarely have I ever felt vulnerable. That may just be my personality but I also think a lot of people frighten themselves out of perfectly safe situations. The OP’s husband sounds caring but as I said above I completely sympathise with the OP, that attitude would drive me mad.

You aren't going to get knifed in Chicago.
Shot maybe in the wrong place, but very low knife crime.
(Resident of the city)

This shows how daft anxiety is and why you shouldn't pander to it,

I've been going out at night in London all my life. And have taken my kids out late all their lives too. It's an incredibly safe place.

Do the same thing abroad.

If you don't want to be outside after dark, don't do a holiday in Britain in January.

Very true, and Mumsnet loves even more to infantile adult daughters. I guess mummy gets some kind of emotional payoff from that.

Maybe he just feels, as the man, he is responsible for keeping his family safe. So if anything bad were to happen, he would be the one expected to protect his wife and children. In London, where 245k violent crimes occurred last year. I'd be scared too if I didn't know the city well.

These days it gets dark in Lo con around 4:30, certainly by 5. Which means everyone working 9-5 goes home on the dark, the evening rush hour is in the dark. What kind of place does he think London is that you can’t be “out after dark?” It’s almost impossible not to be.