Was I right to report this man?

[Aceofbase00]

It's a community based role, and I was helping a male in his early 70s to get dressed. I know he has full mental capacity and doesn't have Alzheimer's/dementia.
Once when I went to his house there was porn playing on a computer in the background.
Anyway I went yesterday and I saw him fixated on my chest whilst I was getting him ready. It was annoying but I just tried to get him ready as quick as I could.
He was still looking. Then he said, "wow, nice top."
I looked down and saw my button had popped open, revealing my bra. I quickly fastened it and he said, "Oh you don't need to do that, I don't get a lot of excitement at the minute." He kept staring at me.
I felt so embarrassed and wish I had said something to him at the time. I just left pretty much after that as soon as possible, and reported it to my manager who said they'd have a word.
I understand he is lonely, but it wasn't appropriate at all for him to comment like that. What would you have done?

Thanks Frequency, exactly as I thought.

He's early 70's. So around 50 in 2000, to give it some context. Pretty sure this wasn't acceptable then either.

Yes so around 10 in 1960 and around 20 in 1970. So the comment about him growing up in the "Carry On era" as the PP put it.

Doesn't make it acceptable but partly explains why older people often behave in a way that is less appropriate now but was accepted back then. In 2000 when he was around 50 he probably didn't have a carer.

The point you are missing is that he should (and I'm pretty sure does) know that having porn on when someone comes round is not in any way appropriate.

My DF would not do this and is a similar age. Neither would my FIL. Growing up in the 'Carry On era' is not a reasonable excuse.

Exactly this. And as another PP said, it’s often early indicators if escalating behaviour. Testing the boundaries to see if women complain, to see what he might get away with.

I have often seen this in cases of child sex abuse too. “Oops the child has seen porn. Oh well it doesn’t matter if the child sees me watching porn. Oh look, it’s normalised acceptable adult sexual behaviour to the child…”

It is absolutely a tactic of repulsive men.

It is repulsive, indefensible behaviour. Old and ill my arse.

What the fuck has happened to mumsnet? Do we have an influx of MRAs or something. We now are meant to tolerate sexual harassment if a man is old, amazing. The dick pandering on here is getting worse than Reddit.

Yes just cover up OP, so that you’re not asking for it. You can’t go around being all female and then complain when some disgusting creep pervs over you, can you now? 🤮

Its ridiculous! Especially the posters who are insisting op is the harmful one, and of course he's a poor lamb who shouldn't be disturbed from his porn watching!

Plenty of carers let themselves in. Why are you trying to convince anyone that they don’t? They obviously do on a huge number of occasions. No one said she stormed the place like a police raid, just that she could’ve entered when he didn’t realise it was on the screen or he wasn’t expecting her. Carers are often loose with their timings due to the very nature of their work and the delays that can arise

Give over. They might not arrive on the dot but the people they’re caring for know they’ll be walking in at some point. If you had a tradesman working in and out of your house, would you think it was appropriate to stick some porn on because he’d nipped out to B&Q? Of course not. What do you think the chances are that he’d have left porn on if his carer was a 6’ burly bloke? Or if this hypothetical male carer had left his fly undone, do you think he would have been staring? Again, no he wouldn’t. Pretending otherwise is simply excusing him. Men do enough of that for themselves. They don’t need any help from women.

Going into peoples houses as a lone worker is quite a vulnerable position to put yourself in and doing personal care too, to then be faced with someone doing this to you is awful I would have felt uncomfortable and certainly the op has done the right thing by reporting it. We have a right not to be made to feel uncomfortable in our workplace no matter where it is. This man’s behaviour is inappropriate and it is not ops fault. My stepdad is 76 and he would never ever do such a thing, this guy knows what he’s doing so a change in carer but first a chat/warning about appropriate behaviour needs to be had before going on with further care.

How many of you who have minimised or defended this man would want your daughters being subjected to this if they were at work caring for someone? It’s not about being tough or shaking it off as an old man being Ill and not knowing what he’s doing, it’s inappropriate and things should be put in place to protect staff from this behaviour so either a male or 2 carers for him etc

There has been an influx of man-pandering posts. I'm hoping what they experience is akin to a wolf realising that sheep could discover collective action. Don't fuck with us in our own manor.

And...

Yes so around 10 in 1960 and around 20 in 1970. So the comment about him growing up in the "Carry On era" as the PP put it.

I think people forget that 'porn' was grubby mags under the bed in this era. If you mum (or a female HCP) had found them, the correct response was utter embarrassment. He doesn't get it both ways. Either he has 1970s sensibilities, in which case watching porn on a big screen with a carer there would be mortifying. Or he's a creature of the 2020s, all choosy-choose about sex, in which case you can't hand-wave away sexist comments and staring at cleavage like a perv. However, it seems that men's behaviour isn't policed. And we all know where that leads.

My dad had frontal temporal dementia the way that presents in lack of judgment and appropriateness but in all other aspects fine

no filter if he thought something it would come out of his mouth

of his many faults stuff like this wouldn’t of been in his nature but it all changed when his frontal temporal dementia started

a professional carer should have an open mind and deal with it professionally
Definitely report it
is he a perv or is it anything else and take action depending which one it is

once my dad had long stay in hospital most of nursing staff fantastic dealt with him professionally there’s ways and means of handling the situation
1 nurse was vile like most of posters wrote him off as dirty old man treat him with absolute contempt

Watching porn in front of carers doesn't really tally with frontal temporal dementia. That's a deliberate choice rather than a thought that pops out of his mouth.

But regardless of what is causing the behavior it needs to be reported so it can be dealt with and so that any possible cognitive declines or health issues can be investigated.

it was playing when the carer came in
My point would be he would no capacity to see this as inappropriate

but wouldn’t of been a problem for us as we made sure no access to anything like that in the first place

guess this thread touched as nerve as spent years apologising and explaining
mainly because people just made snap judgments instead taking the time to find out

@rwalker but in the circumstances of this thread, the carer hasn't made a snap judgement, it's a known factor this man doesn't have a cognitive impairment.

I'd refuse to return to him. Don't ask, tell them outright that he was sexually harassing you and you will not be caring for him again. If they're short staffed, that isn't your problem. Disgusting lech.

that’s How it starts the person act out of character change of behaviour this could be the onset
report get it dealt with properly

so yes there has been snap judgment because there’s no dementia diagnosis doesn’t mean the diseases started
as with any illness there’s always a start point this could be it

So do you think every single case of sexual harassment or inappropriate behaviour the person who it's happened to should be thinking, 'oh they need a dementia assessment'?

He is a disgusting pervert, his age doesn't excuse his behaviour

I think you did the right thing and shouldn't think anymore about it - it won't affect his standard of care just make other staff helping be more vigilant. Although you do need to know that while he is not classified as having dementia now these sorts of things in terms of behaving socially inappropriately can be one of the first signs. But regardless you need to protect yourself and others - you never know maybe others have reported him too and your work needs to build a picture.

Change of behaviour to cause concern would warrant

my point is find out what your dealing with then take the appropriate action

It needs to be dealt with properly hopefully it should be reported the care company they find the facts And get a plan of action

ether way there should be a course of action

Yes. Seriously.

It's clear no females should be visiting this man in his home unchaperoned. It's about as basic a duty of care as it's possible to exercise to those working under your jurisdiction.

OP, you did absolutely the right thing. Not, in any way, excusable or appropriate.

Oh my god some of the comments on this post are absolutely ridiculous and the defense for this man is absolutely appalling. Putting illnesses aside whether this man was of sound mind or not, OP has made it VERY clear that they were uncomfortable in this situation, and if someone feels harassed/threatened in their work place, again even if the gentleman was of sound mind, they are FULLY ENTITLED to report this.

The argument of 'inappropriate workwear' is bull crap. Maybe if you were wearing massive stilettos (because god bless your feet), and spiky jewellery (which could cause harm to the person you are caring for) I'd say probably not work appropriate as its not practical for the specific job that you are doing, but having a shirt which was probably uniform that had a button pop open is hardly inappropriate. Buttons pop open, it happens. Whether you have large breasts or not, it still happens. Either way, even if you walked in to this situation wearing pasties and panties, if the comment is unwanted then this is still sexual harassment. Consent, I shouldn't have to say more.

And OP was sexually harassed. They can shout it from the rooftops if they want to. This is their story, they can say whatever the hell they want. Her work are going to punish her after this situation? Come on.

The porn, absolutely yes this man can watch porn. Duh. That's obvious and common sense. But the same situation would you feel comfortable even going to your friends house and they were watching porn and didn't turn it off? It's clear that the man made absolutely no effort to turn it off. Most cases of sexual harassment aren't just based on one sole event, and collectively as a whole what make cases and situations. Events leading up to other events. Maybe the porn thing on it's own might not seem bad to some people, but as a collective whole of events, yes it is absolutely relevent and classed as harassment

Yes, as most of the others agree, you are absolutely right to report this incident. This should absolutely never have happened, or ever should happen.

The man has to give his consent to be assessed though. Unless he's significantly unwell/possibly detainable he can't be forced to attend the doctors for this.