Another dog kills. When is something going to be done?

[ofwarren]

AIBU to think that there needs to be a dog licence or at least SOMETHING put in place to try and prevent deaths by these dogs?
I was not at all surprised to read the breed..
"The dog, a large black XL bully cross cane corso breed, was seized by officers and has been destroyed."

metro.co.uk/2022/12/20/woman-dies-after-being-mauled-in-dog-attack-in-her-own-home-17970433/?ito=socialmetrouktwitter

I think any controls would need to be carefully applied to minimise the trade of black market dogs but I'd personally like to see minimum space requirements for dogs (all animals really) so you can't have big breeds in small spaces, restrictions on breeding, and restrictions on where/how you can buy a dog especially a dog that is being rehomed.

I'd never thought of that, but that's actually a really good idea.

Would only work whilst people are being honest when they move house etc though

I think we should neuter a lot more....far far too many unwanted animals and way too many dogs in the wrong hands ....and place heavy fines/bans on unregulated breeders

Bring back dog licences with a mandatory course

Dog wardens patrolling streets watching for poor behaviour . On the spot fines

I have no idea what the answer is, but this is why I get so annoyed with the amount of people who walk their dogs off leads. I know most breeds are much lower risk than the bull breeds but, to me, any animal is a risk for small children especially and should be on leads unless in private land with warnings that dogs are off lead.

There are so many useless dog owners out there. And yes, some who purposely have dangerous dogs - those people should have hefty prison sentencing whether the dog has attacked or not.

I wrote to my MP (Labour) after the last attack was reported in the press.. They told me there was no reason to change the existing laws as they were considered to be robust enough.

If anyone wants to write to their MP they can do it here ; www.writetothem.com/

Dog controls only control the people that comply with them - so it is the responsible owners that end up footing the bills whilst the irresponsible carry on doing what they want to anyway. My parents always had the dog licence - I don't think anyone else within ten miles of us did! But our dog never roamed, was walked, and had a collar on with identification because we cared about the dog.

The only way to have effective dog control is for aggression in dogs to be treated more seriously. My friends dog was attacked by two pure bred corso's being bred, we are pretty sure, for protection / fighting. They "escaped" from the garden they were kept in. After attacking my friends dog they made their way to a local shopping centre where they terrorised shoppers and it took six police in riot gear (yes, seriously!) to get them under control. By the next day they were back with their owners, because they'd "only" attacked a dog.

Utterly depressing.
We were in Town the other day and it was heaving.
A ''Uusal suspect'' had one of those XL Bully types on a lead that was way too long, and the idiot was allowing it to lunge at passersby on it's hind legs.

I crossed the road, but breeds /types like these dogs are ''Idiot magnets''.

The worst types of 'owner' are often drawn to a dog that is perceived to be capable of causing another dog or person harm.

Tougher rules or dog licences won't work, because the sort of people who have these types of dog won't adhere to them any more than they do the current rules now.

While these attacks are very rare, I'd be happy to have dog licences introduced to prevent these things from happening. And I am saying that as a dog owner. .

It would also reduce the amount of animal abuse cases there are as well.

I don't agree with restrictions on the size of dog v size of house, because it's so much more dependent on how much exercise they get and what energy level they are.

I would be happy to see dog licenses introduced, including a DNA sample of the dog kept on file so that owners can then be fined for dog mess. Obviously the fine would have to be high enough to cover the cost of administrating the testing and admin.

And I'd love to see more restrictions on where dogs can be offload. Maybe on all footpaths and bridleways? Not sure, but its certainly a problem where we live.

What is it about these types of dogs who seem to turn on their own owners/families? Is it the genetic disposition of the dog, lack of socialisation or both?

Or bad ownership?! Humans are often not innocent in these attacks.

Some people will always find a way to come to harm or to commit harm.

Remove the dog and they will just find other poor decisions to make to fill the void.

This is so sad . Unfortunately some owners have these dogs as a status symbol and do nothing to train their animals, they think it's funny when their dog goes for someone or another dog (we have a man near us who laughs when he's challenged about his aggressive dog) . It's the mindset of some owners that no amount of rules or licenses will change.

@LolaButt

Being bred or trained to be aggressive can really mess up a dog's brain. A dog that has aggression trained into it are often deeply unhappy animals, which is understandable. Who wants to be grumpy and angry all the time? And the people who breed these animals to be this way are pretty unpleasant too otherwise they wouldn't do it. So they may use abusive methods of getting the dogs to act a certain way. And they qon't be properly socialised in some cases, they will be semi wild.

Both.

Even the most well trained and raised dog has intrinsic traits due to years and years of breeding for those traits. And all of the training and love in the world won't eliminate every dog from snapping.

You should look into the anti-pitbull information online, very enlightening. You hear 'it's the human not the dog!' so often when it just isn't always the case. Even if you purchase a tiny puppy and raise them right there's still a chance of them snapping. They're animals. They operate on instinct some of the time.

I honestly think having one of these dogs (pitbulls, bullys, cane corsos etc.) in your house is like keeping a loaded gun around. Especially with children. I'd like to see possession of a dangerous dog as an automatic flag for social services involvement and it a condition of keeping the children to remove the risk. I know it'll never happen but when you see reports of toddlers and babies being killed again and again by these dogs it's just sickening to think their parents put them in that position.

I’m not sure that space is the answer, I have giant dogs in a semi and they are lazy hounds who sleep 22 hours a day. They don’t have an aggressive bone in their bodies. Maybe controls relevant to the type of dog/the job they were bred for would be more apt

This isn't new - when I was a kid, people were worried about rottweilers and alsatians.

Dog licences in the past have just been a fee which people paid, or didn't, much like a TV licence. Paying a sum of money does nothing to make people more responsible.

A dog licence run like a driving licence (education and a test) would improve matters but is hardly a panacea (look how many people drivers kill per year...)

If we're being honest though, it's not dogs in general, XL Bullies and American Bulldogs are vastly overrepresented in the figures - out of 16 fatal dog attacks in the UK 2020-22, 9 have included those breeds or crosses thereof
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_Kingdom

Those breeds have a nasty tendency to attract the sort of person who wants to intimidate others with their dog's presence. Betty, 86, who wants a companion, does not acquire an XL Bully, she gets a bichon frise.

Breed specific legislation has been really poorly implemented over the last 30 years, and has led to very young puppies and adult dogs alike being put down without having put a paw wrong. Compulsory sterilisation and a temperament test to determine if they should wear a muzzle in public... I could get behind that.

Dogs being off lead has fuck all to do with it either - all the dog attacks this decade involved a dog known to the person (invariably their own dog or a family members) and it usually happens in the house. The only exception this decade was someone killed by their neighbours dogs which escaped - again, it wouldn't have been helped by dogs being on lead in the local park.

That's like saying there's no point in having police though

If it makes people think twice then it improves the situation slightly

Yes me too!!

It used to be a thing

Thank you for the informative responses. I have a small dog, who I could never imagine turning on one of us as he reacts with a lot of licking etc if his teeth graze your arm by accident.

I think it just blows my mind that people deliberately train dogs to be aggressive.

@LolaButt What is it about these types of dogs who seem to turn on their own owners/families? Is it the genetic disposition of the dog, lack of socialisation or both?

Various factors IMO.

Dogs are pack animals, in nature they have a hierachy so humans need to replicate that by making sure the dog knows that you are the pack leader.

The Cane Corso is not banned in UK but it is unsuitable for novice dog owners. If crossed with a BullyXL it can weigh up to 200 lbs.

It is a working dog so it needs to be worked. That means owners taking time out to devise games/training for these dogs to stop them getting bored..
Unfortunately, usually, the type of owners these dogs attract aren't really inclined to engage these activities.

What is it about these types of dogs who seem to turn on their own owners/families? Is it the genetic disposition of the dog, lack of socialisation or both?

The biggest predictor of aggression in dogs is a history of neglect or abuse. It's not just lack of socialisation (though no doubt that was present) it is also a history of being hit or shouted at, threatened, or simply having their boundaries run over time and time again and no one in the home with enough knowledge to recognise the multiple warning signals given out until eventually the dog stops trying to warn anyone because no noe is listening anyway.

Breed traits do exists but when we look at dogs like this one, breed is hard to define. Not only are they a mixed breed, they will be a product of several generations of poorly discipliend breeding across multiple breeds and individuals. Each breeding pair 'selected' for the wrong reasons: resulting in dogs that can have a range of poor or unstable behavioural traits that are less dorectly connected to breed and more directly connected to a generational history of bad breeding choices.

I've had a very bad-tempered rescue border terrier in the family but honestly smaller dogs don't tend to cause enough damage to make the news. I think it's a combination of the type of owner (buys them as a status symbol and then kicks them about), their size and genetics.