Page 11 | Sydney or Edinburgh, to live?

Cathy31 · 2022-12-14T20:52:32+00:00

This will be long. The question is AIBU to want to move to Edinburgh, not Sydney? YANBU - move to Edinburgh YABU - move to Sydney I'm married with 2 DC, 3rd on the way. I'm from the Scottish Highlands, DH from Sydney but with British citizenship. He's lived in the UK his whole adult life. We live in a smallish town in midlands England. It's nice enough, we know some lovely people, DC are settled in a fab school/ nursery, and we have no mortgage. But we have no family nearby, and no old friends here. We're here because of my job, but it's a temporary contract in a very niche sector, which requires regular moves (sometimes to different countries). Since having children, we've decided that it's best for us as a family if I change career. We're both happy for me to be a SAHM for a few years while our children are young. So - we had to decide whether to stay where we are, because life is fine here, or to move, because life could be better elsewhere. We've decided to move. But where should we move to? DH is arguing for Sydney. Reasons: - His mother is there. She has no other family, and has said she'd be glad to help out with childcare. - Health service/ public services generally are well funded, reliable. - DH has some wonderful friends, that he's known for 20+ years. I get on really well with these people too. - THE WEATHER Problems: - Expensive, so we'd both have to work to afford a flat in a decent area. Even now, PT with two DC here, life feels busy, and sometimes overwhelming, so it feels big to have the financial burden. - So far from everyone I know and love. - I'd need a visa for work, which would mean we'd have to move out and live there for a while before I could start looking for work. I'm arguing for Edinburgh. Reasons: - My relationship with my parents isn't great, but DC love them, and my wider family is wonderful, including some lovely cousins for DC. - I'd love DC to grow up speaking Gaelic, playing traditional Scottish music etc etc. It's hard to put the value of this into words, but it's very important, and DH recognises that it's something Sydney can't offer. - We're able to afford a flat, the same size as our current house, in the centre of Edinburgh, on a mortgage small enough that I wouldn't need to work. - Some of our oldest mutual friends live there. Most of our other mutual friends live in Britain, so we'd continue to see them a fair bit. Problems: - It's freezing. We couldn't afford a bigger place than we currently have unless we lived far from the centre, which isn't a problem in a hot climate, but in Edinburgh, it seems important to have living space... - So far from the people DH feels closest to. We feel quite sure that we could have a better life in either Edinburgh or Sydney than we do where we currently live. But which one would be best? Which one will our children be glad they grew up in?

MilkshakesBringAllTheCoosToTheYard · 18/12/2022 22:40

Sceptre86 · 16/12/2022 08:03

Would you really want to live in Leith though? On the one side its up and coming, the other side is fraught with drug problems. Although to be fair many cities will have parts like that. Also if you can afford a flat in Edinburgh with a small mortgage then you can afford a house with a fantastic garden if you were to live outside of the city. For instance East or West Lothian would still be commutable to Edinburgh.

It's a tough one, your dh's mum only has him so I can see why he would be drawn to home, plus better weather but it is expensive to live in Australia.The basics cost more and it would mean you both need to work. It's colder in Scotland in general but not freezing unless it's snowing which it is at the moment. Not come across many kids that speak gaelic though and in general your arguments for wanting to love in Scotland are quite weak, there is obviously more to Scottish culture than wanting to play the bagpipes. They can keep a hold of the Scottish connection wherever you live but you as the Scottish parent would need to facilitate it.

Are the kids old enough to have a say?

The only 'drug problems' Leith is fraught with is where to get hold of a scooby for the Kumbacha. It's vair, vair gentrified these days. Trainspotting was 40 years ago.

Coxspurplepippin · 18/12/2022 22:46

JoanOfAllTrades, that's so funny and so true. I had an old Holden station wagon with no Aircon where the driver's side door wouldn't open so I had to get in the passenger side and skoosh over to the driver's seat. On a 40 degree day, by the time I'd shuffled over the vinyl seats I would be ready to punch somebody!

JoanOfAllTrades · 19/12/2022 01:32

Coxspurplepippin · 18/12/2022 22:46

JoanOfAllTrades, that's so funny and so true. I had an old Holden station wagon with no Aircon where the driver's side door wouldn't open so I had to get in the passenger side and skoosh over to the driver's seat. On a 40 degree day, by the time I'd shuffled over the vinyl seats I would be ready to punch somebody!

Yes, where I live is now in the high 30’s and has been for a few weeks. The weather forecast has it at 39C for Christmas Day! The joys of living in a hot country, hey?

And if I’m really sneaky, I can go east a bit and jump the international dateline for another Christmas Day 😂😂

Morestrangethings · 19/12/2022 01:55

Namechangeforreasons · 17/12/2022 15:31

We are, thank you. It’s been hard but you can make a good life here if you’re determined! I didn’t think anyone would still remember after so long, this time of year brings it back, there’s always a spare seat at the table. And one less present to buy.

Sydney is really expensive, especially the nice areas. But commuting is a pain in any of the cities because for some reason, the Aus government has never really got to grips with rail transport. The east-west (coast to coast freight) railway actually has to change trains because the tracks are different and forget about freight getting through in the floods - the trains can’t run. This was a massive problem earlier this year and again now, for Western Australia as goods can’t be shipped and even post is delayed. And really, any of the cities are expensive, but the eastern side more so as there’s more demand there.

Government jobs where you would work regionally or rurally pay a stipend but then there’s the whole living in such a small place that everyone’s up in your business and also not really seeing new faces because, well, it’s rural. Regional centres are not too bad but then the stipend for inconvenience is a lot less because there’s a lot less inconvenience. So those would be jobs such as nursing, teaching, police, and sometimes even skills like computer software engineering or marine life depending on where you want to live.

There’s no child benefit but there is a means tested benefit called Family Tax Credit, I’m not sure of the cut off but it would be well below $100K and unless you wanted a frugal life, I don’t think that’s enough with children after school fees and such. Water rates are dependent upon the gross rental value of your house, so a nice house, in a nice area, is going to have a bigger GRV than an okay house in a not really desirable area. And a not really desirable area could be one simply because the rail links are poor/nonexistent, the commute is >90 minutes outside of rush hour and just too expensive as fuel prices are through the roof right now and the schools aren’t as good as the ones in the next shire over. Electric and gas are reasonable and food is as cheap or as expensive as you want it to be.

Forget dreams of lying on the beach every weekend, the closer you are to the beach, the more expensive property is and if you don’t live near the beach, you have to drive there and then find parking. Oh, and a space to actually fit your bottom in, but that might just be a me problem lol. Upside, the sea is like a warm bath. If the sharks, jellyfish and alligators don’t get you, depending on where you live. And crocodiles can be a problem in some places. Mozzies will give you massive great blister looking type wounds until you get used to them. Spiders will run from you. Flies, urgh, today I saw 3 flies actually having a threesome and TMI, flies do missionary and doggy style. Keep fly spray outside in the al fresco or they will try to commit suicide in your drink. Always check your drink if you’re outside in the morning enjoying some vitamin D before it gets hot. Unless you’ve covered your drink up. Rats and mice are everywhere too. Get a cat. Snakes have been known to live in peoples cars and gain entrance to the house via the garage. I won’t park my car in the garage for that exact reason. Don’t ever drive over a snake in the road as they can wrap themselves around your exhaust pipe. And call a snake catcher. There’s big fines for killing snakes. Snake proof the garden.

Show quote history

And that’s just the inner west of Sydney. Yep, people are dying like flies in the inner west of Sydney. The wildlife is out to get us. It’s a daily battle. We all carry 12 inch hunting knives with us every where we go, even the bathroom - just like Crocodile Dundee. (He wasn’t called Alligator Dundee for a reason).

Seriously (some people) people, google Dullwich Hill and Arncliffe and look at the map.

marvellousmaple · 19/12/2022 02:37

Namechangeforreasons · 17/12/2022 15:31

We are, thank you. It’s been hard but you can make a good life here if you’re determined! I didn’t think anyone would still remember after so long, this time of year brings it back, there’s always a spare seat at the table. And one less present to buy.

Sydney is really expensive, especially the nice areas. But commuting is a pain in any of the cities because for some reason, the Aus government has never really got to grips with rail transport. The east-west (coast to coast freight) railway actually has to change trains because the tracks are different and forget about freight getting through in the floods - the trains can’t run. This was a massive problem earlier this year and again now, for Western Australia as goods can’t be shipped and even post is delayed. And really, any of the cities are expensive, but the eastern side more so as there’s more demand there.

Government jobs where you would work regionally or rurally pay a stipend but then there’s the whole living in such a small place that everyone’s up in your business and also not really seeing new faces because, well, it’s rural. Regional centres are not too bad but then the stipend for inconvenience is a lot less because there’s a lot less inconvenience. So those would be jobs such as nursing, teaching, police, and sometimes even skills like computer software engineering or marine life depending on where you want to live.

There’s no child benefit but there is a means tested benefit called Family Tax Credit, I’m not sure of the cut off but it would be well below $100K and unless you wanted a frugal life, I don’t think that’s enough with children after school fees and such. Water rates are dependent upon the gross rental value of your house, so a nice house, in a nice area, is going to have a bigger GRV than an okay house in a not really desirable area. And a not really desirable area could be one simply because the rail links are poor/nonexistent, the commute is >90 minutes outside of rush hour and just too expensive as fuel prices are through the roof right now and the schools aren’t as good as the ones in the next shire over. Electric and gas are reasonable and food is as cheap or as expensive as you want it to be.

Forget dreams of lying on the beach every weekend, the closer you are to the beach, the more expensive property is and if you don’t live near the beach, you have to drive there and then find parking. Oh, and a space to actually fit your bottom in, but that might just be a me problem lol. Upside, the sea is like a warm bath. If the sharks, jellyfish and alligators don’t get you, depending on where you live. And crocodiles can be a problem in some places. Mozzies will give you massive great blister looking type wounds until you get used to them. Spiders will run from you. Flies, urgh, today I saw 3 flies actually having a threesome and TMI, flies do missionary and doggy style. Keep fly spray outside in the al fresco or they will try to commit suicide in your drink. Always check your drink if you’re outside in the morning enjoying some vitamin D before it gets hot. Unless you’ve covered your drink up. Rats and mice are everywhere too. Get a cat. Snakes have been known to live in peoples cars and gain entrance to the house via the garage. I won’t park my car in the garage for that exact reason. Don’t ever drive over a snake in the road as they can wrap themselves around your exhaust pipe. And call a snake catcher. There’s big fines for killing snakes. Snake proof the garden.

Show quote history

Do you really truly live in Australia? This sounds like a British version of what they think Australia is.
OP ignore all that.
I have lived in Sydney for 52 years and am yet to see a crocodile or a shark. Yes there are flies and many ways of keeping them away. FLyscreens seem to be an unknown thing in the UK.
Almost everywhere is air conditioned ( shops, theatres, restaurants etc and an awful lot of houses).
Also OP, don't think that a pool is something you can't afford. Every second house has one in many suburbs. In my street everyone has one.
It's like asking Canadian people how they are still alive what with all the moose and bears.
People are very odd in their opinions of AUstralia. Other countries have more vicious animals and nobody mentions it. We don't even have a large predatory mammal. So strange.

OP - I get the feeling your heart lies in Scotland so I'd stay there and visit your MIL for a few weeks a year.

Namechangeforreasons · 19/12/2022 03:34

@Morestrangethings @marvellousmaple

Yes, I really do live somewhere in Aus, but nowhere near Sydney.

It’s strange how I recall shark alerts from earlier this year around the NSW coastline, so I quickly googled and according to an article in The Guardian on 04/05/22, there had been “numerous” shark sightings.

I was referring to flies outside whilst in the garden or al fresco, but maybe I’m the only person who likes sitting outside! Perhaps you are always inside? Who knows!

Of course, Sydney may be a utopia compared to the rest of Australia where there are spiders, I actually saw a little mouse 2 nights ago, but then I don’t live in a cramped urban area, so perhaps “wildlife” are more likely where I live? Who knows!

There have been numerous articles recently about snakes inside houses and one about a snake that dragged a child underwater in the backyard pool. It would appear that you missed those! But then perhaps you are only interested in what happens in Sydney? Where I live, nothing of note really happens, so we get news from all over Australia.

I’m not British, but Australian, brought up in QLD! I would say that it would seem that neither of you have travelled outside of your state very much. Crocodiles are very much a thing, anywhere north of Rockhampton and right around to northern W.A. As are jellyfish. Mosquitoes are too. And spiders are everywhere.

I can only imagine that you are the type of people who only sing the praises of somewhere, not the negative aspects! I don’t know if the OP and family will travel around Australia so best to let her know what is out there, rather than assuming that her worldview is so small as to only encompass Sydney and nowhere else!

I apologise for not saying that housing is more affordable in Sydney than anywhere else. Sydney has no crime. Sydney has no traffic. Sydney has the best weather of anywhere in the world. Sydney has the best public transport system of any city, anywhere in the world. In Sydney, everyone knows everyone else, so everywhere you go, you will be surrounded by friends!

I won’t be replying to anymore posts on this thread as this username because I CBA with keep changing my username! And I definitely won’t be using my “usual” username due to circumstances! I’m sure you all understand! And just an FYI, I moved back to Australia after a particularly nasty turn of events, that if you’ve read the thread, you will know about. Otherwise, I probably would have stayed in the UK quite happily, although I now live in Australia quite happily and none of the things in my post actually bother me. But just as I wouldn’t pretend that UK is all roses and scones, I won’t pretend that Australia is all barbies and pool parties!

Morestrangethings · 19/12/2022 04:21

I didn’t realize you were the poster who left the UK because of what happened to your son. My heart goes out to you.

Morestrangethings · 19/12/2022 08:20

@Namechangeforreasons I should have included your name in my previous post so that you can receive my apology. I’m very sorry. I did not realize that you were the poster who has lost a child. As before, my heart goes out to you.

Nogbreaks · 19/12/2022 08:55

I wouldn’t live in Sydney. The weather and lack of seasons, lack of culture is would get to me, but you could go for a set amount of time?
it’s a very outdoors life is Oz, but they’re weirdly very, very conservative there. I remember being very surprised at the racism and sexism and narrow mindedness because of the reputation Aussies have of being laid back. You also need to REALLY be into sport,
as so your kids, to fit in.

ParkingPermitWoes · 19/12/2022 09:06

Nogbreaks · 19/12/2022 08:55

I wouldn’t live in Sydney. The weather and lack of seasons, lack of culture is would get to me, but you could go for a set amount of time?
it’s a very outdoors life is Oz, but they’re weirdly very, very conservative there. I remember being very surprised at the racism and sexism and narrow mindedness because of the reputation Aussies have of being laid back. You also need to REALLY be into sport,
as so your kids, to fit in.

How long did you live in Sydney and did you have issues with your children and sport? Mine aren't overly sporty (not much sport in school really and no outside of school sports clubs) and they fit in just fine! Personally in actually found the sexism much worse in my job in the city in London than here.

GlorianaCervixia · 19/12/2022 09:25

Nogbreaks · 19/12/2022 08:55

I wouldn’t live in Sydney. The weather and lack of seasons, lack of culture is would get to me, but you could go for a set amount of time?
it’s a very outdoors life is Oz, but they’re weirdly very, very conservative there. I remember being very surprised at the racism and sexism and narrow mindedness because of the reputation Aussies have of being laid back. You also need to REALLY be into sport,
as so your kids, to fit in.

I normally ignore these kinds of posts but it’s pretty ironic to say Australia is racist at the same time as you’re complaining it has “no culture”. It has many thousands of years of culture but actually what you mean is “no white European culture”.

marvellousmaple · 19/12/2022 09:26