To not stop DD playing her French Horn just because it annoys my neighbour

[LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet]

Disclaimer: There was no one more unhappy than me when, last year after DD got to pick an instrument to play at school, she picked the bloody French Horn and not something more reasonable 😂 but sometimes life throws us a child with a penchant for annoying instruments

Anyway. 9yo DD plays French horn. I spend a small fortune keeping her in peripatetic 1-2-1 lessons because she’s good. She’s got a concert in the local cathedral next month and is playing 2 Christmas songs as part of a brass group and one solo. She’s bricking it bless her. We live in an end terrace. Her room is the one at the end side of the end (ie furthest away from neighbours) so she practises in there. 30 minutes after school and then an hour on Saturdays and Sundays. Wouldn’t usually practise so much but this concert means a lot to her and she wants to do well

Anyway she was playing at 1pm today for an hour and the neighbour came banging on the door. Said he’s sick of it, it’s every day and disturbing his lie-in! I said sorry but she’s got a concert to practice for it won’t be forever. He then moaned because when we first moved in we asked him to stop playing his music at full blast (Taylor swift mainly, as if life isn’t hard enough). But he was playing it from 5pm-9pm, in his bedroom which shares a wall with my 5yo! Which he has done again tonight.

it can’t be that loud, it can barely be heard from the far room (DS’s). But WIBU to carry on as normal? It’s not unsociable hours, and it’s only for another 2 weeks.

So the level of noise doesn’t matter, a quiet distant noise is just as annoying as a very loud close noise?

OK then

I’m exploring all those as I’ve already said.

Also will try the draught excluder and blanket idea

Well all those playing music on the Taylor Swift record - how and when do you think they learned to play?

OP don't let you being right or him being 🙄become a nightmare; apologies, a box of chocs or a bottle , inviting him to the concert (probably not his style anyway) would go a long way. Peace✌

No. A practical mute is designed for precisely that. If anything, it will improve her playing as there is more resistance and so when you play without the mute, you find you're much stronger.
If you can spare the cash, I'd recommend Yamaha Silent Brass system. It's brilliant (I'm a horn player). Otherwise, the Dennis Wick practice mutes are also great. Speak to her teacher for recommendations.

I’m not taking him chocolates and inviting him to a concert he’ll think I fancy him 😂

You can't have it both ways @LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet , nothing awful will happen if she only practises at school
You've made your bed with your neighbour , deal with it

Unfortunately you did start the situation by complaining about music before 9pm ... it's perfectly reasonable to be playing Taylor swift (we love a bit of Taylor swift in our house!) up to 9pm.

The hours are reasonable if correct but I would look into a mute. We are very conscious of my dd disturbing the neighbours, she's probably louder than a French horn we keep practices in short bursts (she's an adult studying professionally)

Not brave enough to actually say it, though.
Yep, elephant still here.

Really?
All right 👀

Plot twist!

I didn’t realise that he had shouted at you on your doorstep. That’s not on.

In which case, I’d like to amend my post to say that you should address the fact that he shouted at you when you speak to him to explain that isn’t on (I confronted a neighbour who did this to me once by calmly and politely scolding him like a school child, which strangely was quite effective), but that you ultimately want good neighbourly relations.

Explain to him that you’ve deliberately put her in the room furthest from his home, etc. I am sure there is a lot of detail that you’ve written on here that he isn’t privy to. You need to use his T-Swift love and your DD’s French horn love as common ground - a mutual love of music - and work together from there.

Unless you’ve just come on here to vent?

But the French horn is really, really loud. Unless you live in a semi detached mansion it's going to be pretty loud for him regardless of where she is.

So the level of noise doesn’t matter, a quiet distant noise is just as annoying as a very loud close noise?

A French horn played in next doors terraced house is never going to be "quiet and distant" for starters.

But yes, both are equally annoying and equally disruptive to me 🤷🏻‍♀️ that doesn't mean I'd complain about either, but let's not pretend that a 9yo playing a loud brass instrument isn't loud and irritating 🤣

Yes. It started off sounding kind of reasonable, but just got more entitled and horrible.

LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet

You either come up with a compromise (your neighbour has already done this) or you put up with his noise.

As has been suggested try sound proofing the room that your DD practices in.

Just FYI The horn players that I know find places away from everybody else for practice purposes.

YABU

When the neighbour's noise was inconsiderate for your family's needs you asked him to stop. He did and has continued to be considerate going forward.

When your noise was inconsiderate for your neighbour's needs he asked you to stop. You didn't and are continuing to refuse to be considerate going forward.

What the noise is is irrelevant, its the fact that he changed his behaviour and you won't that makes you the unreasonable one.

Your DD can practice at school, yes it's more inconvenience for you but, as you keep saying, it's only for a couple of weeks that she has to practice so much.

Your DD can adjust her practice hours, I would go round to the neighbour and say "DD needs to practice an hour a day, she will practice at school Mon/Wed/Fri; Tues/Thursday it will be an hour at some point between 5-7 and at weekends it will be an hour between 1-4. The hour a day is non negotiable but the timings are, please let me know if there any times you would particularly prefer us to avoid and we will do our best to accommodate." Giving the neighbour a heads up means they can prepare for the noise, even adjust their schedule so they can be doing noisy tasks or be out of the house on errands during the practice time as they know when to expect them rather than their quiet enjoyment being rudely interrupted by the noise of the practice at random times.

Well you’ve got two options, ignore your neighbour’s complaint or change something to make him happier.

Personally I think you’d be mad to ignore it, living next to a neighbour who hates you is not fun.

I’d apologise for disturbing his sleep, explain that she needs to practice for x hours a week and ask what times of day work best for him.

I'm genuinely surprised by a lot of the responses here. I don't think it's unreasonable at all to practice an instrument (he should be grateful it's not the violin) even if you live in a terraced house. It's part of life. Try what you can feasibly do to reduce noise transference but don't worry about it too much. It sounds like she's practising at reasonable times. I think there's a big difference between 1pm and 9pm unless he's a shift worker. By the way your daughter should be practising for at least 30 mins per day even after the concert - twice a week is not enough to make major improvements. He might start appreciating it when she gets better.

You're perfectly fine! The French Horn is already a difficult instrument as it is - that should be the extent of DD's worries - and that's incredible that she already wants to practice every day! As far as noise goes, changing instruments won't change the amount of noise, and only having DD play softly will harm her playing greatly in the future. I see that people are recommending mutes, and they are a good thing to have - if DD continues with the French Horn (and I hope she does!) -she'll need the mutes anyway. However, the goal of a mute is to change the sound of the instrument, not just make it softer. So DD will need to play just as loudly and softly no matter if it's muted or not. Practice mutes are good for noise reduction though, as that is their primary goal, but I wouldn't recommend her playing with one in all the time because that will mess with her head when she needs to play without it.
Tl;dr: Your neighbor is complaining about something that's not worth being an issue. She should continue to practice every day and as she builds up experience, she should practice for a longer period. Worst comes to worst, you could always ask if she could practice somewhere in the church, in a community center, or with a friend that also plays an instrument!
Best of luck with your AH neighbor though, maybe he should see if he can rent another bubble to live in!

I never said that. I think you need to find somewhere else for her to practice. You asked him to pipe down with his music, he did. He has told you your daughter's playing disturbs him, so now you need to pipe down.

Even if it were a professional concert pianist I wouldn't want to hear it every day. A small child learning a loud annoying instrument would be appalling.

Have read all of your posts @LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet and YANBU. It’s an hour a day at a reasonable time. I genuinely don’t know how anyone can say that’s unreasonable? If he was a shift worker or something then he could ask you if she could practice at a different time. But it’s unreasonable to think she shouldn’t.

It's a fine time to practice and I view musical instrument practice differently to recorded music blasting out, because the one is mastering a skill and educational , and the other is just antisocial. BUT, to him it might be very irritating and not see the difference.

Get a mute for her instrument and get her to play in the part of the house which is furthest away from his, with the windows shut and curtains drawn. Perhaps ask him what times would be most convenient. Does he work late nights or shifts in the week? Or is he just up gaming or drinking until 4am? This does make a difference in my opinion but again might not in his.

I say all this not because I think he has a right to dictate but because he might never stop playing his fecking music (and might play it later or louder) if you don't meet him 3/4 of the way to what he wants and this would disrupt you and your children massively.

Is there somewhere else that she can go to practice, such as a Grandparent's house, or before or after school in the music room? She'll feel less stressed and will gain more from the practice if she is relaxed while doing it.

No... it's 9pm in a room with a party wall with a 5yos bedroom vs 1pm in a room on the other side of the house to his

Oh come on, either way it's unwelcome noise. It's petty for the OP to say 'but it's not the same'.

OP, I'm just glad I don't live next door to either of you (in fact, this is one reason we sacrificed on location to buy a detached house). You are BOTH being unreasonable as you are both making unwelcome noise. Sure, technically he can do nothing about it, and no doubt your daughter will carry on making that noise. He does have a right to dislike it though - I would!