to not move to care for elderly parent

[JusteanBiscuits]

My Mum is aging, and the last few months have shown that, while she doesn't need actual care, her needs are increasing and she needs a lot more support in her life. She is in her late eighties, and the issues are both physical and her mind. My Dad died 20 years ago so she is alone.

I live 2 hours away. I have a sister that also lives 2 hours away in opposite direction to me, and a brother who lives locally. My brother helps out, but isn't able to be particularly supportive, and constantly complains about the support he does offer.

I am closest of them all to Mum, and Mum is very strongly hinting that she wants me to move locally so I can help her out more.

My husband works from home, but rule is he has to live within 2 hours of his office in central London as he has to provide in person fixes a couple of times a month. He wouldn't be able to get to central London within 2 hours so his only option would be to leave a job he really loves and bee in for ten years. His skills are quite specialised, so he wouldn't be able to really find a job that pays similar or offers the same work/life balance as he currently has. He is in his late 50's, he really doesn't want to move jobs and really really doesn't want to retrain.
I also work from home, but can work from anywhere. I have to be in London once every 2 months is all. I do have a small voluntary role that I love but would have to leave as it's not a remote sort of thing. I would also be leaving some lovely, close friends behind.

We have teenagers at high school. They're currently at an excellent school they love. Moving would mean attending a frankly shockingly awful school which is currently in special measures (and has been for 3 years). There is only one high school in the area. Only other option is to somehow find the money to send them to private school.

So, the only option that is worth considering is me moving alone and leaving husband and boys behind. I would have to rent somewhere to live, and while property is much cheaper than where we are now, it would still be very difficult to run two households.

It seems an easy "no, I can't do that". But I am getting increasing pressure from family to step up and do my thing. And it is my fault I moved 2 hours away.

Has anyone done something similar and have it work out?

most importantly do not hold their value

@FinallyHere I have been trying to post constructively outlining my experience. I assume OP ants options to consider, even if she goes on to reject them. Inevitably there are the MN naysayers who know better. I have explained upthread why the additional service charges in my mother's very sheltered housing proved very good value indeed. Far cheaper than a care home. And far better than me giving up my life to provide night time care.

Amazingly my mums flat rose in value by 50% during the eight years she lived there. We then priced it low and sold it quickly.

I fully appreciate others will have different experiences, but this does not mean my experience is any less valid.

She can't afford to move near the OP.
Yes helping adult children out does cause elderly people to be poorer. It is pretty much expected though.

That is not what a care home provides. All those things can be bought in more cheaply from elsewhere e.g. meals on wheels delivery. As I said sheltered private housing is good if you need more company. If you don't it is an expensive option.

@antelopevalley exactly, it’s a consequence. No one made her do that, she chose to do it and it’s not now OP’s job to resolve. It’s actually more the sisters

I am not sure why you feel the need to deny me my experience.

Like OP I lived a long way away. Sheltered housing was brilliant for me. My mother had dementia so to keep her at home I would either have had to get 24 hour live in care, or to give up my life and be there myself.

Otherwise who checks that the agency staff turn up. Who checks that the meals on wheels turns up. Who does the laundry.

You are presumably a lot more saintly than me. As far as I was concerned, having the warden, reception, restaurant, laundry, cleaner, gardener etc on site was absolutely wonderful. Way cheaper than a care home, and way cheaper than the alternative if my time were also costed in.

I think finding a place in a council/charity run warden assisted sheltered accommodation is rarer than hens teeth these days. What is generally available are the type where service charges are high and yes, probably don't really hold their value and can be tricky to sell on in certain parts of the UK. However, what is the alternative? My parents view was that yes, they will probably lose money but they were basically paying for peace of mind and to not to be a burden on their family.

The social care crisis in this country is very real. I wonder if people who haven't experienced it recently realise just how dire it is? It's easy to say things like "get carers in when they need it" etc. There is a national shortage of carers who are willing to do home visits in this country at the moment due to the cost of petrol. Many have left to work in care/nursing homes or supermarkets. Trying to find reliable carers that your parents get to know and trust is very very hard, almost impossible. The reality is that you often have someone new coming every week. Plus, it really does need someone on the ground, so to speak, managing it. This is why you really need to get your brother and other local relatives on board now and go through future scenarios and what it is everyone is willing to do to manage the situations that will inevitably arise. Get to know the care agencies in the area, get recommendations. Reassure your brother that it won't be all down to him and that you will all pitch in as much as you can. As the 'person on the ground' I can assure you there is a lot of hidden work that goes on caring for elderly parents. Lots of little things that don't seem like much but take up time. Going round and changing the clocks, dealing with phone calls from cleaners worried the door isn't being answered and rushing round and finding MIL has gone to the hairdressers. Popping round to change a light bulb. Nevermind all the appointments, helping her understand letters, finding keys that have been misplaced. It all really adds up.

I honestly think a lot more needs to go into creating affordable sheltered type accommodation for the elderly in this country. It's a ticking time bomb. I also think we all need to take personal responsibility for getting older and put plans in place to deal with that a lot sooner, as far as each individual is able to do so.

Good luck OP!

If anyone should feel in any way obliged to uproot their life, it should be the one who was financially supported - but even then, if the decision was made in possession of full faculties, then it shouldn’t really be used as ‘golden handcuffs’
Also, that the ‘nearby’ sibling ‘has no choice’ - of course they do.

Sorry, catching up after a series of hectic meetings!

I live in London, so no, anything local for her isn't an option, and I know she wouldn't be happy up here at all.

Her sister with Alzheimers is still at home with her husband. Her children help once a week, and she goes to my Mums for half a day a week. She also has a sister in law in a care home nearby she visits, and an aunt in a different home nearby that she also visits. She has visits from cousins too.

Me and brother have lasting power of attorney. I speak to her every day for at least an hour.

But this has led me to have a really good, useful chat with my brother, and we're very much on the same page (we're very close and can be very honest with each other). Involving other sister would honestly be more hassle than it is worth. I obviously don't want to go into too many details. But we're happier planning around sister than trying to get her to stick to any arrangements.

Lots of very useful interim ideas and help in here. And sometimes it really helps to just talk things out when you're feeling so stressed about something.

This is really difficult. I am your brother in the situation - the bulk of care for my parents is falling to me because I live nearest, with my siblings saying that cannot move/cannot spare time/etc. It's frustrating (and exhausting and expensive!) to be the default carer.
Could you stay with your mum every second weekend, with your sister doing the same, leaving your brother to pop in a couple of times during the week?
Arrange supermarket shopping to be delivered, pre-book taxis for appointments, video calls between you daily.

This post ignores that it is currently the brother doing everything. Of course he wants the OP and sister to do their fair share. It is incredibly hard to care for an elderly parent and even simple tasks take half a day. There is no casual popping in. I wonder what posters would say if Op as the woman was currently doing all the car and her brother refused to move closer to help. I suspect that that would also look like mysogony so clearly the brother cannot win. He is no doubt very respectful of the set up there has left him with all of the caring responsibilities and the OP thanking him by judging him for doing and it and complaining. So not only is he expected to do it but he is expected to have a smile on his face and be happy to provide care. It sounds like he.is the one being placed in the unfair position.

Then you need to completely dismiss the idea of you uprooting your whole family. They get very selfish, a lot of parents, as they age and refuse to budge. I would tell your mum she has two choices - move into assisted living where she is or get carers organised.

Pharmacies will often offer dosette boxes; our local one did ours for our elderly relative but did whine a bit about it; a quick Google suggests this online pharmacy does them if there's 4 or more prescriptions. www.simpleonlinepharmacy.co.uk/medications/dosette-box/

Can you put in an online supermarket order for her and have it delivered? This does rely on her being able to write a shopping list (ours wasn't for the last few years) but it should help for now.

For appointments, some will come to her (Specsavers have a service, plus things like mobile hairdressers), while for hospital appointments, the patient transport 'ambulance' will be more appropriate.

Finally, for cleaning - she needs to start paying someone. I'm sure some of her local friends have a cleaner they can recommend. Ideally someone independent rather than an agency. Ours was fantastic and (having been with us for 25 years in the end) basically ended up doing a lot that fell well outside the original remit of cleaning, but not personal care. Most importantly, she always phoned us if she spotted something amiss.

I imagine that at some point she will complain about the cost of a cleaner; at that point I'd be pointing out that your time has value too, as does your petrol.

The hardest thing to replicate outside of the family can be someone coming in and identifying the problems the elderly person doesn't spot, or doesn't want to bother anyone else with. If the problem is clearly identified there's usually a reasonable solution to it that doesn't involve you doing a 4 hour round trip.

Honestly - outsource as much of the routine work as you can, and save yourself for the important things, the emergencies, and being a daughter not a drudge.

And a couple more comments, sorry.

She has a gynae problem that, understandably, she would prefer me at than my brother!
She's also surprisingly good with technology for her age (we're a family of tech nerds, so she had no choice!). She has alexa in both rooms (total game changer btw. Not only can she talk to it easily, set reminders, play radio etc etc, if she falls she can just call out for Alexa to phone whoever. We made sure she can be heard by Alexa where ever she is in her flat).

We think sheltered would be good as she is isolating and this is making her sad. The organised social things would be a huge benefit. We're not worried about it being hard to sell, or value not rising as, if she is no longer living there she will either be in a home, or have died. She's not going to be bothered by it.

She has lots of cousins and stuff popping in, but she is the last left of her long term group of friends which is really affecting her. 3 of her friends have died over the last 2 years which has been a very hard time for anyone.

My immediate short term plan is Ocado, Pharmacist and seeing if there are any local befriending type things where someone could pop in, do a bit of shopping, but generally be some company for her.

I forgot to add that sometimes you need to let them feel a bit of discomfort before they'll be willing to compromise.

Being at their beck and call frequently encourages a sense of learned helplessness and a willingness to keep you at their beck and call.

Restricting your help where there are viable alternatives, including sheltered accommodation, is often a case of being cruel to be kind.

@JusteanBiscuits try family contacts for befriending. ILs had a friends daughter coming in 2 or 3 times a week on a paid basis and she did a bit of cleaning, shopping, little errands etc. It worked for them as it was someone familiar and it worked for her as she could fit it around school hours. She had primary age DC that ILs liked to see (aka spoil with sweets) in the school holidays as well. But it does depend on personalities to work.

People who don't live in the same town cannot "do their fair share" by "popping in" - obviously the brother who lives locally can't be expected to do it all which is why I said it should be bought in. I just meant that no male offspring who lived and worked elsewhere would ever be put under this kind of pressure to actually give up everything and come and live nearby to become an unpaid carer. I am not surprised the brother doesn't want to do it all but that doesn't mean that the non-nearby siblings need to move back, it means that paid carers need to do more. No one gets to command their offspring to give up their lives and freedom to come and be a nursemaid, the mum can "prefer" that her gynecological assistance is provided by a daughter but she has no right to demand or require it.

seeing if there are any local befriending type things where someone could pop in,

@JusteanBiscuits

They didn't run errands, but my mum's church had a 'shut in' visiting program where parishioners volunteered to visit people who couldn't get out much. Mum started as a visitor but ended up as someone being visited. They drop by once a week and just have a chat for an hour or so.

When she started needing a bit more help & socialization we hired a 'home companion' (I'm in the US so no social safety net here) who came in for 4 hours weekly, ran her laundry or other small chores that could be done while socializing, and then they fixed lunch 'together' (sandwiches, soup, simple things) and had lunch and looked at picture albums, watched telly whatever Mum wanted.

Maybe there's a similar service in the UK?

My late mum was in a similar situation - widowed, last of a group of friends and becoming very isolated. She moved into sheltered housing near me and it was lovely to see her spark return and her last few months were much more enjoyable for her as she had so much more social contact.

If you haven't already found it the elderly parents thread on mumsnet is a really useful source of advice/guidance.

I'm really pleased that you and DB are aligned on this. It's isolating being the main carer, but you two are obviously able to share the responsibility while respecting each others' personal circumstances.

Could you draw up a plan and then maybe send DSis a note to say her third will cost £x per month? Or that you've pencilled her in to call Mum every Thursday afternoon? Nothing too onerous, or hat will cause chaos if she forgets. This will help you both feel as though DSis has some accountability.

Make sure you buy in as much as you can. You and DB deserve as much comfort and family time as you are trying to provide for your Mum.

I’ve done similar. Kind of. I moved in with mum. I lived with her for the final year of her life. The difference was that I took my kids with me nit they were pre school age.

I haven’t read all 13 pages of the thread. Being brutal, I knew she didn’t have all that much longer, and I wanted to avoid her being moved to a hospice, which would have broken her. I don’t regret it for a second. But we were quite close and I was the only daughter. My brothers were close to her also, but it, understandably, was me that she wanted to help her in and out of the bath etc.

Have you considered carers going in once or twice a day and seeing if there are any day centres where she can meet other people her age and potentially have a lunch there.

If she doesnt have the funds then the council will fund care in her own home which would lift the jobs your brother does a bit.

Adult social care can assess her needs and offer you and your siblings support.

Has she been diagnosed with dementia? Have you got LPA's in place as these are important.

Op I'm very far away from my mum and although I plan to relocate closer to her, not for a while.
I have done the following in the mean time, some may be a good idea for now :

• got passwords for all of her accounts so I can keep an eye on utilities, remind her when meter readings, car insurance are due etc
• set up grocery accounts in her name and although she still likes to go to she shops I get a monthly delivery of store cupboard and freezer essentials - cans of soup, long life milk, frozen peas etc. this way if she's ever unwell I know she won't need to worry about getting to the shops.
• helped her set up repeat prescription delivery via online pharmacy
• regular check ins on set days so if she doesn't pick up or message back I know to worry !

It's good that your mum is tech savvy and currently able to do things, but being brutally honest, the decline comes on quick ,and you're caught out, I'm trying to pre empt your needs because I had this and it was a bit of a case of burying my head in the sand, then when reality bit it was awful. There is a pp on here who said what I meant,in that one of her relatives buried her head in the sand the other organised her life. Needless to say the one that had aforethought had the better later life.

Not denying your experience. I just know service charges are eyewatering.

The council will not fund care in her own home. They might subsidise it if she is lucky. But nearly everyone pays something.