To think a man has no place at a breastfeeding support group

[Was1anddone]

Went to a local breastfeeding group today ran by the local council and was surprised to see a boyfriend/husband in tow.

I had visited because I had a latching problem that needed the consultant’s hands on support, like many women do. I happily feed in front of male strangers and family members when baby is hungry, but this is not as ‘intimate’ as coming to a clinic where the lactation consultant may need women to expose their breasts, manoeuvre babies and do compressions.

I expressed my suspense to the consultant who wasn’t very happy to see him there and asked if I needed to go somewhere more private. So I spent my breastfeeding support session in between two bookshelves in a children’s centre, which wasn’t what I had in mind.

i’m going to check with the council for clarification but but AIBU to think this should be women only? Nothing about it was appropriate at all, and he was very much ‘watching’ all of us.

there are plenty of things men can do to be equal parents and be involved in the process. If he wanted consultant level advice on how to support his partner with feeding- he could have arranged a £20 zoom session. Why can’t we just have a bloody breastfeeding session?

yes the woman may be ND or have anxiety (didn’t get those vibes from her at all though- presented as NT and very chatty and personable but I understand needs can be hidden or masked) but surely a female chaperone or friend would be more appropriate? And if she didn’t have this the council should offer something more suitable? Our dignity shouldn’t be second to her requirements, if this was the case.

my breastfeeding problem needs lots of compressions and swapping sides so my support was greatly hindered by him being there having a laugh and a cuppa. I’m so pissed off :(

@MumOnAMountain
I find your perspective very strange. A man wanting to support his wife is not creepy. And no it isn't bollocks. I went to these groups 2/3 times a week in a variety of locations with 2 DC and there were often men present. And yes it did "depend on the age of the baby" because a man supporting his still haemorrhaging wife and 2 day old baby is a very different scenario from a man attending with an older baby.

Just to add that I went to many of these groups and from what I can remember none of them were for woman only
Same.

Yes, men do "stare", don't they!

All the best to keep them out of women's spaces where women are learning to breastfeed or are in need of help and advice with breastfeeding. Please. No men necessary.

@MumOnAMountain
My husband or any of the men I know certainly wouldn't stare at another woman breast feeding her baby.

So you can't accept that most women want women's support groups, to be strictly for women only. E.g. breastfeeding services. Women are the only humans who can breastfeed, but still, you insist on including your men in women's breastfeeding groups.... Why?!

Then you are either naive or a liar.

Even if your husband being their prevents other struggling mums from returning to seek help because their uncomfortable? Why are your struggles greater? Alot of women in group have pnd & anxiety, alot of these women have major anxiety feeding in front of strangers. Feeding in front of other breast feeding mothers is hard for them, why then add to their anxiety by insisting your husband, a strange man to them, stay with you? What if your husband being there prevents 5 other struggling mums from returning and derails their breastfeeding journey because you overstepped their boundaries believing your needs are more important.

The lady with the husband was entitled to the same level of help so long as her presence doesn't disrupt other members of group. Why should her needs or wants come above others? I would of told the husband to leave, if the wife wasn't pleased with that she is more than welcome to arrange a private session with a support member for her and her husband. Her struggles are not more important than everyone else's. You use the term entitled which I think hits the nail on the head, both you and this woman come across as very entitled indeed.

@MumOnAMountain
Where are you getting your information from. At the groups I went to no one particularly seemed to mind the men being there.
Personally I agree that on the whole they should be female only spaces but clearly this is with expectations of when the mother needs significant support from her male partner

@m

@MumOnAMountain
Amongst everyone I know breastfeeding is very normal. No one stares or gets sexual gratification from the experience. Usually there isn't much to see anyway.

I got my information from being a new breastfeeding mother myself and being in a space where "breastfeeding help" got cluttered up with staring men, and a management that was too feeble and crap to ask the men to wait outside.

@MumOnAMountain
I'm sorry you had that to experience but that doesn't mean that all men are creepy and wanting to stare at woman breastfeeding

I think it depends on the space and group set up.
I've been to some bf groups in busy cafes in the middle of shopping centres and supermarkets. Dad's have definitely attended there before usually in cases where mum is really struggling either anxiety wise or recovery wise. Usually they get their partner settled speak to the consultant then grab a coffee and leave the mum to chat once more comfortable.

But I've also been to groups in private spaces where soul focus is women only.

So I think it depends on what type of group it is to if husbands should be allowed to attend.

My husband definitely helped me with positioning especially rugby hold when bf so this concept that men cant help at all is a bit outdated.

Thanks, But why are there men insisting on being in women's breastfeeding support groups?

Men can't contribute anything to women's experience and reality of breastfeeding. It would be better if those men learned how to support the mother - providing nutritious food and drink, for example, and keeping the house clean; and properly looking after any other children, if applicable.

I didn't ask about your birth because I don't need to, it's very simple really group sessions include multiple women, all with their own struggles. You were not the only struggling mother at that group and incase nobody told you this before you aren't the first to have had a difficult birth, my first was 38 hour labour, my dc had no heart beat and was revived, I bloody heamoraged on the operating table, had an unknown infection of my uterus due to going more than 24 hours with no amniotic fluid which spike white blood cells that thinned my blood causing uncontrolled bleeding needing transfusion, I had tachycardia and sepsis, remained in hospital for two weeks after birth, was readmitted after 3 days when incision burst open, found a fucking blood clot, and then had a secondary post partum heamorage requiring another hospital stay with transfusion.... still didnt drag my partner to group sessions though. I've heard millions of horror stories and have come to conclude that no one has had it worse than another, birth is fucking hard on everyone, you having a hard time in birth does not mean you get a pass to make others feel uncomfortable. Your husband being their could of prevented other struggling women from returning for help because they were embarrassed in front of your husband. You could of derailed multiply breastfeeding journeys because you believed you were more entitled.

Saying you empathise is not the same as actually putting your self in others shoes and leaving your husband at home for the sake of ensuring others at the group were comfortable, especially as you yourself admit you know what it feels like to not feel comfortable feeding in front of people.

A lot of women really can't access that service, if you insist on bringing your husband along, and bring him in, to stare at women.

Women's services mean just that - women's services, just that. No men.

You may need your man to come with you because you have a disability. That's understandable. But that man, he then stands outside of the space where women are seeking breastfeeding advice. He does not interfere.

So someone with mental health problems who needs their partner there is entitled? What if I had a physical disability that meant I needed my partner there, would you still think I was being entitled?

I think you need to grow up and see the bigger picture. Its unfortunate that a male makes the OP (and potentially others) feel uncomfortable. However unless there is an actual rule of 'no men' (which I suspect their isn't as the class leader would have asked him to leave) the lady who took her husband along was doing nothing wrong and was perfectly well within her rights to do so (she wasn't being entitled!). So yes OP is being unreasonable.

On another note partners should be there to support their wifes/girlfriends with breastfeeding. If you knew anything about it all you would know that support at home makes a women much more likely to succeed in the breastfeeding journey. So sorry but your clearly in the wrong

This entirely.

If he was not lactating, he should not be there! Dropping off is fine, assisting someone who is not able bodied is fine but it doesn't sound like this was the case either.

Fwiw, I'm in the same position as you @Was1anddone with the level of extra support I've needed from a lactation consultant (our BF journeys sound very similar) and I would feel the same. I also asked my DH about this scenario and he said "What a weirdo! He should have stayed in the car, taken himself off to the car or just waited outside."

Massive CF eating the biscuits for the breastfeeding mums too!

Is there any way to provide feedback directly to the consultant to say how this has made you feel?

@ebri91 This woman could have had MH issues which required her husband to be there but surely either he or she should have made sure her partner wasn't in the way of it all?

I'd go as far to say a big proportion those with feeding issues end up experiencing MH issues though and the majority of those do not bring their partners along.

This is my second breastfeeding journey and at no point do I remember my husband needing to know how to latch my baby on or how to do breast compressions?! The last thing you need is your partner telling you how to do something and think they know best when they can't do it themselves - imagine 2am him telling her she got the latch wrong!? Support is getting snacks, a drink, pillow, doing housework to pick up some slack and childcare. Not staring at women with their boobs out whilst depriving those women of the snacks meant for them!

It has been confirmed it was a group for women.

For those who can’t seem to fathom why some women aren’t comfortable having men there… maybe consider this question:

Would you feel as equally comfortable getting changed in front of your dad as you would getting changed in front of your mum?

Why not? He’s not perving on you!

Anyone who can't attend the class without their male partner should arrange for private instruction.

Allowing him to attend was a failure on the part of the teacher.

"Its unfortunate that a male makes the OP (and potentially others) feel uncomfortable"

Plenty of people had no problem with making people uncomfortable by not wearing a mask for example during the pandemic and still don't when cev people are around. In that case people's health is at risk than than their feelings. This ok because we can't live in fear and mental health is important!

Perhaps the males partner mental health is important. Lots of people realised that most people put them and theirs first so are less likely to be kind and considerate to others

Perfectly said!

Met loads of women with mental health issues/anxiety and disabilities at group. Being disabled does not mean they're automatically confortable breastfeeding in front of lots of strangers, disable mothers can also be self conscious too & not want other people's husbands/partners present, I'm not sure why think it's just an able-bodied issue...
Alot of women struggling to feed their babies have poor mental health and anxiety as a result of that struggle or for many other reasons. The main objective of these group sessions is help as many women as possible. Alot of these women are extremely self conscious and its not uncommon to have women break down in tears in frustration. Our group is a safe place for these women to speak openly to other women with similar experience. We offer hands on help with latching and positioning when needed. Alot of women become uncomfortable when they feel exposed. I can think of at least four mums from group that I know without any doubt would not return if husbands/partners/family members/friends were present so why then should one woman be allowed to bring along her husband if it means four others in need of help will no longer feel comfortable attending and either struggle alone or give up breastfeeding altogether. All women are entitled to the same level of care and in an enviroment that the majority feel comfortable in. In group sessions the needs of the entire group have to be considered and majority rules. If someone wants or needs a different set up with additional support from their partners or family member or friend they can arrange for a private session. Group isn't for everyone, but it works well for the majority when everyones boundaries are respected.

As for your "other note" I agree support at home is great, but why do you need to take that support to the group sessions with you? What exactly do these partners do at group that makes their presence vital? Surely your partner works or at least doesn't assist with every feed at home, wouldnt it be better to do group alone to gain more confidence with feeding solo?

BTW I don't know why you told me to grow up, it's a little strange to suggest it's childish to have boundaries. Women are allowed to set boundaries and have those boundaries respected, there's a woman in my group with history of SA and another that is a young teen mum who is very self conscious, neither want to feed in front of men why should I or you force them into a situatiation where they might have to? . because you think their boundaries are childish?
To be clear I've no personal issues feeding in public or in front of anyone really, but I'm not so self centered that I can't understand that others do struggle with this aspect of breast feeding.