Anyone else’s nursery pulling this stunt at the moment?

[Skinnermarink]

Let me preface this by saying I KNOW nursery work is hard and it’s long and it’s woefully underpaid. It was a long time ago but I’ve worked in one myself. I can totally see why there’s a recruitment crisis with it at the moment.

DS is one and we thought we’d found a good nursery. Long established, nice staff etc. I wasn’t keen on sending him at all because I wanted him at home with me but it’s not financially viable. So four days a week he goes, at a cost of £1100 a month.

The amount of calls we’ve had to go and collect him over something or other have ramped up in the past eight weeks to the point of ridiculousness. They include

-a temperature that we never managed to catch at home and he was completely well. That happed 3x
upset stomach that magically we never saw at home, but came with a 48 hour exclusion. This went on for weeks. At worst he had a few soft nappies, certainly nothing anyone could describe as diarrhoea. I eventually got a stool sample to clear him for this at their insistence before they’d have him back. He missed days and days of nursery for this.

Teething pain which meant he was ‘not himself’ (I didn’t collect for this, as he was playing, eating and drinking, and I told them I wasn’t going to collect for something as flimsy as this and they were welcome to give calpol)

a head injury that we had to come immediately for or they’d call an ambulance, threw myself into a taxi in sheer panic to find him running around with a tiny bump on his head, but they wanted me to take him home to be checked out and not return him for 24 hours. I’m not under reacting by the way, it really was in no way anything other than a typical toddler bump.

This week has been the final straw. He had his MMR vaccine last week and developed a few tiny spots- a side effect listed on the NHS website. They called and said we had to collect and he couldn’t return today unless a doctor cleared the ‘rash’.

Luckily our GP is fab and had him in this morning, cleared him in seconds with a note so I took him straight to nursery because I had to get to work. There were already 9 babies in the room, mine would take it to ten. 3 members of staff. They looked pissed off and a bit panicked and said he couldn’t come in unless I had a doctor’s clearance - which I produced. The manager was called down who said they had staff sickness but she would be covering herself until an agency worker arrived.

I felt shit leaving him to be honest but it’s no exaggeration to say our jobs have been on the line due to dropping things to pick him up, staying off with him at short notice etc. we’ve used practically all remaining annual leave we had for Christmas so that’s scuppered plans to visit family. We don’t have any outside help, it’s just us, no grandparents to call in an emergency etc.

So I want to know has anyone else been in this situation? I’m not being paranoid (although I did tell myself I was at first) and I honestly think they have to pick babies to send home to stay within the ratios and then hope they stay off the next day.

I’ll add that DS has been genuinely unwell with things on occasion and of course we’ve kept him off. But we are at our absolute limit now and have pissed hundreds up the wall on unnecessary pick ups and days off.

Think I have found an alternative setting and are looking on Monday, but they have no availability until January.

Not denying it happened but intrigued how anyone can doze in a room full of kids!

Yes we had factored this in before having children that we’d need to pay a lot for childcare.

If you read my posts you’d understand I’m not against the government subsidising childcare for parents that can’t afford £6 odd an hour for their childcare.

If the govt want to help people stay in work and not have to leave and go on benefits then they need to step in.

But £6/£7 fees for a nursery is crazy to say that’s pricing women out.

Where are you getting this £6/7 nonsense from?!

Plenty of literature out there that disproves your (very short sighted) points, as a PP points out.

But unfortunately you don’t seem able to think beyond your own situation.

my god if you haven’t got what I’m saying by now then I don’t know how else to explain

You think the cost of delivering childcare and affordability for parents are two separate things?

You can’t focus on the affordability for yourself then when questioned about how nurseries would survive on less than you’re paying ‘I don’t know’

Most providers aren’t overcharging and in your case they certainly aren’t. You’ve mentioned that each childcarers would get 3 fees, which implies the simplistic view you’re taking.

The crux of the problem is not childcare costs which broadly speaking are reasonable.

The problem is that many don’t factor in these costs when having children and the ones that can’t afford the fees aren’t being given government support.

Jesus Christ! I give up. I think the feeling is mutual @Tillsforthrills

I really don’t know what else I can say to you but there’s no way our opinions are going to align.

i am happy for you that you can easily afford high cost childcare. That is great. Well done you.

I was referring to what @HotCoffee22 pays.

Skinnamarink - plenty of literature proving that nurseries are on their knees and can’t take less pay.

Parents that can’t afford what they do charge and on their knees too.

People are very offended when I point out nursery and provider fees are reasonable because they can’t afford that.

Do you disagree with me that the government should subsidise childcare?

We are going round in circles.

Spare me.

I’ve never said it’s easy for us - it isn’t for anyone. Those are your words not mine.

But I’m happy to sacrifice for a few years to further my career and pay my provider a wage that doesn’t disadvantage her hard work so I can progress.

Shoot me if I’m not one of the parents blaming ‘extortionate childcare fees’.

Yanbu. They shouldn't be taking kids on if they dont have the staff anyway.

What you’re saying, if I understand, is that a high cost of childcare is justified and if that prices some women out of work that is an acceptable, naturalist consequence. Or you’re denying it does price women out of work. So in essence childcare being either unaffordable or inaccessible is acceptable.

Is your provider, in fact, a nanny @Tillsforthrills

Its just that you say ‘her’ and I do t know of a childminder that would generally charge that amount, unless it’s a very long day. If you have a nanny that’s actually under market rate for a full day but perhaps you don’t need full time hours?

I have also never commented to say childcare is TOO expensive or providers charge TOO much in terms of what it costs to deliver.

What I have said is that cost, whether justified or not, is prohibitive for many people in being able to access that childcare.

I can afford my childcare, I see it as an investment in my children’s future. It’s not just supervision it’s their first educator.

But that does not alter or detract from other women (or families), who can’t and who are forced out of the workplace and to be that is not acceptable.

CM in London. Home cooked meals, daily outings and a small family like set up. I could get cheaper and save on the bills but I really like the set up as does DH and we would pay around £15 p/h for a good nanny, have to provide food and our home which would distract us. Our local nurseries are 120 per day but I’d never dream of sending DC there.

Why wouldn’t you ‘dream of sending’ your child to the £120 nursery? I thought you said as long as you are willing to pay more the standard would be better, and since that’s almost double what I pay for my nursery I’m curious to know why you feel the cost doesn’t translate to quality care?

Great that you have such a lovely childminder option available to you- sadly they are few and far between. What about if your childminder didn’t have a place? Would you then have to dream of sending to nursery? Or would you relocate?

Give up your career?

I agree with you entirely on your last two paragraphs but your first two paragraphs do not make any sense to me as you have said it’s the childcare costs that are the problem.

I will say this one more time and then I’ll leave it - it is the government that need to help people that have to make the choice between childcare or work.

The government wants to pit parents against the (cost of) childcare providers. In fact they’re delighted with this.

If it were up to them, they’d de-regulate childcare settings and as per Liz Truss idea - make childcare settings take on more children, increase ratios for the same money for providers and less quality settings for babies. That way it shuts the parents up and they don’t have to spend a penny but make it look like they’re doing something to ‘help’ parents out. Driving childcare settings further into the ground.

So the only difference between you and I, is that I don’t blame ‘childcare costs’ for pricing women or lower earners out. I blame this government.

You’re perfectly welcome to quiz me.

The answer is, I live adjacent to two very popular nurseries and see and hear what goes on daily.

If I didn’t have the CM option, I’d look for a nursery I was happy with a bit further afield.

I doubt we’d go with a nanny due to having to pay her taxes, provide food/heating all day and the temptation to get involved with what they’re doing or start helping out if I had a nanny in our home. Also, I really want DC to interact with other children for most of the day, not just the odd play date.

Have you reported these nurseries to Ofsted? If you are hearing and seeing things that concern you that much. That’s quite disturbing.

@Tillsforthrills well then we agree. I do blame childcare costs, but I do not blame providers but the help we have - aka the government. I have not once suggested that providers should charge less.

I have been tempted to and may complain to Ofsted with my concerns. Conversations I hear between workers are saddening.

Also, I find the way the staff who have higher positions, especially the nursery manager who pops her head out once in a while to give instructions to the nursery staff so incredibly condescending despite being much younger than them. But I can’t complain to Ofsted about that aspect.

Incorrect. The lack of 'priming' the immune system in infancy - ie. Before the age of 1 year can trigger a form of leukaemia (ALL) when they're exposed to common viruses after that age in those unfortunate enough to have the genetic mutation. Kids who have earlier exposure from bacteria and viruses such as those who live in farms have better outcomes, especially with asthma and allergies.

Quit your pseudo science and go get an education.

My DS has been in nursery since 18 months, we did it for work reasons but I am now a SAHM and he still goes private nursery 3 full days a week.

Aside from having no major issues health wise except suspected asthma which we expected anyway as we have both had it, the contact has done DS no harm, hes come on development wise amazing, definitely more than he would have just with me and DH tbh I wish we had sent him sooner especially as he's a covid baby so hasn't been any baby toddler groups

Tillforthrills
You live "adjacent to two popular nurseries" and "see what's going on". If you could see what most likely goes on behind your childminder's closed doors or nanny's when they are on their own, you'd probably not like that at all. But you have no way of knowing it and never will since it's a sole adult behind closed doors (with whoever else they choose to give access to) and they are not going to report themselves to you. Of course there are some exceptions, very few, but generally it's the lowest quality level of care. Same with nannies. It's horrifying how some treat kids when out of sight of parents, other staff or the public.
I understand when parents have no choice but to put kids in childminder's setting due to costs, which are usually lower, to survive and to keep a roof over their head, and say so, and have no judgement in those cases but am afraid see you as misguided and naive at best and thick when you say that somehow your child would be receiving better level of care in those circumstances. How could you possibly know that. It almost always I'd shockingly poor care.

I work in a nursery and honestly we and many others are so understaffed right now children are not really getting the level of care they deserve. Often out of ratio and relying on bank staff most of them not even qualified just doing it as a stop gap until they can find a permanent job. If you can find a good nanny /childminder then I feel it’s better for most children than a nursery setting right now.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-63585264?fbclid=IwAR1OYgrvHpque4YaJBfCEURsLsvguUc9o2HP7Ng2WzSG1i4DX2TEyHM_I1E