To not understand the nastiness that being a housewife provokes 2

[Alondra]

Apologies for making a second part to this thread but I feel strongly about this issue.

Topgub

Possibly because there aren't any benefits

Few countries have a government system caring about women and children. The majority of our governments don't care if all have to work for a pittance to pay mortgage, bills and food when children are small because average couples need both wages. A system where nursery fees are stratospheric and eating half an average wage, and worse still, because parents working full time, making an average pay to be able to survive, have few serious tax concessions. Those tax concessions go to multinationals.

It's a system that only cares about productivity attached to $. If you are an engineer with projects worth a million dollars, your salary will be minimum 15% of that money annually. If you are a carer or a parent, there is no quoted money attached to your work, so you are in a low wage or no wage at all.

A woman with two kids working full time for an average salary has not gained much from my mother’s time. Working full time, taking care of the kids when they are home and doing the lion share of housework and rarely free time at all.

With housing costs, bills and health systems collapsing, I really fear for women in the next few years. We will get the short straw as we've always done, but it'll be a plus if, at least, we don't turn on each other.

No, I'm not asking in bad faith. I'm asking because it's becoming apparent you're going to go "it's conditioning" on every single post and nothing will convince an ideologue otherwise.

Can I ask you - how do you think these particular gender roles came about initially?

She's fucking mental. Thinks her opinion is some objective authority and that anyone gives a crap about it lmao.

@FlamencoDance

No apparently not

@AMorningstar

No, if you have evidence that proves that conditioning doesn't exist, I would accept it

If it was actual evidence.

Not a blog or an opinion piece.

If you are aware of the evidence existing, it doesn't matter what I think about it anyway.

I shouldn't be able to refute it.

But I think I better not hold my breath, eh?

I don't do it as a career. I could make it one, but I don't want stress to ruin what I enjoy.

I feel sorry for him because babies are biologically designed to be close to their mother. I'm not saying they can't adapt and will all be miserable but it's not the way human babies evolved to be raised and I find it a bit depressing that kids are almost shut away in nurseries all day instead of interacting with normal life. But that's just my opinion, you can do whatever you want.

You won't be able to actually refute it, you'll just claim you've reguted it because you'll claim social conditioning to absolutely everything, like you always do. It's pigeon chess with you and it always is. It's boring to be perfectly honest.

@AMorningstar

You're the one responding to me, desperately trying to prove me wrong.

Hunting for evidence that doesn't exist. Posting shit articles that don't back up what you're saying or even say what you think they do

But no. You clearly don't care what I think.

(Calling people mental is really poor form BTW)

Bloody hell, no one else got nothing better to do than be on here.

Yes I'm here but I have been busy since 12 .30

@AMorningstar

Try anyway.

Just post it. Let the pigeon see it

I really don't care if you think I'm wrong lol. You can think I'm wrong all you want, it doesn't change the reality or make you actually correct. Crack on.

@vodkaredbullgirl

No. Not really.

I'm having a great time 🤣

Also "you're the one responding to me" you're the one posting on every SAHM thread ever, like a stalker. It's weird.

@FlamencoDance
so I have a child whilst working you're raising a family but as a SAHP I'm just breeding?
Nice.
Also whisky I understand if I'd have girls I'd just raise lazy ones who avoid work, what kind of boys do yo u reckon I'm raising?

Have you any experiences of nurseries? They don't just shut them away. The one my eldest went to they went to the local attractions or the local park. I would say they are more shut away at home unless they are taken to baby groups on a regular basis.

Do you not realise some people work in vocations? You are SO closed minded.
I wonder if you homeschool, your children are otherwise being predominantly educated by working women, many of who are mothers. They’re not “furthering capitalisms agenda” nor “being a wage slave”, they’re filling an extremely important vocational role! And no, I’m not a teacher.

@AMorningstar

The evidence makes me correct.

But don't let thar get in the way.

Such arrogance eh. To absolutely believe you're right with nothing to back it up.

Yes I have and I think they can be useful for older toddlers. Not babies.

Baby groups aren't exactly real life either lol, they're artifical environments. My kids did everything with me and were thrown into hands on, real activities from the get go and it benefitted them. Not sing song rubbish with the middle class mummies.

@FlamencoDance I'm sure your daughter will go far, sounds like she has her head screwed on the right way and good for you for encouraging her. At my school I watched many of the so called popular girls get pregnant (some at 14!) And go on to have multiple children by the age of 20 without the means to support them and often absentee fathers. It's a choice for them but I didn't want that to be me..some of those women are now trying to forge a career, now their kids are older but it has not been easy for them just as balancing an established career with young children has not been easy. The difference is as I am further along the career process I have the funds to help myself and my son.. Both ways can work however of course..

Never used a nursery for my 2, they went to a childminder.

I have plenty, Topgub. But nothing will convince you and I'm not going to play these games with you. You're wrong, I know you're wrong, and deep down you know it too. I shan't engage with you anymore, you'll have to find something else to entertain you. But you'll never stop women being SAHM and your equality of outcome pipedream is just that

My eldest has been to uni and got a 1st class honours in forensic biology.

Most of the childminders I know spend more time nattering and not watching the kids they are in charge of. That put me off using one!

I tend to agree with that. Plus it's literally just someone's living room...no different to my own so what supposed benefit would it give.

My 2 are now 25 and 23, things probably changed since then.

Then again how would you know what a childminder does?