To not want to host my brother for Christmas for ever?

[PoolHill]

For the last three years my brother (let’s call him Charles) has come and had Christmas Day with my partner and I at our house. Charles has fallen out with my parents and is no longer speaking to dad so can’t go “home”. We have another sister who also lives locally and has a husband and kids, but Charles would probably be pretty annoyed if I suggested he join other sister for Christmas, as he isn’t as close to her - largely Charles’ fault as he avoids going to visit them, and claims busyness when invited.

He’s similarly quite stubborn about the rift with dad. Initially it was both their faults, dad is now the one sustaining it but equally Charles isn’t making efforts to mend it. Won’t go up and visit parents as is worried it will be awkward etc. Wanting dad to make the first move (which dad should do but just won’t as he’s even more stubborn).

We have a toddler and I just really want to be able to have Christmas Day just us. To spend the morning in pyjamas, cook dinner the way we want it without having to accommodate Charles’ fussiness, cuddle up on the sofa once the toddler is in bed. Partner also wants a ‘just us’ Christmas but understands the situation with Charles.

But I know if I hint that we want to spend Christmas this way Charles will be v upset, and probably spend the day alone out of pride rather than go to our brother, or try to force a reconciliation with dad or find a friend to be with. I love Charles dearly and we are close, and don’t want him to be alone on Christmas. But equally, I feel like this is becoming a pattern now and that we’re going to end up hosting him for the next ten years.

What should I do?

Thats what Im trying to tell DH! DSD moved to our city this year and we now have her EOW. Working out so-so, at least for me, but DH is loving it (so he should - his kid!) Now shes in our area, hes getting antsy about xmas but shes obviously going to spend it with her mum. We have had the last few xmases either alone or hosting for extended family and TBH I prefer alone with a big buffet type party at ours either xmas eve or boxing day for any family who want to come. Avoids lots of angst but is very festive and plenty of family-time too.

And xmas this year is anyway not our weekend, so its unfair DH wants to change with his exw. To try to please everyone, I suggested maybe she comes either xmas eve and spends it alone with us - he will take her home 8pmish, or come boxing day and meet my family. Dont think shes keen but I have made the offer so up to her and her mum now.

Otherwise, we do 2nd xmas with her over next weekend which is our scheduled weekend. Presents, crackers, turkey, the lot, just one week later. Waiting to hear what she wants to do! DH is grumbling! Why is xmas always such a hassle?!

I'm with you OP
That Charles is kind and nice and you don't want him to be alone on Christmas Day

And that stubbornness of your DFather

I would try to compromise and invite round for the afternoon for Xmas dinner

I understand your DPs thoughts that is this you hosting brother forever more Xmases? You can decide each year and try to encourage other options, life can change he may find a partner, family relationships may be repaired, he may get better Xmas plan options from friends...

For nearly 20 years my sister (single) & parents stay over Xmas with me and I host . I have 3DCs two are grown now and still come home (Uni students)

I don't regret this as my sister died suddenly a few years ago, from cancer.

My friends brother committed suicide at Xmas a few years ago.

It is lonely to be on your own on Xmas day.

So to me, my family xmases may change in the years to come but it will always be our family time not jut mine. In time I expect Bpxing Day will be out quiet day but really we can have potter around days in our family unit any weekend.

It's a shame your DFsther is so stubborn and that Charles isn't as close to your other sister. Hopefully in years that may change.

If you invite Charles round for afternoon Xmas dinner at 2pm
You toddler and DP get a relaxing morning to potter

You don't have to of course. Lots of PPs are telling you he's an adult who can make other arrangements and not your responsibility. They are absolutely right.

But... well, I don't think it's easy to switch off that sibling love and whether you'd be able to relax knowing he's at home alone on Xmas Day? I wouldn't have been able to do that up my sister. She loved her nieces and nephews and Xmas to her was family time without her one family or partner, she just wanted to be with us. No matter how stressful it was to organise at times, they are some of many of my best memories with my sister. You just don't know what life will throw at you.

Sorry mistype
I meant

And without her having her own family or any partner.,

Also think how you'd feel if you were on your own and had just had a lovely Xmas with your sister and she told you not to come next year as they wanted a Christmas to themselves, I can't imagine ever being that rude!

Tell Charles that, now your little one is beginning to understand Christmas and be more involved, you want to change how you do things as a family and start new Christmas traditions that you’re going to carry forward.

Tell him, this year, you will be doing the morning with just the 3 of you and no visitors. You want to focus on your toddler’s delight at Christmas morning, opening presents and see how it works out.

You will be doing dinner for xx time and, while he’s still welcome to join you, the meal is going to be more to your family’s taste so, if he doesn’t like x,y&z could he bring what he’d like to eat with him and you’ll put it all out on the table at the same time.

If he isn’t happy with the compromise then he can always look at alternative arrangements for the day

Tell Charles Christmas is going to be low key this year and describe the day you you are going to have, no negotiations.
He’s in or out, his call.

This situation is so much bigger than just Christmas.

I just know that asserting boundaries will result in Charles getting sad and upset and resenting me.

I’m not so sure Charles is ‘kind and nice’. Charles sounds pretty manipulative and childish.

Maybe invite him but specify it's from a time later on like 2ish so that you can guarantee a christmas morning with the toddler and just your family. And have a chance to go back to bed. Stay in pjs a reasonable amount of time.
It's a pita but I would feel bad if a family member was alone at christmas.

You’re enabling your brother, OP, and I’d bet good money it’s a learned behaviour from watching your mother enable your father. I feel very sorry for you.

There is unlikely to be a way to do it that won't involve him feeling hurt. Unless you make up a fake excuse that isn't anything to do with him. But there's still next year, and the year after.... and isn't it more hurtful to make excuses?

Sure, it's not nice to think you've upset someone. But you're not responsible for his feelings and you have no obligation to host him if you don't want to.

I know he's an adult, I know it's his own fault etc etc but I just couldn't leave my brother to possibly spend Christmas alone no matter what. I really couldn't enjoy my day knowing he was likely feeling sad and lonely.

Couldn't you just relax a bit more even though he's there? Stay in your pjs, cuddle up on the sofa with your partner, let your brother be a part of the family rather than a 'guest'.

Change your mindset rather than your plans. Sounds like he's good to have around, brings presents, plays with your child etc. Please don't ditch him, you sound like a kind person and I think it would play on your mind all day if you do.

@KettrickenSmiled By my reckoning she’s more likely to take advice that’s closer to her value system, many people are more likely to make incremental change than dramatic change, and I think the OP is one of them.

But at this point, I think this is becoming more about you than the OP. The OP loves her brother and doesn’t want to hurt him. Many people wouldn’t handle her problem in a more robust way than she is prepared to, but the fact you seem incapable of understanding either her position or perspectives other than yours (you started this debate with me not the other way round) suggests her issues are pressing a button for you. Bringing personal experience is useful of course, but not if it stops you hearing where the person you are trying to advise is coming from, or understanding that different perspectives and values exist in the world. You will influence people far more effectively if you listen and adapt.

Just be careful that you aren't teaching your DD to bend her wants and wishes to the stubborn, fussy men around her. Also guard against her picking up your brother's attitudes. Your Mum obviously did it for your Dad and subsequently you've taken her role.

Sounds like a good plan, OP.

Does DB turn up expecting to be waited on hand and foot and for his 'fussiness' to be accomodated?

I think you need to put him to work this Christmas - he should make dessert or starters and wash up after.

Make Christmas at yours less attractive so next year when you tell him he needs to make other plans, he won't feel as upset.

Agree with this.

So many posts a the moment of people worrying about putting their own families in front of extended family/step kids etc!

You are entitled to spend Xmas as a family if you want to. It's not your problem that your DB has burned bridges and is stubborn.

You are literally sacrificing the Xmas both you and your DH want for a brother whose behaviour is seriously questionable.

Yes I am, and yes it is. His behaviour is also learned / inherited from our dad.

In our defence, I am a lot less accommodating than mum, and have put up boundaries to dad and Charles and been honest with them on other issues in the past, and prioritised doing things my way over hurting their (very easily wounded) feelings. Even when this has resulted in temper tantrums or freeze outs. But you do have to pick your battles and Christmas isn’t the hill I want to die on. If I can find a middle way that gets me some of my Christmas or future Christmasses back, without ousting Charles I’ll be taking it.

Charles is also not as bad as our dad. I’ve had discussions with Charles before where he’s said he wishes he was less stubborn or didn’t get so bothered by things, and knows it is self defeating. He has got better over the years and made conscious efforts to get over some of his stubborness and sensitivity, that have resulted in positive changes.

Realistically there is only so much you can do to change long established dynamics in the family you were born into, especially as you were a child for a lot of the time you’ve been in that family. Also I am not responsible for fixing the broken aspects of my family dynamic, I can make sure I don’t replicate it with own kids and partner, but as I don’t live with my parents and siblings anymore there is only so much time / energy I’m going to put into trying to change things / rocking the boat. Some things I do try to change, but on others it is just easier / saner to just let it lie, while privately thinking “nope I don’t agree with this” and then go home and live my own life differently.

There is no need to feel sorry for me @BretonBlue. Yes this aspect of my family dynamic is a bit messed up, but in other ways I had a lovely childhood and relationship with them, and I’m not replicating the dynamic in my own new family. Every family has its issues, and in my experience those that say theirs doesn’t have any are kidding themselves.

Big post but you haven't said what you actually want.

Would a three for the morning, with a 3pm dinner invite for Charles work for you or not?

@PoolHill I think you're missing what @BretonBlue is saying.

No one's family is perfect. Of course there are issues and odd dynamics everywhere. No one is saying you should fix it

But you're enabling your brother. You're perpetuating his behaviour. You're making it worse.

You're not helping. I know you think you are. But you're not. If you're always there to pick up the pieces he has no incentive to change. Why should he do anything for himself when you'll do it?

You say it's not up to you to fix it but yet you're the one taking it upon yourself to make sure he's okay.

I echo the pp warning to be careful your dd doesn't pick up on this.

You’re the only person in your family who’s compromising on the Christmas that you want, OP, and I do feel sorry for you on that front.

I hope you’ve got what you wanted from this thread. You posted with honesty and in frustration last night but reading some uncomfortable home truths about your brother has understandably sent you back to your default position of defending him. I understand that these dynamics run deep and won’t be unpicked overnight. I will only say that I agree with the pp who have suggested that while your intentions are kind you are likely doing more harm than good in the long term if your brother wishes to form and maintain a relationship. I hope you have a lovely Christmas in the meantime .

Your brother is a grown up.
Let him know as soon as possible that you're giving him a heads up that this year it's just going to be you, dp & baby's first Christmas.

Charles might end up spending Christmas alone because he has fallen out with everyone.

Why exactly is it OP’s responsibility to compromise what she wants because Charles is stubborn?

Why should she jump through hoops to make some man feel better about his rubbish choices??

Is Charles likely to find a partner and a family unit of his own one day? If so, this won’t last forever.

I would carry on. I hear what you’re saying about having a day as a little unit, but the morning can be like that.

After all, it’s nice to be nice.