Not forcing my daughter to share her bedroom or stop going out to eat?

[tamarvin]

Right now my sister, her husband, and their three kids (14f, 10m, 5m) are staying with me and my family temporarily while they are waiting on council housing. I have two kids (13f and 11m).

So I have four bedrooms in my house. The first is my own. The second one is my daughters bedroom. The third is my son's bedroom. The last bedroom is the guest room where my sister and her husband are sleeping.

From the first night they were here my son has wanted his 10 year old cousin to sleep in his room. Those two get along very well and enjoy each others company. So we set up my 14 year old niece and my 5 year old nephew in the lounge downstairs. My 5 year old nephew is apparently having a lot of anxiety problem so most of the time he sleeps in the guestroom with his parents.

My niece is unhappy with this arrangement because she feel likes she gets no privacy (downstairs is open plan). To solve this my sister wants me to force my daughter to share her bedroom with my niece. My daughter however is not as close with my niece as the boys are with each other. My daughter and niece have very different personalities. My niece can be loud and intimidating and my daughter on the other hand is very soft spoken. Having so many other people in the house has already been making her feel stressed and overwhelmed. All three boys being younger and energetic can make things feel chaotic. I don't want to force her to give up her only private area to retreat to for peace and quiet.

I told my sister that we can try to add a privacy curtain to a corner of the lounge for her daughter. My sister said that wouldn't help at all because anyone could just barge in. She says that a teenage girl should be able to have access to a lockable room especially in a house full of mostly boys. She doesn't see any issue with the girls sharing even though I told her my concerns. She thinks it would be a good opportunity for them to bond.

Another issue we've run into involved a weekly dinner I do with my kids. So far we've had no issues with regular dinner as we all contribute to the groceries and all the adults take turn cooking. I however would get my takeaway for my kids once a week. I let my them take turns each week to choose what they want. It's a treat at the end of the week that they both look forward too. My sister and her husband have a tight budget so they cannot afford to buy takeaway regularly. While I am a better off financially paying for everyone every week is not feasible as it is already expensive and it would cost double.

I thought that eating takeaway in front of them at home would be cruel though. I've had a little discussion about it with my kids and told them that while my sister and her family are staying with us we would be having our weekly dinner out instead of doing takeaway and eating at home. I thought this was a fair compromise.

My sister did not agree. She says it's obvious that we are going out to eat good food since we leave before dinner and when we come back home we don't eat anything. While my kids won't brag about going out to eat they will answer honestly when my niece or nephews ask where we went. They then end up feeling bad and my sister says they wouldn't feel bad if I just said no to my kids and that it wouldn't hurt my kids to not go out as often. I will also add that on a selfish note I don't want to stop taking them out to eat because its the only time I get to have with just the three of us alone now.

Tell your sister to sleep in the lounge and give her daughter the room she is in also remind her there are homeless accommodation units she can take her family to if that would suit her better! What a cheek!!

Correct I agree if you take people in, you have to be able to accommodate them otherwise best not to in the first place . I dont think its fair that your daughter cannot share a room with her cousin . I mean come on its not a stranger , its her cousin . thats whats called kindness.

Give them a letter to show to the council saying they must leave in the New year. You dont say why they are "waiting on council housing" but that is in short supply and they need also to look for private rented accommodation. If they are not working one needs to find a job.

You've been very kind and patient, time to stop being a doormat and tell them to leave.

is it a middle class value to not expect to have the piss taken out of you when you’re doing someone a massive favour? And that’s supposed to be a bad thing? 🥴

and yes, they should ‘know their place’. As guests in someone else’s house. Hth.

I thought this too ^^

I can't believe how entitled your sister sounds. If I was putting up my sibling and family, I'd be giving them one room and floor mattresses. Your unit has already been through tragedy with the death of your childrens mum and now this upheaval. Taking your children out to eat on a Friday night is a great bonding opportunity, giving the three of you time together, I would also include an activity such as cinema or skating etc. I would tell your sister that rather than griping about what you do, she should use the time in the house without your family, to do a meal for just her family and get a board game out for their own family bonding time.
Seriously, you are providing enough for her family, it is time for her to show some gratitude and to stop dictating to you on how you and your family live.

Do you have a driveway?;is buying a cheap secondhand small caravan an option for your sister to sleep in an option whilst DN and her brother share the bedroom?;no one is sleeping in the lounge then.

I thought this too.

You are very much doing the right thing and your daughter will know you are always on her side.
Your sister and family sound like they think they matter more. Where were they living before?

And YOUR assumption is LAZINESS.

Why don’t they give their daughter the spare room, and they set up in the living room to sleep if they think she needs privacy? They can keep their things in the spare room but Atleast their daughter will have a private space. Adults can and should make do in these situations.
In terms of eating out, if you wanted to Be extra kind/accommodating (and I don’t think you need to) you could do take away night every two weeks so maybe your sister could afford to be included. Otherwise you take them out and if the kids ask you say it’s to give your lot and their lot some private Familly time. If they can’t afford to eat out or have take away atleast it gives them a few hours as a Familly to cuddle up on the sofa and watch a film or play some board games with just their Familly.

Voted YABU for the entire arrangement. If they didn't have anywhere to go, the council would have found them a temporary accommodation, suitable for a family this size. Your house isn't. I am surprised that they would inconvenience you instead (and themselves) especially for such a long time.
Both sides are at fault here as you are both trying to do something that isn't doable, and as a result the children are suffering. Although your sister does sound demanding and ungrateful, I could also see how hard it must be for your niece.
I also disagree about the takeaways - I just couldn't do this to my family and their children, sneaking out with my own kids to eat out every week.
Letting them stay till January is very generous but is it really doing anyone a favour? The council won't be able to help until they are officially homeless. And a temp house would be a lot better than all of you being crammed at yours.

Hmm yeah, I can see the British class system in full force in this thread. I think you all be ashamed of the way you view people in difficult circumstances. Ashamed!

I think the 2 girls should share together. Ideal no, will everyone be happy no, but theyre not happy not either. It’s only temporary and see how it goes. But I would continue going out for dinners, that’s your alone time with the children and I would have thought your sister’s family would be happy for the alone time too.

Oh no!! No takeaways? Really?? Oh I would throw this family to the gutter if it meant I couldn't have takeaways!! Do you hear yourself?

Correct I agree if you take people in, you have to be able to accommodate them otherwise best not to in the first place . I dont think its fair that your daughter cannot share a room with her cousin . I mean come on its not a stranger , its her cousin . thats whats called kindness

this.

why was it not discussed with the kids first. Are you happy to share, if not I’ll say no.

personally if my sister was in such dire straits she was facing homelessness, I’d be pretty pissed off with my kids if they refused to make space for their cousins.

you have two teenage girls here. One is being allowed her own room while everyone else shares, the other has to sleep on the sofa. Pretty clear message to one that she’s valued less. Especially as o/p has said the downstairs area is open plan so she’ll have people walking in on her constantly.

unless there’s significant backstory here you have a teenage girl living with her dad and brother having lost her mum. It may help her to have an aunt and female cousin around for a bit, especially at her age.

Guarantee if the DNiece does move in, there's no way the family will ever move out. Why would they, when they are all nicely in bedrooms?

DNeice needs space - DNeices DPs facilitate that using the other bedroom they are already using.

The other thing I would say is that it's easy to be hypothetically kind with someone else's space.

I remember I went through a bit of an internal debate if we should house a Ukranian refugee and my friends were like absolutely I should do it because I had a spare room - conveniently their circumstances meant they had no spare room, or some other overriding reason why they couldn't- but I absolutely should. We didn't in the end - and here OP is doing an amazing thing by housing his Dsis and family long term, and all they can do is grouse about less than perfect sleeping arrangements.

Is it a middle class value to expect poor people, HOMELESS people, to know their place when being condescended to with charity that is hugely conditional on the recipients being quiet, grateful and thankful to their beneficiaries on a daily basis for grudgingly giving them a bit of space in their house but affording a TEENAGED girl no privacy?? Yes. I thought so.

It’s your home and do they contribute to mortgage? Bills? I would find out where they are on housing list as council won’t house someone that has a home.
carry on with your tradition of eating out and you don’t have to pay for sister family. They could save up as they are not paying rent etc which they would in a council house.

tricky one on the girls sharing but again it’s your house. Many families only live in 2 bedroom apartments with 3-4 kids so all genders share. Maybe for dressing she could use a bedroom

They have already been there for 4 months, so clearly there was no suggestion at the outset that the girls share.
It looks like the original plan was for all 3 of the sister’s children to share the lounge, but OP’s son offered to share with middle child, youngest child is currently in with his parents, which only leaves the 14YO.
I agree that it’s awful for her, but I think her parents, as responsible adults, should be the ones moving out of their bedroom to resolve this issue. Again it’s not ideal, but very probably a lot better than a hostel.

I think this thread throws up into the air, the whole idea of heling others. Most people here seem to think that the OP is essentially, Mother bloomin Theresa and yet Mother Theresa is rather resenting the idea that anything should change. So then, throw your sister out. She'll find out on whom she can rely. As for the rest of you, the world is changing. Putin may launch a nuclear attack on Ukraine most immediately but there's climate change and any number of other challenges ahead. I generally don't wish ill on people but I do hope that you discover what it is to be desperate, homeless and hungry, and that someone who is genuinely keen to help, lifts a finger and that you learn something.

Is it a middle class value to expect poor people, HOMELESS people, to know their place when being condescended to with charity that is hugely conditional on the recipients being quiet, grateful and thankful to their beneficiaries on a daily basis for grudgingly giving them a bit of space in their house but affording a TEENAGED girl no privacy?? Yes. I thought so.

Are you reading the same OP as me? Where is the evidence of condescension? Where is the evidence that the sister's family are expected to be quiet and show gratitude to their 'beneficiaries' on a 'daily basis'? Where is evidence of being 'grudging'? Where, @Belinda500? Because I'm obviously missing something here. You seem to be making stuff up to fit your own narrative.

Oh please.

Well then she can share with her parents in the guest room or the 2 sisters kids can have the guest room and the parents sleep in the open plan area. No way should her child give up her private space. Op has done more than most would do in taking them in.