To think Ukrainian families may just have to..

[FindingMyself1999]

Go back? bbc article

such a sad situation but we barely have enough housing or school places as it is. Unless the hosts can act as guarantors? That’s a possibility ?

the government really hasn’t thought through the aftermath of the hosting scheme.

The housing crisis, school places etc you mention are not the fault of refugees. The government could at least try to solve the housing crisis, properly fund schools to have enough places, and more, but they choose not to.

They have enough to pay their mates for big contracts and god knows what all else after all.

Dont be fooled by their deliberate diversion tactics to turn the poor against each other, so they don’t turn against them instead.

@Kendodd So the government hasn’t asked for proof of residence or workplace? It just - in the case of these 3 people anyway - lets people in on their say so? That seems contradictory to what the government website says… Although with this government I wouldn’t be too surprised if they don’t know their arse from their elbow.

Not all of Ukraine is shelled There is a huge section of Ukraine which hasn’t been affected by the war in terms of infrastructure so I was a bit confused why they were told to come over here… it is a good thing however!
However I always wondered why other countries at war We’re not offered homes from homes in the same way Ukrainians are

Didn’t that lady who But with a married man go back to Ukraine in the end?

No, it is not their fault @PinkFrogss but would you calmly accept it if a Ukranian woman and her family were offered a house above you if you had sat on that same list with your family for two or more years?

That doesn't need a deflecting reply it just requires a Yes or No.

I don't think there's a right answer. Sorry situation indeed and I don't think its fair to send anyone home when it isn't safe but it's unacceptable to bump permanent residents down the list for housing and schools. Britain is such a shit show at the moment we frankly weren't in a position to be offering help.

Stupid boris, stupid scheme.

YABU @FindingMyself1999. PM Truss wants to lift the cap on immigrants by 44,000 in Seasonal and lower paid and increase the length of time they can stay. Not to mention those we need in professional positions.

The government clearly believes we can house thousands more people. Why not permit Ukrainian refugees leave to work and be housed?

No, because that’s how the list works. It’s based on need not first come first served, and I agree with that.

The lack of council housing is a separate issue to the waiting list being judged by need not waiting time, and is an issue I’m far more concerned with.

Sorry that should be a yes

@GonnaGonnaGoing I would be pissed off at the government (as usual) for not prioritising housing and leaving people in that situation. I wouldn’t personally be pissed off specifically at the Ukrainian woman/family who got ahead of me in the queue as I can rationally see their situation is worse.

However, I can completely understand people who are frustrated and pissed off at the situation who don’t have the capacity to prioritise anyone else, and shouldn’t have to prioritise anyone else.

Having said that, in the BBC article the OP linked there are a few different situations:

“If registered homeless, Olena and Diana would be likely to be offered accommodation in a hotel, but it probably wouldn't be in Billericay, where Olena works and where they've built up a support network of local Ukrainians.”

So hotel accommodation, not council housing.

“Oxford City Council said it was asking hosts and guests to continue with their arrangements because there was no spare social housing capacity available in Oxfordshire, while the private rented sector has limited capacity and is very expensive.”

None offered here.

“Jane says she was told Ukrainians would be prioritised for council accommodation at meetings run by Cherwell Council, but so far, none has been found.”

And the one you mentioned - prioritised but none available.

I think it’s also important to consider whether the prioritisation is “because they’re Ukrainian” or “because they’re more likely to become homeless than other groups.” I honestly don’t know the answer to that one but at least it’s the case that it’s not a widespread problem for now. It looks to be an individual council decision rather than official policy. It does, though, need serious government intervention soon, as hosts have done so much and can’t cope for much longer, and Ukrainian families need stability for work and school.

The official stance is that Ukrainians were expected to go home when things improvedb That’s what I heard a government minister say

I believe you @pinkfrogs but my answer would be no, because I would feel it was a leapfrogging situation and I had been waiting longer.

Then again, I'm just a woman and not a plaster saint.

I know some posts have said it's the government's fault for not having enough housing and they don't it's true but then again, given that there is such limited stock, I really do feel that it should be given to those who have been on the list for longer.

I ask myself, if the situation were to be reversed and UK nationals fled to Ukraine would we be expecting their nationals to be dumped down the list while we took their place?
I'm not Mystic Me g but taking a wild guess, I think they would tell Alison and her children to fuck away off.

I think the country is pretty much full and housebuilding numbers are going to decline heavily due to the economic situation, only making it worse.

@GonnaGonnaGoing Oh some mumsnetters would absolutely expect to jump the queue and be prioritised! 😉

It looks like in general council housing is allocated based on need, not on how long you’ve been on the waiting list. Which I suppose makes sense. What doesn’t make sense is why the government committed to a scheme in such a hands off, careless way that it leaves so many people at risk of being homeless.

In our town people set up an organisation to help Ukrainian people wanting to come here - both before they arrived and afterwards. This means that the workload is shared - there are people doing the form-filling and driving around and taking Ukrainians on trips. It's not all left to the hosts. And some families have been given whole flats (not sure how that's been possible). Funding has been obtained to pay for English lessons. There is lots of support for Ukrainians from general volunteers.
Actually a member of my family (different town) hosted a mother and child for a couple of months, very successfully, and then they chose to back to Ukraine. Very brave. I don't think I would have made the same decision and I wouldn't expect Ukrainians to.
We're so short-staffed in the UK. There are job vacancies everywhere. It is a positive that some of those jobs can be filled. A Ukrainian I know is very well qualified and has been snapped up by a local employer, despite not speaking terribly good English.

We are expecting 40 to our town they don't have to rely on benifits. They can get a job and tbh there are a lot of jobs that locals won't do. My daughters sheltered housing is always short staffed for carers. There is a young Hungarian lady that works with her who my daughter adores. Despite them advertising all the time for carers they just can't get the staff. One left as she's a trainee nurse but since then they have relied on bank agency staff who can't work without another member of staff there.

"... accusing our govt of being hideously incompetent?"

Absolutely no way that it could ever happen, could it?

The government is very competent - especially when it comes to caring for their donors and cronies

Ukrainians will need to go home at some point, otherwise they can't rebuild their country.

Britain has a huge housing problem, and we're probably not in an ideal situation to offer tons of housing to everyone who wants it. The housing issue badly needs to be dealt with, but even if we defeated every NIMBY overnight and started the infill development tomorrow, it would take years.

Huge sympathy to the Ukra mothers and kids, but I agree that jumping the council housing queue is unfair and will create a lot of resentment.

The government could at least try to solve the housing crisis, properly fund schools to have enough places, and more, but they choose not to.

I agree, but this is going to take TIME. And it's not just the government; house owners in this country constantly block and protest any attempt to build housing. By the time we had built the housing that's needed (even assuming we could scrap the Town and Country Planning Act this very minute), the war in Ukraine would have been long finished.

Realistically, and given the housing shortage right now, prioritising the Ukrainians IS going to mean other people not getting housing as a result, and we need to be honest about this when discussing this issue.

All entirely predictable, unfortunately.

There never was a plan in place for what would happen after the initial 6 months was up. That would have meant planning ahead, and not being incompetent with half-baked schemes.

So hotel accommodation, not council housing.

Are you being deliberately thick? The hotel accommodation is temporary housing by the council, under the homeless pathway. It's expensive and if the person has no job it'll be fully funded by the council, who under their duty of care for homeless will ignore the housing benefit limit, further depleting council funds. Homeless is top priority particularly if it involves children. So yes, they're going to be getting a permanent council home quicker than someone who is on the waiting list for reasons other than homeless. As a result, that other person is going to have to wait longer than they would otherwise have had to to get a place.

There are people on council housing lists who will realistically never be housed because they'll never ever have enough priority, there will always be someone in greater need than them. This doesn't change the fact they have needs too and have been allowed to join the council housing list due to those needs.

As a previous poster said, let's be honest about it all.

I don't know what the solution is. We can't just build all over Britain until there's nothing left but housing/schools /doctors/shops. It would make the country more overcrowded and shittier than it already is and the current residents don't deserve that.

Any Ukrainian who can work but won't because they're being picky about jobs should be evicted and deported. Those committing benefit fraud by working and claiming should be deported also. But I doubt it will happen because likely nobody in authority is policing it.

Genuine people escaping war/persecution and looking for a better life, I have no problems with, whether they can work or not. That doesn't change the fact that the UK doesn't have enough resources for people already here and bringing in extras just stretches those resources further.

The government could fix this by spending money on the country and its people instead of defrauding the government coffers to make themselves and their mates rich(er), but that's not going to happen either.

I've hosted a Ukrainian woman and her young child for the past 6 months in my UK home (i'm abroad for a few years). I said she could stay till April 23 as the scheme was extended and if it had been extended beyond April 23, she could have stayed longer. I use the govt thank you payment to pay all the bills so make nothing from this and in fact, it's ended up costing me.

However, she suddenly turned nasty and demanding and the things she has said to me are unacceptable so I've told her to leave. I feel very guilty about putting a mother and her child on the street but I'm not prepared to be treated like a doormat. She thinks the council are going to give her a house (I did wonder if this was the reason for her change in attitude; she wanted me to put her out) the support team have told me that's unlikely and she's more likely to be homed in a hotel, in a completely different area. Compared to others, she had a really nice, safe set up. Good school, nice self contained flat in a good area.

I feel really deflated by the whole experience, I did so much to help them settle and she's thrown it in my face.

Incidentally Ukrainians are technicality not refugees, they are displaced persons who are given 3 years to live and work in the UK with the expectation they will return home after the war. This may change in the future, depending on what happens in Ukraine.

It has always been possible to help house refugees, it just wasn't widely known about.

💯👏👏. Excellent post.

I might be willing to help. Let me know the details of the situation and I can advise you. I can help with the legalities as I am familiar with guarantor and conservatorships.

So you’re saying it’s OK for someone else to miss out on a school place and be unsettled, as long as the Ukrainian’s get a place?