Totally agree with Sturgeon re the tories

[FayeGovan]

I destest them and their policies too

Good on her for telling it like it is

I know shes hated on mn, or rather on scotsnet. They prefer the tories there, christ knows why. Independence is a dirty word on scotsnet. So i know I'll be shot down, but i couldn't care less.

Good on you Nicola👍

They have had 15 years to tackle it they have instead got considerably worse for drugs death!

Alex Salmond it was the botched handling in the first place by the govt into it which led to a court case which he won and they had to pay out for! There own reporting system was heavily criticised all of this cost hundreds of thousands of pounds.

The ferries fiasco is bonkers for a govt which has a lawyer at its helm they agreed to the most questionable of contract clauses which have cost millions and that's without going into the tender process.

It's not a smear attempt when it just shows failure after failure and the only response is but Westminster!

Sorry I don't find that good enough!

Is this a joke? The SNP side step responsibility for everything by finger pointing at England.

Ironically, if Salmond got his way and the facts of this were made public domain, it would immediately become apparent exactly why it descended into farce and chaos. NS was misled right from the outset. I will not even hint at who by, because of obvious reasons, but someone was deliberately economical with the truth, and knowingly led the FM into a position where there was inevitably going to be a conflict of interest.

NS came out of it as the one with the egg on her chin, but as the inquiry showed, she acted with the utmost regard for best procedure throughout. If everyone involved had done the same thing the whole farce would have been avoided.

Aside from the unnamed person, there were two others who also were also entirely guilty of mishandling this, one an SNP party official, the other a Civil Servant. It is a matter of public record who these people were, and I'm of the opinion that neither of them were dealt with in anywhere near as severe a manner as they deserved, given how utterly intransigent they were. Fitting though that NS was pilloried for not disciplining a Civil Servant, even though there is absolutely no mechanism whereby she could have being that they are not SNP employees.

Scottish Ferries c£150 million over budget and potentially 5 years late = inept corrupt SNP and a great reason as to why Scotland shouldn’t be independent.
**
Elizabeth line c£4billion and will be over 5 years late = shhhhhhh let’s not speak about that, WHAT ABOUT THE INEPT CORRUPT SNP!

Only someone who has never lived on an island and has no fucking clue how reliant islanders are for a lifeline service would come up with such a stupid comparison, note the word lifeline, these ferries are absolutely critical, not a wee nice to have.

In what possible way is the ongoing brexit farce the fault of the SNP 'sidestepping and pointing at England', considering that right from the getgo in 2016 the Westminster government demanded full ownership and control over this, and consistently and persistently rejected all SG requests to be involved?

Sorry, but that's utterly ridiculous to attempt to lay this at the door of the SG. Westminster basically told them 'fuck off, this is our thing and you aren't invited'.

They need to own it because it's entirely on them.

Provisional Sinn Féin isn't regarded as a normal, democratic political party today at all.

The intelligence services in the UK and ROI both stste very, very clearly that:

1. The Provo Army Council controls Sinn Féin

2. They still have access to weapons

3. Have been recruiting.

Another country?! No, it's part of OUR country.

Did it stop Sturgeon commenting on other countries such as the USA or Spain when she has zero foreign policy powers or role?!

No. Even the EU refused to negotiate with her for that reason. Your attempted point is self-defeating!

Again, Sturgeon opened the door to this by subjective opinion in describing the Conservatives as detestable. Sinn Féin is right there and has a much worse, undemocratic history.

Unless you think they're not in any way detestable then or now.....🤦‍♂️

They have had 15 years to tackle it they have instead got considerably worse for drugs death

Then ask yourself why, when every possible body, service, organisation, and department who would be involved within Scotland were unanimous and united in an agreed first step towards tackling it, yet Alister Jack can simply turn up, and in the space of an hour in which he didn't even attend the hearing, simply dismissed it out of hand because they are totally unwilling to give an inch on Reserved Drugs laws?

There isn't a thing any SG can do about that. It literally has to come from Westminster. Do you honestly believe Alister Jack knows better than the people who live here and deal with the issue every single day of the week, how best to go about tackling it and what that would entail?

I still don’t get why Brexit isn’t an indication of the huge mess this will be - countries even more entangled and for longer than the EU

Why do people think this will sort itself out easily - when we see that despite promises of the good we can see how hard it has been with Brexit

But for this it’ll all be fine?

Then maybe it’ll work economically for Scotland but if it doesn’t it’s going to be the same infighting with around half not wanting it

At least those in England can say ok it’s not us anymore tg but you’ll have division internally instead

Whilst this debate rolls on, NS has announced date of referendum for next year if Supreme Court approves (snigger). October 19th. Almost a year to go. I don’t think NS will still be leader at that time, but she’s announced the date now and fulfilled the posturing brief, so she can move on without shame (or accountability) if she needs to.
All so very predictable.

Oh, and the party thar most closely resembles SNP political ideology is NOT Provisional Sinn Féin.

It is actually the Social And Democratic Labour Party (SDLP). You know, constitutional nationalist party like the SNP.

Provisional Sinn Féin is a Republican party that still believes in physical force aka terrorism. Hence, still retains weapons and controlled by the Provo Army Council.

The SDLP very successfully condemned PSF/PIRA for decades. Still does. So, why shouldn't the SNP do likewise?

Do that and Sturgeon may have credibility with her view on the Conservatives.

It is pretty indicative, and nobody realistic is claiming that it won't inevitably be a shambles.

The strength of feeling is such though that plenty are willing to accept the pain in order for a possible route to a different outcome.

There is no mechanism for a UK Scotland to re-enter the EU as it is. Nobody in England is interested in doing that, and unless England changes it's mind Scotland will yet again just have to lump it.

At least post-indi Scots would be able to legislate to rejoin regardless of what rUK thinks, but again, nobody who is in any way realistic is pretending that it's all going to be easy or plain sailing on the road to doing that. It's a question of whether you think the long term benefits are worth it or not, and personally I believe they will be. The evidence all around us suggests that small, wealthy countries fare perfectly well as members or associate members of the EU.

There's absolutely no chance of a referendum in October next year. It isn't realistic even from a logistical and procedural point of view.

This is another step along the road. 2014 was no different. There weren't many realistic pro-indi people who genuinely believed 'yes' would win in 2014, but that wasn't the only purpose of the Ref. It was as much about normalising the concept of Independence as opposed to Incorporation, and getting people thinking and talking about Scotland's constitutional future. To that end it's been a resounding success.

Folk who seem to think Indi is just going to 'go away' need to give themselves a reality check. It isn't going anywhere, it's just a matter of when exactly, or if, the ostriches pull their heads out of the sand and engage with it rather than it washing over them while they pretend it isn't happening.

The border issue won’t go away either even if people say it will sort itself out and pretend there’ll be no issue. It’s Brexit but worse. Ostrich as you rightly say

Nor will the division you get when around half don’t want it.

As for yes losing last time but it still being great - if Brexit had not won that would have been it. I feel sorry for the No voters who are now faced with their 2014 vote being overruled.

If remain had won I’d expect my vote to be respected as the Brexit one was.

Let's not pretend that drugs room are a magic cure thats why its been knocked back.
The best cure is properly funded residential rehab programmes and support for people not fix rooms!
You can't blame Westminster for the appalling record when England have the same laws and much much lower stats!

The Scottish govt need to get on with what they are already in charge of!

As for yes losing last time but it still being great - if Brexit had not won that would have been it. I feel sorry for the No voters who are now faced with their 2014 vote being overruled

I can somewhat empathise with the point about 2014 'No' voters, but the SG has been absolutely clear all along. They are not seeking another Ref just for shits and giggles as some unionists seem to believe. It was always spelled out quite plainly that the mandate for a 2nd Ref would stem from a 'significant material change' to the 2014 'No' settlement.

I mean you could logically take that and suggest that in actual fact 'No' voters should themselves be absolutely outraged. They were promised that continuation of the UK would guarantee EU membership, yet within 2 years that is effectively out the window. Everyone who participated in the 2014 Indi Ref has been sold a lie, it isn't dependent on which way you voted.

You can't bind future legislators by current actions, so there's no basis for the oft repeated 'we can't have a Ref, we had one in 2014'. We had a General Election in 1979. Why have we bothered having any since? 1979 was surely the 'settled will of the people'. Politics change, opinions change, options change. It's good fundamental democracy to consult people once there has been a shift as large as Brexit.

Folk who seem to think Indi is just going to 'go away' need to give themselves a reality check. It isn't going anywhere, it's just a matter of when exactly, or if, the ostriches pull their heads out of the sand and engage with it rather than it washing over them while they pretend it isn't happening.

Eh? when=next October
if=Supreme Court approval (it’s taking them two months to make a decision on it apparently, ffs what a waste of public money)

You sound happy at the prospect of ongoing division and debate, beyond Oct 23, instead of ‘getting the job done’ to coin a phrase?

Well just as well absolute nobody pretended it was a 'magical cure' then, isn't it?

It's rich to complain about 'nothing being done' when the very first small step towards tacking the issue is rejected out of hand by people it doesn't affect, and in direct denial of the consensus wish of the people it absolutely does affect.

You can't blame Westminster for the appalling record when England have the same laws and much much lower stats!

England and Scotland are two totally different beasts when it comes to Class A problems. Sociologically, historically, economically, and pragmatically. The two are in no way comparable. You'd be as well holding up the drug situation in Outer Mongolia as a comparator for all the relevance England's situation has to Scotland's. Two entirely different scenario that require tailored approaches, which is where the fundamental problem lies because anglocentric Westminster Govt point blank refuses to acknowledge this crucial fact.

Keep telling yourself that it’s just around the corner, just one last push! Cherry pick the rare polls that suit you. I guess it’s hard to accept when the dream is over.

it’s never going to happen. Even Nicola Sturgeon knows that.

'Two entirely different scenario that require tailored approaches, which is where the fundamental problem lies because anglocentric Westminster Govt point blank refuses to acknowledge this crucial fact.'

Well, maybe if Nicola stopped dishing out free school meals and sanitary protection to kids who's parents can more than afford if and started 'tailoring her approach' to the drug problem she might make some headway?

You sound happy at the prospect of ongoing division and debate, beyond Oct 23, instead of ‘getting the job done’ to coin a phrase?

Well that's just a bizarre takeaway. It's not about being 'happy', it's about being realistic and pragmatic. Oct 23 Ref isn't happening even if it were to be legally approved because there simply isn't time to agree the format, schedule it, so on and so forth, thanks to the legal squabbling delaying the initial timetable. NS could hardly make a significant announcement along the lines of "I want to do X on X date, but by the time all the extraneous bullshit is dealt with it will more than likely be Y date". That's just not how these things are done anywhere, hence the hard and fast Oct '23 and sticking by it.

I'd love it to happen tomorrow, but that isn't remotely realistic either. I'm 'happy' enough to wait as long as it takes quite frankly, because as much as every day spent stuck in this awful union is a drag, I'm not about to freak out if it isn't dispensed with by 2024, or 2026, or 2030 or whatever. It takes as long as it takes. Pragmatic advocates of Indi have known this for decades and are perfectly at ease with it. The 'GET IT DONE NOW OR ELSE' brigade are not realistic. I empathise with the desire, but it is and always has been a case of slowly, slowly catchy monkey.

Again, how is she supposed to do that, when that's exactly what was suggested last year and Alister Jack dismissed it out of hand?

Ask Alister Jack why that is. It's not for want of trying on the part of NS, the SG, Local Councils, NHS Scotland, Police Scotland, or drugs and health charities.

Have you not noticed the several posts where I quite contendedly highlight the fact that I'm perfectly comfortable with it perhaps not being 'just around the corner'?

Sorry to burst your bubble and all.

It's strange because the SNP are referred to as the tartan tories in some quarters.
Sturgeon should hang her head in shame over the NHS, the ferries and her financial discrepancies. She has two super injunctions for the press to mention neither her sexuality or the parties financial dealings.
She would much rather go on pride marches and give junkies an extra £50 a week benefit if they have a dog.

it’s never going to happen. Even Nicola Sturgeon knows that.

Nicola will be ordering a deep clean of her overseas properties as we type. No way will she hang around in Scotland for the humiliation of a defeat. Her work is done and she doesn’t want to leave on a negative, it’s not good optics for the onward highly-paid position (and bidding war for the selective-memory memoirs).

Reminds me of another U.K. politician who limped on to the end with utter disregard for the day job, instead prioritised her own reputation, but thankfully it kickstarted the demise of her party in power and enabled Labour to boot them all out come 97.

'Again, how is she supposed to do that, when that's exactly what was suggested last year and Alister Jack dismissed it out of hand?'

'Consumer rooms' dismissed as no evidence to support any effectiveness whatsoever. That doesn't mean they do nothing and as usual blame their failures on Westminster.