That this looks like a stunt to undermine trans issues

[TempName01]

Article in the Daily Mail, not sure if I should link to it…

A Canadian teacher in transition to female is pictured with enormous prosthetic breasts which they wear as part of their gender identity. When I saw the article I thought it must be a stunt against transgender people and trying to ridicule men transitioning to female. If they actually want to dress that way then to me, it looks like they are fetishising rather than genuinely transgender.

I am usually all for dressing how ever you want but it just looks so inappropriate, AIBU?

Sorry I meant yo type

I think we are better these days at society being more accepting of unisex or personalised expressions through dress and style without expecting people (not people!!) to conform.

Oh Lord
That is appalling and clearly meant to be overly sexualised for a work teaching environment with DCs

I can imagine if she has too much cleavage on show that might be inappropriate for work in a school

The issue isn't cleavage. Hard to comment in any helpful way without seeing the images. They're easy to find.

Regardless of being cis or trans, there is a dress code for schools.

In this case the school has gone on record to say that their dress code (which this person is clearly flouting) only applies to students.

That’s brilliant 😂😂 what a weirdo

If she was a cis woman the head teacher would be able to say I'm sorry but you do need to cover your nipples as top is fairly see-through/ thin but it'd be said very careful with difficulty and HR advice as ahem .. body type/natural boobs ...

But someone choosing to wear these into a school to work with children?? ... no that's gone awry and a sexualised parody of a woman by choice ... to work in a school ?? I'd be questioning appropriateness
I cannot imagine the children / pupils are comfortable with this

So yes OP is right to question whether this is a stunt to undermine trans issues . Or genuine ? What's the feedback so far?

Just been doing safe guarding training and I have no idea how this isn't a major safeguarding issue.

Yeah I've seen it now
Couldnt find it before
Thx

Please do not use cis. It is demeaning and offensive. Women are not a subset of woman.

Are you saying a transwoman has to identify as a gay man if they want to date men?

Bearing in mind a transwoman is male if they are sexually attracted to other males they are homosexual men, i.e., gay.

But you’re not taking about that, you’re taking about transwomen simply not being allowed to exist. Even if they are great people who have done no wrong and do not want to erase women rights.

Another one of the great mantras - not allowed to exist, you've truly swallowed the playbook. Exist as what?

Either that or you simply don’t believe transwomen like that exist. You seem to think they are all sexual predators in disguise.

Nope, try harder I've never said they are all sexual predators in disguise. I don't believe all men are sexual predators, however, as a sex class males (the sex class transwomen belong to) commit 98% of all sex crimes, that is a fact there is no getting away from it. It is impossible to tell merely by looking which males are one of those males who are sexual predators and that applies to all males whether trans or not.

There are very good reasons for definitions and boundaries to remain clearly defined, people who want to blur either are a problem, it's what leads to the person this thread was started about, it leads to the issues currently being discovered at Mermaids.

Tiani4

If the teacher was a woman I suspect that they would also be being told off for inappropriate clothing in the workshop (as this is a shop teacher)

What's really sad is that IF this is genuine, it undermines trans issues and simply is a choice to wear huge cartoonish inflated fake breasts inappropriate to working in a school.

If they were real, that's different and more about covering more discretely the pointy nipple area and Oml unlucky woman to have that backache ...

If it's a parody photo ... then it's in extremely poor form

OP was spot on with her original post

Yes
I agree

That is not a woman so wearing those prosthetics is entirely his choice. I would feel more sympathy for an actual woman who had to live with a chest that size.

@Shakenotslurred

Please do not use cis. It is demeaning and offensive. Women are not a subset of woman.

I don't disagree with you as it is not my favourite of terms but for brevity of discussion points , I used it instead of "same sex as at birth"

Lots of women and men react very strongly to being labelled cis women or cis men when we are simply women or men and that's our identity not wanting other people to decide on new terms for our identities to force upon us

I don't disagree with you but for purposes of this discussion I used it for clarity

(But call me a cis woman to my face though- for my identity - and I'll frown and say "I'm a woman, you don't get to redefine my identity.. " bc that's a time I can do that)

@Shakenotslurred
That is not a woman so wearing those prosthetics is entirely his choice. I would feel more sympathy for an actual woman who had to live with a chest that size.

I agree with you

It has got to be a parody political statement surely, that is in bad taste ? I really struggle to believe this ...

I don't disagree with you as it is not my favourite of terms but for brevity of discussion points , I used it instead of "same sex as at birth"

Neither cis nor same sex as at birth are required - woman is enough and if you are talking about women and transwomen then use women and transwomen. The use of cis adds neither clarity or brevity it is not required.

I’ve never argued that transwomen should be treated exactly the same as women. I’ve argued that transwomen who have done nothing wrong and are not sexual offenders should be given the same respect as everyone else. Free of discrimination and hate.

Transwomen have needs specific to transwomen. So they may need different things to women. It’s ok to be different and sometimes being treated differently is a supportive thing.

I think you’re imagining that I believe all the things you disagree with. Stop assuming what I think and have a conversation with me.

If she was a cis woman the head teacher would be able to say

"If he was a woman the head teacher would..." works fine. Base your argument in reality and everyone will understand.

If the pro trans lobby would find my views nothing but transphobic hate, then it would follow that I’m not advocating for the principles you disagree with.

So what exactly is your issue with my views?

I think transwomen who have done nothing wrong and are not sexual offenders should be afforded the same respect as everyone else.

I think woman’s spaces should be protected, women’s right should be protected and issues like woman’s sports should be carefully reconsidered.

I believe all of this can be done without hating transwomen.

Not sure why that’s so difficult to comprehend.

But I don’t disagree with you.

What have I said to suggest I disagree with the legal issues you’re flagging?

You’re frustrated that I’m advocating for unquestionable self identification and the rejection of any distinctions between women and transwomen.

it may help for you to know that I’m not advocating for that. Never said I was.

I feel equally frustrated about the pertinent points being missed.

For me, it’s the refusal to be more specific. It’s not ok to say most transwomen are simply men with sexual fetishes, who are intent on eroding women’s rights.

Otherwise, I fail to see what we are disagreeing upon.

I think transwomen who have done nothing wrong and are not sexual offenders should be afforded the same respect as everyone else.

Are they not? What disrespect are they receiving?

I think woman’s spaces should be protected, women’s right should be protected and issues like woman’s sports should be carefully reconsidered.

Women's spaces, services and rights can be easily protected, however, there needs to be legislation enshrining these rights as some - note the word some - transwomen will otherwise not comply as has been amply demonstrated.

What careful reconsideration are you thinking of for women's sports? You earlier said you did not know anything about this, are you for or against transwomen being included in women's sports?

I believe all of this can be done without hating transwomen.

I don't hate transwomen, I disagree vehemently with some of them and with the TRAs and their allies that are intent on destroying women's rights, any hatred is coming from their direction aimed squarely at women. I detest their attempts at manipulation, emotional blackmail and guilt tripping.

That was a helpful response, thank you.

I’m not completely sold on the idea that transgender identity is a belief system. Because some people are born intersex and I’ve read about studies on the physiological similarities in the brains of women and transwomen compared to men. So I feel like it’s a lot more complex than ‘mostly a sexual fetish’.

I also want to reiterate that I’m more than capable of caring about my own rights and the rights of other woman whilst simultaneously caring about trans rights.

That’s my point- that they are not mutually exclusive.

But otherwise, I found this helpful, thank you. Your comments are creating interesting discussions in my home and I think that can only be a good thing.

I have to admit that I have absolutely no idea what you're wittering on about. You've no interest in discussing anything, its just the same old soundbites over and over. Almost like you're trying to provoke a negative reaction via frustration.
Not playing your silly game.

I thought you wanted their rights revoked. But you don’t. You want the trans community to have the same rights as everyone else. You want transwomen to be respected and treated with dignity.

So I genuinely fail to see where we disagree.

Yes!!