Sibling fallout - who is being unreasonable

[wasabipeas]

I’m trying to keep this neutral because I’ve lost perspective on this situation so please be gentle…

3 siblings - A, B and C. All married with DCs

A is very well off, big house, lots of holidays, skiing etc
B is doing ok, has a holiday every year but camping/Eurocamp or self catering sort of things
C has the least money of all of them, due to working in a low-paying industry and wouldn’t ordinarily take DCs ‘away’ on holiday but would do day trips locally etc

For the last few years, family A has offered to take family C on holiday. Not joining their usual long haul but Centreparcs or a week in a cottage which Family A pays for

A and C have returned from a holiday recently, and B asked C how it was.
C said it was great, B said, half jokingly ‘I look forward to it being our turn for the free FamilyA holiday scheme one day’

C tells A what was said, A contacts C and says that it’s not about free holidays so much as giving kids who wouldn’t otherwise have a holiday something, where as B’s kids get a holiday every year, so this isn’t something that B is going to come to as long as they are able to give their kids a holiday

A is cross and B being entitled, B is cross at their kids being excluded, C is stuck in the middle of it

Who IBU?

if it makes any difference, A and C are the same gender

I feel extremely sorry for B.
The set up between A & C sounds toxic and exclusionary.
B has my utmost sympathy.

Why “exclusionary”? Family A invited Family C along with them. If they’d also invited B, would they then have excluded their in-laws? And then would they have excluded OP’s parents? People do things together in different groupings. People have different relationships that work in different ways. That’s life; nothing wrong with that.

It’s kinda like wedding invites. Weird to invite 1 uncle/sibling but not other. I mean - in a family of 5 or even 4 you can get away with it - because you just invite 1 from a large group of identically related people. But in a group of 3 it makes it hard to tell whether you are inviting 1 or excluding the other iyswim. That’s why friendship groups of 3, or sibling groups can be tricky.

I am in a similar situation to B. In my case, my two older siblings often holiday together, but I am not invited along. The reasons are logical - at first we couldn’t afford to go when we were younger; then their children are similar ages while my DC is younger, so the holiday wouldn’t suit us (teenagers vs primary school age). I also suspect that one of my BIL doesn’t like me or my DH, though he is generally polite (if occasionally sneery - but he’s only joking, of course).

All logical reasons to be excluded, but it still hurts. I think you have underestimated how painful it feels to be the left-out sibling, and to know that your children are missing out on family holidays too.

I also noticed that @wasabipeas hasn’t mentioned B’s partner while criticising B for having enough money because she only works part-time - presumably to spend time with her young children, though that’s not as worthy as C and Mrs C with their low-paying jobs. Is he also in a low-paid job and should earn more so they can have a better holiday, or is that all B’s fault, somehow.

@wasabipeas

It's none of B or MILs business of you and C get on so well that you've had a few family holidays with DCs together. It's no one's business who pays for the accomodation I'd C & A are happy with their arrangements.

Same as it's NOYB if B and C or MIL and B or whomever spend time together doing activities that A isn't invited to.

B is a massive tw*t and so is MIL

It's very entitled of them expecting A to pay for B to have a holiday just because A earns more money. Or that you paid for the holiday/s C and DCs went to. So what? That is NOTHING to do with B or MIL

That's not how it works when you're adults and siblings. This isn't an inheritance to share, this is your hard earned money and holiday time and you have chosen to catch up with one sibling you get one well with and have cousins who enjoy holidays together. You have no obligation to do it for each sibling/ family. That's ridiculous

Here's your reply "(Button it) That's appalling entitlement from you ( MIL/) and sibling B. It's our hard earned money and our AL and if Bro and I want to go on holiday together with our DCs that's our call and NOYB"

OP, I can see why your DH moved away years ago! He/you are entitled to invite who the hell you like on your holidays. MIL should butt out; it's nothing to do with her and your DH needs to tell her that. B needs to be told that just because C got a 'free' holiday, it doesn't entitle her to have one. God, the sibling 'its not fair' grizzling should have stopped by now surely?!

Such a shame that a nice gesture has turned to bite you on the arse.

I think A and C being the same sex is relevant, B might have felt left out of other things.

Being the middle one of three can be a pain, you never seem to get the advantages of the eldest or the youngest and get the downside of both so maybe B is a bit chippy to start off with.

The OP said in a later post that besides being the only girl, B is the youngest. B is the little sister who runs to her mummy every time her older brothers won't "let" her play.

I don’t think it’s nonsense 🤷🏻‍♀️ A may well be able to cope with issues that arise, but that doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t appreciate a heads up. That may well be the relationship the bothers have formed over the years, especially if B has form for running and telling on them.

It sounds like B suffers from golden child-itis. She's not used to hearing no, or not getting her own way, or not getting the best of everything.

OP you say you spend a lot of time with B during the rest of the year. What's she like then? Does it all have to be on her terms, do you and your DH (and your DCs) always have to play it the way she wants, do the activities she decides?

In reality, no one is going to happily spend money and leave time on a holiday with someone they don’t particularly get on well with, potentially walking on eggshells to as to not upset someone who they find difficult.

Relationships are by nature exclusionary, how good they are depends entirely on the individuals involved, and the bottom line is that you don’t owe the same thing to everyone. Its honestly fucking weird what people think they’re entitled to expect from their adult siblings in the name of fairness. They’re not parents doling out set amounts to their young children.

If A doesn’t get on as well with B as he does with C that’s fine. Thats normal, even. What isn’t normal is an adult running to mummy to complain because she thinks she’s entitled to get what she wants. She isn’t. She doesn’t have to like it but she does have to respect the fact that her brothers are adults and entitled to run their relationship with one another in the way they want to.

In reality, no one is going to happily spend money and leave time on a holiday with someone they don’t particularly get on well with, potentially walking on eggshells to as to not upset someone who they find difficult.

Exactly. And having a strop about it is hardly going to make them want to. Sounds spoilt, tbh.

I would ignore all the posters having a pop at you OP. You are grown up's spending your own money how you like, going on holiday with people you like. I have several family members that I genuinely like and love to see them for the day - that does NOT make us compatible holiday partners tho so I totally understand not wanting to go away with B.

Yup. I really don’t see any issue with C saying anything either. My brother and I are the same. Advanced warning of an incoming heat seeking guided missile in the form of the matriarch means that we can decide between answering the phone, or sending it straight to voicemail with a not-today-Satan.

FWIW OP as at least a few of the PPs say, I think you are entirely reasonable and should manage the golden child's expectations and PIL's in the tactically least worst way while not inflicting on yourself a terrible joint holiday or precluding an enjoyable holiday with C's family. Other people's desires to spend your money and holiday time can be ignored 'that sounds nice but I don't think it will work though don't worry, we won't feel excluded PIL if you go away with B and C's family.... Good luck.

Reading some of these posts saying it’s totally fine to leave a sibling out of a family holiday, you can really see why some families are screwed and always be. It doesn’t occur or matter to some people that they are hurting their sibling’s feelings, creating divisions snd tension that will last a life time - as long as they can ‘spend their money’ as they please and do what they want as they are adults. In my world developing maturity, a sense of justice and compassion is requisite as we become adults, we become responsible and aware. Not selfish toddler behaviour - ‘my money my choice’. So utterly childish and almost backward behaviour.

We are fair in our family, everyone is included or no one. I would hate for this kind of bullying and back biting to happen.

If I was B I would drop you all!!
Who needs enemies when you have family like this?! I would have great friends and move very far away and not be involved with any of you. Horrid family.

Reading some of these posts saying it’s totally fine to leave a sibling out of a family holiday

But it’s not “a family holiday”. It’s A’s holiday with his family - and his wife has asked C and family to come along. I agree - different if A, C and the PIL all sat down and said, “Where shall we go?”. But this is A’s gig and his money. Totally different scenario.

It’s not a ‘family holiday’ it’s two siblings who are also friends having a holiday. It’s hardly the whole family fucking off and leaving one out.

Family members having to holiday together, no matter whether they get on or not or would even enjoy it, in the name of obligation and ‘fairness’ sounds like enmeshed hell me tbh. I’m quite glad I’ve been assigned to another circle I’m not an inhabitant of your world. I would much rather deal with the long term consequences of conducting my life and relationship as I see fit to, than the long term consequences of seething in resentment as I put up and shut up.

Yes I did see that later, being presented as A B C it seemed logical that B was the middle child. Don't you think you might feel a bit left out if your two siblings went on holiday together regularly and you were never invited? My siblings do and I don't feel left out, I've never seen the joy in group holidays, but I am open minded enough to see that it might hurt someone who does feel excluded.

I don't think you can justify the "who runs to her mummy every time her" because they've clearly done it several times without her running to her mother so that was just being unpleasant wasn't it.

Two siblings going off on holiday and the third not being invited is surely the definition of leaving one out. I mean if there were half a dozen siblings it would be different but if there are 3 and one gets left out then yes one is getting left out.

Do you think the daughter became the golden child because her brothers always left her out? So the parents became a bit protective of her because God forbid we should expect her big brothers to look out for her. Is she even the golden child or does she get that label because her parents have dared to stand up for her on occasion?

Sounds like a horrible family dynamic.

Absolutely @wasabipeas can invite who she and her DH like on holiday, and don’t have to treat both siblings equally. I think though that OP needs to own the fact that this is because B is difficult and they don’t want to go away with her, and not dress it up as some kind of fairness issue.

whump I think you have placed the seething resentment on your siblings. Siblings are not ‘friends’ they are siblings and as such part of the same family unit whether you like it or not.

Consistently choosing one sibling over another to go on holiday is pure favouritism, there are thousands of examples of research and studies to support the view that this kind of behaviour creates barriers, tension, resentment and unhappiness within families.

Regardless of the reasons why A consistently leaves out B to the detriment of their own nieces and nephews missing family holidays year after year is largely irrelevant.
The point is that they are causing pain and suffering to their sibling and family.
You seem to confuse enmeshment with fairness. Most odd.
Now clearly you couldn’t care less about anyone else as long as YOU feel okay and get to do whatever you want …. To hell with the consequences and at least you haven’t bothered to hide your selfish motivations with your ‘me first and foremost’ outlook towards your ish family.

I feel sorry for your family - as you say the long term consequences are real and they probably can not stand you, and see you as the self absorbed selfish monstrosity that is devoid of all values, love and ethics that are you are. A right piece of work.

Are you A by any chance?

Money doesn’t give you a free pass to bully.

sure, if the definition of ‘family’ means only siblings.

It’s a wild concept I know, but they are perfectly entitled to spend time with people they want to, and leave out the ones who they don’t. It’s also entirely normal. Maybe you invite along people your don’t want to holiday with, but you’d be the first person I’ve encountered that does that.

B can be upset about it, but it’s doesn’t mean A and B have done anything wrong. I have no idea why the mother is getting involved, like she has any authority over the individual relationships of her adult children.

I feel sorry for your family - as you say the long term consequences are real and they probably can not stand you, and see you as the self absorbed selfish monstrosity that is devoid of all values, love and ethics that are you are. A right piece of work.

The irony of someone saying they are full of ‘maturity, a sense of justice and compassion’ and then writing this sentence above to a complete stranger.