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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder why men hate women so much?

782 replies

YouAreNotBatman · 07/08/2022 11:09

Violence againt women, sexual harrasment.

Controlling women bodies.

Women’s sexuality: frigid prude if you don’t want sex, slut if you.

Porn, sex ”work”.

All the MRA’s, mgtow, incels etc.

Even historically speaking they have no reason to be angry at women, women never had any power, mostly tried to accommodate to men’s demand/ wants, I think it still goes on.

Many women still tip toe the line to placate men.

What reason do they have to be so angry at women?

OP posts:
Moonface123 · 07/08/2022 12:46

l can' t relate to all men hate women, its a victim mentality, women are not hapless victims but this seems to be general concensus on here.
M y son who is 17 runs on a treadmill at home specifically because he is over 6 ft tall, muscular build and worried of unnerving a female whilst running past her, and on a mens running forum the number one fear of men running outside is unwittingly scaring a woman, but no one wants to hear stuff like this on here. l don ' t agree all men hate women.

Deadringer · 07/08/2022 12:46

As a class men are stronger, more aggressive and more violent than women, and boy have they benefited from it. Even the kindest, most gentle men in the world have benefited from it, so there isn't too much incentive for them to deal with it, as long as 'their women' are safe.

Suetodo88 · 07/08/2022 12:47

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits

I really think thinking anything can be “too male” is a problem not a strength. Why should it be wrong for something to be all male? Or all female? Or some other things to be mixed.

I think those studies are highly political.

Most (all) of the men I’ve heard talk about that work stuff resent it a lot.

RainCloud · 07/08/2022 12:48

It's a conundrum isn't it. They want to have sex with us but slut shame the ones who have sex with "too many" men.

Deadringer · 07/08/2022 12:49

And I don't hate men at all BTW, I have a dh and a lovely gentle son as well as several brothers who would all jump off a cliff before they intentionally hurt anyone, but still they have benefited from the power other men hold over women as a class.

Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits · 07/08/2022 12:50

Moonface123 · 07/08/2022 12:46

l can' t relate to all men hate women, its a victim mentality, women are not hapless victims but this seems to be general concensus on here.
M y son who is 17 runs on a treadmill at home specifically because he is over 6 ft tall, muscular build and worried of unnerving a female whilst running past her, and on a mens running forum the number one fear of men running outside is unwittingly scaring a woman, but no one wants to hear stuff like this on here. l don ' t agree all men hate women.

The OP didn't say ALL men, she said men - men as a class, as a sex, as a subset

Like saying cats catch mice doesn't mean all cats catch mice
Or birds can fly doesn't negate the dodo

It's great that your son cares about women enough to not want to go out running behind women and scare them, thats frigging awesome.

But given he's come to that conclusion seeing how many women say they are scare, kinda means there is a reason for that fear. And that reason - men. Not all men but always men.

VandyCan · 07/08/2022 12:51

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits but men as a class don't hate women

It's like saying women love the colour pink

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 12:51

I think it's because we give life. We can do something they never will be able to.

VandyCan · 07/08/2022 12:52

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 12:51

I think it's because we give life. We can do something they never will be able to.

Yet

SallyWD · 07/08/2022 12:54

I think it's interesting that the male hormone responsible for sexual desire (testerone) is the same hormone responsible for aggression/violence. I think for some men the line between sex and violence is somewhat blurred. I have a good circle of men in my life and can say with confidence that none of them hate women - but I'm well aware that male violence is a huge problem in general.

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 12:54

Yet

What a strange comment.

VandyCan · 07/08/2022 12:55

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 12:54

Yet

What a strange comment.

Hardly strange

Reproductive transplants are already medically possible

It's not too much of a jump to think in 20-30 years time biological males will be able to give birth if they so wish.

HopeIsNotAStrategy · 07/08/2022 12:56

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 07/08/2022 11:47

I don’t think that men automatically hate women, but I do think that many, maybe even most, would like to control them. You just have to look at every documented culture in history to see that men dominate society through physical strength, and that they use that domination to control women, to limit their access to education, to political power, to autonomy . I suppose it stems ultimately from the sad truth that most men prefer sex with women, and that they need women to bear children .
The last few decades in Western societies have been an anomaly for women. My great grandmother was able to vote in the last decade of her life. My grandmother was an adult before she was first able to vote. My mother was the first woman in her family to be educated above secondary school, greatly against the wishes of her father ( my grandmother had money of her own from an inheritance - another fairly recent innovation- and was able to pay for it, though at great emotional cost).

I was able to go to university, although at my university there were five women’s colleges, and more than thirty men’s. I was still asked at interviews if I was married or had a fiancée, with the strong suspicion that I would give up work to look after children. The availability of reliable contraception on the NHS meant that my denial was accepted as a real possibility. Sex before marriage was beginning to be acceptable, without being branded as a n amateur prostitute.

I saw the first woman Prime Minister, and the first women priests in the COE.

I never thought that I would live to see so many women’s rights being minimised or overridden for the privilege of men. That men can access women’s private spaces, their places in women’s roles, merely by saying that they are women. That the very word Woman would be i d’ici able by politicians and church leaders, and that women would be threatened with rape and death for saying that women are adult human females.

I think that many men have harboured resentment at women’s freedom, and at their successful use of that freedom, and that they are fighting to reduce or eliminate it. I don’t know what motivates the Stella and Caroline’s who enthusiastically join in.

Great post @Allthegoodnamesarechosen . I've just shown it to my DH and he agreed.

Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits · 07/08/2022 12:56

Suetodo88 · 07/08/2022 12:47

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits

I really think thinking anything can be “too male” is a problem not a strength. Why should it be wrong for something to be all male? Or all female? Or some other things to be mixed.

I think those studies are highly political.

Most (all) of the men I’ve heard talk about that work stuff resent it a lot.

See the thing is I don't give a shit if they resent it

I resent having to work harder than my male colleagues to get men in the company to take me seriously

I resent getting talked over or talked for.

I resent my gender getting paid less for the same job

I resent that in every company I have ever worked for the only woman on the board is the head of HR/People&Culture and that they get wheeled out at every opportunity as their symbol of equality (and its normally a white woman at that)

I resent the fact that 98% of women aged 18-25 have been sexually harassed by men

I resent all of the domestic violence and shit I read about on the relationship boards here. The men who are terrible fathers and terrible husbands and terrible men. Not all men but enough men.

So I don't give a shiny shit that they resent having to budge over slightly to make some space for women. So fucking what.

And actually I think you are wrong that all men resent it. There is a big movement at my workplace at the moment around how to stop some of the sexist behaviour I mention above, and how to promote more equality and its a man who started it and its men who are championing it.

They are the good ones and fair play to them. Because there are some fabulous men out there and I would love to hear their voices more instead of them being drowned out by the crappy ones.

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 12:57

It's not too much of a jump to think in 20-30 years time biological males will be able to give birth if they so wish

Oh ffs. It's Sunday, go away with your science fiction nonsense.

entropynow · 07/08/2022 12:58

YouAreNotBatman · 07/08/2022 11:25

@Topgub

It’s a great quite.

But also, isin’t time then to raise the boys to know they are not entitled to sex?
Pretty tall order now with the internet porn and kids growing up on it, but still…

Also, how true is it really.
I mean adult virginity is like 1%, so it’s not like men don’t have sex.
And, as long as they son’t care - and they don’t seem to care, they could get a sex worker ( I don’t support this to be clear).
But it’s not like men aren’t having sex.

Ah, but it's not EXACTLY when, how, from whom,and how often they want it. And how dare women have their own wishes and autonomy, the bitches? 🤓

VandyCan · 07/08/2022 12:59

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 12:57

It's not too much of a jump to think in 20-30 years time biological males will be able to give birth if they so wish

Oh ffs. It's Sunday, go away with your science fiction nonsense.

People in the 80's thought many things that are the norm now were science fiction nonsense

If you don't understand that's fine, but I'll bet in 30 years this will be medically possible

Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits · 07/08/2022 12:59

VandyCan · 07/08/2022 12:51

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits but men as a class don't hate women

It's like saying women love the colour pink

98% of women between the ages of 18-25 have been sexually harassed by men.

The vast majority of women beaten and killed are beaten and killed by men. I think its something ridiculous like 99%.

When those figures drop then I will be interested in entertaining the notion that men as a class don't hate women.

Some men are great, some are fabulous, some are just okay but that's fine. But a higher than average number are not. Therefore statistically on average men as a class hate women.

entropynow · 07/08/2022 13:01

Also to all the people attacking transwomen on this thread, bog off. Transwomen are at least as much in danger from cis men as we are.
They are not the problem.

WalkingOnTheCracks · 07/08/2022 13:02

Deadringer · 07/08/2022 12:46

As a class men are stronger, more aggressive and more violent than women, and boy have they benefited from it. Even the kindest, most gentle men in the world have benefited from it, so there isn't too much incentive for them to deal with it, as long as 'their women' are safe.

…er…the incentive might be that they have daughters. I mean, if you want a reason other than simple humanity.

Suetodo88 · 07/08/2022 13:05

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits

The point I was making is if they create the workplace in the first place they’re entitled to want control of it. So it very much matters if they resent it as if they just refuse to let you take part (and if enough of them wanted to they could) that’s it.

So instead of just always wanting men to “budge up” and receive equality through asking (or demanding) to be given a place by them in what they’ve made, I really think it would be wiser for women to create more female workplaces etc.

I think it’s fine for men to have their own things so long as they don’t stop women from making things of their own too. I think we’re different. I don’t want my sons weighed down like that.

VandyCan · 07/08/2022 13:06

entropynow · 07/08/2022 13:01

Also to all the people attacking transwomen on this thread, bog off. Transwomen are at least as much in danger from cis men as we are.
They are not the problem.

This is MN when do posters not attack trans women.

Topgub · 07/08/2022 13:06

@entropynow

Its not a coincidence transwomen are often in conflict with women.

MbatataOwl · 07/08/2022 13:07

Where has anyone attacked transwomen on this thread?! Confused

VandyCan · 07/08/2022 13:07

@Sheepreallylikerichteabiscuits

Men as a class do not hate women

Saying men as a class hate women is saying all men do. What is so hard to understand

Do you agree with me saying women as a class love the colour pink and to bake?

Because some do.