Why do the huggers always win?

[GetYourSeasideArmsOffMe]

I don't like hugging outside of my immediate family and in certain circumstances like grief. It feels forced and unnatural to me.
So why do I end up having to give out hugs like they are candy? People I don't know well, forcing themselves into my personal space and trying to create an intimacy that isn't there?
Can't the huggers ask consent?
Do people actually like hugging or do most people just do it because it is expected? I think it's a female socialisation thing and we should cut that crap, DH doesn't get strong armed into forced hugs nearly as much as me.

Yabu- hugging is great and everyone should do it.
Yanbu- everyone should cut it out and I only hug because it's expected.

And no, I do not need a hug.

OP I try to give the don't hug me signals but I have now taken to saying 'I don't do hugs' which sometimes gets sniggers but I do not care! Obviously different with DC!

Also very vocal when family try to strongly encourage kids to hug - I say be thankful for a high five do not force a hug.

In UK any unwanted touch is an assult so you could always threaten to take it further if people don't listen to you.

I am a huggy person but wouldn't dream of doing it to those who don't like or want a hug as I respect them as an individual to have their own feelings taken into account.
People I don't know or just met I would just ask them if they wanted a hug and respect their reply.

Good for you. Glad you're happy. Has reading this thread made you understand a bit more when some of us wouldn't enjoy your unwarranted hugs and kisses AT ALL?

I wish I could swap in someone who gets boundaries like you into my circle.
The problem is you are stuck with who you get.

I am not a hugger But I dont't feel its a big deal either way.

I choose who I want to be hugged by. Family, close friends- and that's it.

But there was one woman, at my club, who insisted on trying to hug me. I didn't even know her that well- she was from a different area- and yet she was trying to envelop me in her arms.

I did the whole crossed arms, turn my body away- just as my 6'2" instructor did. As she went up to him (which was disrespectful anyway) he just said "No" so she desisted. But when I said the same, she said "Oh I'm just being friendly! It's just a hug! Come on, don't be mean!"

That just annoyed me even more though so I said no, I don't 'do' hugs, please leave me alone.

Somehow this meant that I was mean, harsh and unfriendly. But she never tried it again, so I was the winner.

As I explained to a few people- it's not on to invade someone's personal space just because you feel like it. It's not on to insist on full body contact. And if someone doesn't welcome your attentions, you should respect that, because one day someone might be a whole lot more forceful than I was in their refusal of them.

The cup of tea thing is interesting. People push unwanted alcohol if you're out at a pub and fags if you're an ex smoker and you're also considered weird if you don't want to join in with it. Also holidays such as xmas and all that tat.

With hugging, could you make yourself more weird by being very vocal at saying no. As in 'Don't touch me!' as the hugger is coming in? Or 'What are you doing?' as if they are being the weird one? I love hugging but usually approach with open arms giving the choice rather than just grabbing the other person into a hug.

Not sure if my suggestions are helpful but then I'm quite good at telling others where they stand with me (not always liked for that but it makes me a happier person overall).

People think I'm absolutely nuts because I'm constantly thinking about and talking about consent, outside of certain circles I'm in talking about and thinking about consent is really not a big thing and not something people think about in day to day functioning. It seems to only be people with experience of safeguarding, abuse and/or neurodiversity who consider consent at all, and even then not as robustly or consistently than is ideal. Mumsnet has a lot of really clued up people parents and professionals (I'm 2 of the 3 so far but going for the 3rd as well!) on this issue, but the number of teachers, therapists, social workers, health workers etc. I come into contact with who seem to really struggle with the issue of consent (and these are fields where people at least do receive training around this, which is not compulsory) is really quite shocking to me, when consent is something that I think about in all my interactions including with my children, in my work, in my social interactions. I feel like you either 'get it' or you don't, but most people really don't. And will put social convention and their personal wants, over the other persons bodily autonomy without seeing an issue, whilst feeling offended if the other person reacts negatively in any way

A friend of my DH who I hardly know and tbh don't like much, lunged at me once to hug me goodbye. I stepped back and told him he was being too familiar! He looked aghast but said nothing. Obviously went home to tell his wife though. Some time after when I met him and his wife, the man kept his distance but his wife very purposefully lunged at me for a hug before I could deter her. I truly believe she knew damn well I wasn't a hugger (especially of people I hardly know) but wanted to 'get even' on the hug front!! Never met them again or I would have had to say something choice.

Hugging seems to be more of this generation to me, growing up in the 70s 80s you didn't hug anyone apart from your mum or dad and even then it wasn't that often (maybe my family was the exception I dunno) and I absolutely never used to hug friends. I remember when my kids were in primary school in the early 2000s it started being a thing they'd all hug when they met eachother. That caused a big spike in headlice as I recall!

I am not a hugger and I'd rather not if at all possible.

I get your frustration.

I once had a colleague give me a hug (not offer) and say that it was for her benefit but I was the one who was in a state. I completely stiffened and stood there thinking WTF!

I am not comfortable with hugs and kisses from people I don’t know well or only just met. But my upbringing, and being female, put me in the ‘be kind’ box. I’ve broken out! I try to keep a civil distance and avoid.

With my husband and family I’m very tactile so it’s not about touching, it’s who. And I’ve no trauma attached to this, no diagnosis, no issue. Just like my own space and to choose who comes into it. (Also the reason I don’t like animals who, obviously, don’t understand the concept of ‘my’ space.)

I’m going to be blunt, but it’s not meant unkindly - if you have to choose between being hugged and being thought to be odd, what would you choose?

Definitely the latter. People already think I'm odd and it bothers me not at all.

I have never been a hugger. Maybe it was the way I was raised? My family are very loving but we’ve never done the hugging thing.
I first came across other people outside of family hugging when I first started working in an office with lots of women. We would work together all day then sometimes all meet up in the evening for drinks/meals etc and as soon as we all met up in the car park they would all start hugging each other. I thought it was weird as they’d only been together just an hour or two earlier and they were all hugging like long lost friends at the arrival area of an airport.
I have a few ‘huggy’ friends but they don’t hug me anymore. I go as stiff as a board when someone hugs me, I think they get the message that way lol!

I have never minded telling people to not embrace me. Who cares what people think.

There is cultural hugging and then there is also unwanted hugging such as the very sweet ladies who used to be in my bible study class, it was non threatening but I told them please not to. Then there is what you are describing which is actually dirty men copping the odd feel.

You don’t have boundaries at all, what was your childhood like as it often stems from your upbringing.

Men can sniff out vulnerable women. Before people start accusing me of victim blaming I was told this when doing fund raising work for a DV charity.

And people who don't like hugging often have high anxiety about social stuff and getting things wrong.
As the huggers are claiming this position of greater social confidence I think it's up to them to lead the way and listen to signs.

To be honest I couldn't take you seriously after this OP. Are you one if those that thinks noone else has social anxiety and loads of people are just sailing through life confident internally just because you see it externally? I would say you are also not great at reading other people

Please just say no!

I'm not a hugger per se but it doesn't bother me, and sometimes I'll go for a hug. A friend once just stopped me in my tracks and said "sorry I don't do hugs". And that was that. No hug, no offence taken, we're still friends.

Exactly what kind of greeting people expect or enjoy is a bloody minefield tbh.

There was a similar thread a few years back.

One poster who was a hugger was so adamant that she had to hug people and that they would realise how much they liked a hug once she’d hugged them.

The lack of self awareness was quite unbelievable, like her supposed entitlement to hug people somehow overrode anyone’s feelings.

My childhood was fine. My family aren't overly buggy just where it is necessary.
I don't think I have a problem with setting boundaries. I have a problem with people ignoring my boundaries. That's why it's not just dirty old men, but old ladies and family members.
As I said, I'm petite and young looking and not overly assertive so I would say I look an easy target.
I also don't think my experience is unusual. Certainly many people on this thread seem to agree. But I differ from you to where you see a victim I look to the opportunists. If people create loose barriers around consent they'll use it.
And yes, in the case of men probably on the ones who they think they can overpower, intimidate or silence.
But it doesn't mean that it's up to the recipient of unwanted touching to be more assertive. If we had a consent model I wouldn't have to assert myself.

Love this picture of determined huggers!

You are right. I probably don't have much social awareness. Who knows.
That's not a reason to erode my boundaries.
Also my lack of social awareness results in nobody being touched against their consent or made to feel uncomfortable. If you are choosing to invade someone's space without consent I'd hope your be damn confident in your assessment in whether it is unwanted. It is not neutral. Not hugging someone is neutral.

Huggy not buggy.
It's the other side that have boundary issues.

I find putting my arms out with the palms turned towards the person approaching me while saying ‘I don’t do hugs’ works very well. If they look offended or say anything, I’ll offer a handshake. Unfortunately, I have hyperhydrosis (with very sweaty palms) so they always look a bit horrified if they accept my handshake!

I have zero sympathy for adults who cant say no. Sorry, I know it's British culture to feel awkward and uncomfortable with normal everyday interactions but boundaries over your own body aren't awkward or uncomfortable unless you make it.

And when you have repeatedly said no and still get overidden?
Or you put up with it to begin with because it was expected and when you say no people use that previous consent for consent?
Or when you don't say anything at all because you weren't expecting it and then it progresses to a sexual assaults.
Do you have sympathy then?

It's a two way thing. If I have to say no. You should ask.

I've never been a very huggy person, usually I turn them down but there's one person I just can't escape. She abandoned owned one of my dogs before I got him. Now whenever I run into her, I get talked at for 15 minutes and more hugs than I can count, like we're the best of friends. The worst part is that it's all so fake, I bet she doesn't even remember my name 😅