Ukrainian guest …I’m not feeling comfortable

[CookieDoughKid]

I’ve been hosting a Ukrainian mother and 15yo daughter since beginning of May. We get on ok although we live very different lives even before the war. She’s a SAhM and I’m a working mum full time. It’s been difficult for her to adjust because her husband used to do everything, such as banking, booking train tickets, appointments. It’s been a real learning curve having to stand on her own feet here. Fortunately she can speak some English so over time, I have been able to take a step back from supporting her on how to live in England. her dd will be taking GCSE exams next summer term.

My kids and her dd don’t like each other and don’t get on. The mother is a bit work shy in that she is very choosy about jobs being offered to her by the job agency. She does a week here or there. Nothing permanent or full time. She is not claiming UC after it was made apparent she would have to look for work or go back to work full time. Her husband is supporting her financially. I broached the subject of long term accommodation and the challenges of finding rent. I was surprised to learn they have 10000 USD saved, husband has a good job in software in Ukraine. They are prepared to rent but would rather not as they don’t want to ‘waste their money’. I know they’d rather go back home if the war was over.

I had pledged at the start to give them half of the £350 thank you money from Gov to be used as a deposit for their rent when they move on. That’s £150 a month I would give to them for the 12 months commitment. I keep £150. I know I don’t have to do it but I wanted them to feel like they have some longevity here without too much hardship. That was prior to me learning about their savings. With everything going on at home, me working full time, my two teens…I’m finding it all a bit much. The mother is lovely but so talkative and she’s always there. Sand my day is incredibly busy, I travel for work, I have my own children to look after.

what gripes me is that she also doesn’t pay a single thing or offer when I’ve said from the start she needs to sort it herself I’m talking about washing powder and sundries….she does pay her own food. I’m starting to resent the fact that she never offers to pay for dishwasher tablets, stationery paper, toilet roll, cling film, aluminium foil, washing powder, cleaning goods, kitchen napkins etc… It all adds up.

Come October, it will have been 6 months of me hosting. Would I be unreasonable to ask her to plan on moving out …I think I can tolerate them living with me to Jan 2023 (that would be 9 months in total) but she’s mentioned she wants to stay with me till next June so that her dd can sit her exams without interruption.

Should I ask for a household contribution? And what about the £150 a month I pledged? It’s not that I can’t afford it, I can but I feel I’m being taken for a ride.

she mentioned she wanted help in applying for UC housing benefit in the future which does not sit well with me knowing she is supported by her husband, has savings and is choosy with jobs?

fwiw, we both try very hard to get on. She’s helpful sith cleaning and so am I, and we have a good rhythm in sharing the kitchen etc. we don’t argue and we haven’t had any major spats.

it’s just that I am finding it hard to live with someone who is so different in outlook to me and living with us full stop. My dad was a refugee, he held down 3 jobs 7 days a week for a while and that work ethic is very strong in me (I don’t rely on my husband financially and never have but that’s my choice). I know if I was to live with someone not out of choice I would work really hard, and try to move out as soon as possible!

would like your perspective on this. I feel really guilty even thinking about asking her to move out but also, I feel they would have had 8 or 9 months free living so..isn’t that generous in itself?

Those attacking the op about the £350 . Wow just wow . As if £350 covers any more than the costs associated! Water , electricity , gas for all day use it seems as the family doesn’t go out to work , for heating/cooling , washing , showers , cooking . I bet if laundry detergent is not bought then no dishwasher , cleaning supplies or shower ones .
by all means have a different opinion to mine but saying the op is profiteering from this just plain wrong ! She probably assumed the guests would dia bit more for themselves and some of those costs would be covered since they do have access to the working market and universal credit . I think most would

I reckon that having two additional people in the house costs us about £600 in additional household products and food as well as utility costs. Many of us bought new bedding, towels and basics for our guests, to make them feel welcomed. The £350 helps with additional costs but does not cover them. No one does this for the money unless they are not that great with numbers!! Many hosts are finding that the current increases in costs of living is making hosting more difficult. Some have more then two guests and it must he remembered that the £350 is per household per month and for many will be stopping soon. The posters throwing accusations of profiteering around are being inflammatory and nasty not to mention ignorant of the facts.

As someone who also has a guest I sympathise with you. Our guest is also very self-entitled. I started off feeling very altruistic but I now want her gone before Christmas. Main reason is she just won’t integrate with us where eating together is concerned. I think if I don’t set a deadline she will just be here moaning that she doesn’t have a hugely well-paid job for the duration of the war (because she doesn’t speak good English). She thinks we should get her a good job - this is because in her country her father would pick up the phone and get me a job. I’m so fed-up with being polite in the face of her assurances of the normality of such abuse of the system. This is Ukraine for you.

what’s that last bit about? What a cretinous thing to say. Also, if you ‘felt very altruistic’ then you’ve misunderstood what that word means.

gladysAilwood why do you have to do this up to Christmas? I think I’d talk to her about the end date and prepare her for it as soon as possible; someone so insufferable wouldn’t be staying with me until Christmas.

@Mfsf £350 doesn’t cover everything! I found your comment quite nasty tbh given what OP and others are doing .

It’s a very difficult situation. I am hosting a family in a separate house because there are four children with their mother. It’s costing a fortune and I’m really worried about winter bills. I need to speak to her about them either moving on or becoming tenants if they want to stay but I’m not sure how they would afford it. Particularly since they’ve become used to living rent and bills free with literally everything apart from food provided for them

Rebt on the property would be £800, bills another £400ish. She would struggle to work other than very part time with four young children in three different schools and no transport. I think she will be really shocked at the cost of living here.

Meanwhile, the husband is safe and working in another European country and the family are all on a fortnight’s holiday at the moment…

Just some factual clarification on the £350 - it is a thank you from the Gov to the host - it is not intended to cover any expenses and the host can ask the guest to pay towards bills.

The guests receive UC and if they were living in rented they would have to fund their food, utility bills, cleaning products, mobile phone etc from this payment as other UC claimants do.

www.litrg.org.uk/latest-news/news/220425-homes-ukraine-£350-thank-you-payments

Can my guest reimburse me for expenses?

“Under the Homes for Ukraine scheme, you are not expected to provide meals or meet living expenses, but you may choose to do so.”

If your Ukrainian guest reimburses you for the cost of food or other expenses, then this will not be taxable on you.

“You may also ask your guest to reimburse you for a reasonable share of utility bills, though see the information below about council tax.”

@Lemonblossom - is there a reason the family have not stayed together - can the Dad not work in the U.K. or is where he is working in the EU unsuitable for the family?

Have you spoken with the council liaison officer about moving the family on to paying rent which if the are claiming UC would be covered either in your property (if that’s what you want long term) - or elsewhere? These things take some time to set up so it’s important that you and your guest are clear on the process, timescales and costs involved otherwise you will be in an unnecessary very difficult situation at the end of your 6 months.

I have had this conversation already (3 months in) with my guests as they need to be informed and take responsibility (with support and encouragement) for the next step of their journey. My commitment has been to provide a safe and compassionate landing place for 6 months and during that time they restore their spirit and find their feet to become independent. It’s not an option to host indefinitely.

I do think that it’s quite a turning point this month as I expect many refugees believed this was temporary and they would be going home at the end of summer…..I think (an know) some are actually planning this if it’s possible / safe to return to their area - whilst for others the penny is dropping that the few months is now at least going to be a year.

Is there a reason she and her dcs can’t go and join her dh in the European country he is living? They shouldn’t be living apart and holidaying together whilst effectively expecting you to foot the bill.

Speaking English seems to be pretty key here...what is the mum doing to improve her English other than the breakfast chats with you?
There are plenty of online resources for this or maybe advertise for a volunteer to give her lessons. Once she has reasonable English she will be better able to navigate for herself and to find employment.
Has anyone explained the facts to her that she will need to have enough money from her husband or savings to support herself (and how much that will be) and if not will need to either work or claim benefits? Perhaps explain that this is how it is for everybody in the UK?
I'd say that the 3 month mark would be appropriate for her to review her forward plans and start taking steps towards them.
Are there online support groups if not in RL in your area?

A woman with a 4 children whose husband is working safely in Europe should be provided for by him. You surely didn’t get into this financial mess to supplement their income when they are free to live safely as a family. You need to act quickly to avoid untenable expenses over the winter. Help people who are in need and still waiting to get out of danger. Don’t throw all that money and hard work to support people who need to take responsibility for themselves. You footing all their bills in a separate house with no cap on power usage is ridiculous while the husband works elsewhere saving a stash. Wake up and look after yourself too.

That’s what I was telling , why do you find my comment nasty ? I’m defending the OP too

@Lemonblossom You need to give them
notice. If they are in another EU country then they can claim refugee status there

Actually, I don't think that's true. They can't go from england to Ireland for example as they would not be given temporary protection status. Unless they arrive from Ukraine they're economic migrants. Some Ukrainians were asking about this last week, if friends could come to Ireland from Italy and we were researching it for them and had to say no. They have to arrive from Ukraine or their status is just Ukrainian arrived from Italy. None of the same rights to emergency housing or welfare.

Mine came from Poland where they were for 3 months?

Maybe they didn’t have a specific refugee status in Poland?

Also mine have also gone on holiday a couple of times since arriving in U.K. so visa allows visits at least if their friends want to just visit?

I believe the situation is that you can only claim refugee status in the 'first country you arrive in' - however under the circumstances this description is slightly misleading and different. The EU position is slightly unusual for Ukrainian refugees, because they are trying to spread the load and its more like you can claim you are in transit to another destination under certain circumstances so its not as literal as the normal right to only claim in first country of arrival (so for example if you leave Ukraine and are applying for a visa or making arrangements to move to another country within a certain time frame).

However once you have registered as a refugee somewhere you cannot just chop and change at will. There are certain limitations on what you can do. The reasoning is to take pressure off certain countries (Poland) and to prevent abuse of the system. Therefore you might initally be able to register in a bordering country to Ukraine and then effectively 'transfer' to somewhere else, but you can't do this more than once. So you couldn't claim refugee status in the UK and then change your mind and then decide to claim it in the EU as you have left the EU nor could you register in Italy and then decide you either wanted to return to Poland or go to Ireland. You are stuck with your refugee status only being valid in Italy.

Of course this isn't necessarily being monitored and checked in practice although if found out, it could be an issue.

Refugees can travel and work as residents of the country they are registered with.

It does make sense, but yes, having one part of the family in a different country who is working definitely would make things more complex and a family reunion might not be as straightforward as you think.

If you are Ukrainian you currently have freedom of movement into and within the EU due to the war. This means you can still move for work or for recreation but you don't have the same rights as a refugee.

@RedToothBrush correct - although that is an EU directive rather than a global one. Therefore, they can come to the UK from another country now that the UK is out of the EU. But not the other way around

Thansk @Snog for your inputs and many other posters too many to name. Its come to a realisation that the mother will have to go back to work full time. The husband is also financially supporting his parents and I just don't think his funds stretch very far. Its either go back to work full time AND use up.your life savings or return home. The mother doesn't real qualify a lot for UC, she has financial support and savings. And it's just the realisation that life in UK is hugely expensive when the average salary in Ukraine is a lot less for example teachers get about only a couple hundred quid.
@Lemonblossom You're going to need to spell it to your family ASAP!!

Yes my situation is ridiculous. She’s very lovely though so it’s hard to tackle..

And yes I’m aware that of course she will be lovely when being supported by someone else to live for free in her own three bedroom house..

@Lemonblossom you are under no obligation to pay any bills (see my post above).

I would retract any payment of bills now before the winter sets in so that the mind is focused on reality.

Her DH needs to pay to feed and heat his children at the minimum if he is working full-time as he is not even paying their rental currently.

Don’t get stuck into some emotional guilt trip. You have done a great thing - but there is absolutely no way you should be financing this arrangement.

Is the issue that the DH is on low wages in a poorer part of the EU and trying to fund his wife and 4 DC in an expensive part of Europe ie U.K.?

If the DM can’t work (4 DCs not surprising) then as a family he needs to support them in a cheaper place commensurate with his wages - ideally together. I don’t understand why the family is split up?

Honestly just tackle it - get the council liaison person into a meeting so that it’s explained officially - otherwise it’s not realistic for anyone.

I had to take this step recently with my guests because they need to be clear what the next step entails.

No apparently he’s trying to set up a business. ..

I know, I know…