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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Can i have a rant about my Ukrainian guest

658 replies

fakenamefornow · 23/07/2022 19:50

Context, normal family home with teenage school children. Taken in mum and six year old, they're living in our spare bedroom (with ensuite) and living as part of the family. We didn't know them previously and they came directly from Ukraine to us. They're both lovely and generally easy to live with, been with us one month, no regrets. Just need a little anonymous rant to let off steam though.

Ukraine seems better than the UK in every way.

The food. She's a very good cook and makes lovely Ukrainian dinners for us. But British food is terrible, Ukrainian people would never eat so much processed food (she might have a point). They have processed food in Ukraine but only foreigners eat it. Ukrainians always cook fresh.

The health care. She's had three medical emergencies with her child since being here. First one, child had temperature of 38, (bouncing around playing looking in perfect health to me.) She was astonished that a doctor wouldn't immediately come to house to see child. Arranged GP appointment that afternoon (she doesn't drive, I had to take her) . Upset, angry and confused that antibiotics weren't given. She really just couldn't understand it at all. I Ukraine a doctor would have come to the house, day or night, and given medication, you treat small things immediately so they don't get big. Child had three days off school and spent the whole time running around playing.

Child had tiny abscess on gum, no pain or any other symptoms. This necessitated an immediate trip to the out of hours minor injuries unit (still appalled doctor wouldn't come to house). No treatment, told to ring 111 in the morning. I live in an NHS dentistry desert but because they've come from Ukraine a local dentist has taken them on as NHS patients. Had emergency dental appointment next day. Dentist said leave it alone, come back in two months time or if problem develops with it. Mum wanted minor surgery to remove/empty it and antibiotics. More anger and confusion. She can't believe how bad medical care is here (again, she might have a point). Anyway, more time off school for this.

Her appointment for biometrics was messed up (their fault not her's) and she missed the card delivery. So bureaucracy and postal service doesn't work here. She's applied for universal credit, no money yet though, and it seems ridiculous that she should go to the office every week. Nothing works well in this country. Even the streets are difficult to walk on because the pavement is uneven.

I know many Ukrainian have lost good lives to take children to safety and life probably was much better in Ukraine than it will ever be in UK. Hopefully this is temporary and they will be able to return. Her life in Ukraine, was living in a nice flat that was her mother's (mother dead, now hers) with her brother and her kid. She's divorced, kids dad not around, no contact for years. Worked as office manager (small company, not high flying) with good salary.

Really, she's lovely and very grateful.
I just need a little rant about a few things.

OP posts:
Momr · 23/07/2022 22:15

Flittingaboutagain · 23/07/2022 20:36

I typed out a message to a friend who asked how's it going and then deleted it because it sounds so petty in the scheme of things. But I completely get you. Talking about wanting to only eat healthy food then adding salt to absolutely everything and eating a packet of bourbons and custard creams every day and missing the meals we're preparing. We The dishwasher not sanitary but then double dipping in the houmous with bread sticks. Giving the two and three year olds caffeine and then they climb the walls so bedtime is up to 11pm. Big adjustment here!

I shared my kid caffeine when he was at that ages too as he wanted to taste my drink, he used to ask for more ..but he stopped having it on his own in the next year. It was okay to shar everything adults taste, isn't that how baby lead weaning happens!!

fakenamefornow · 23/07/2022 22:18

Thatswhyimacat · 23/07/2022 21:56

Sounds like an old friend of mine from Lebanon. According to her, EVERYONE there goes to university to at least Masters level, EVERYONE has the kind of healthcare you describe, EVERYONE has a housekeeper. They don't, she was just very wealthy and that was her own experience. Same as how Etonians in our country don't know what milk costs.

I had a friend from Kenya who said everyone had 'servants'. I said 'oh yeah, even the servants?

OP posts:
JustDanceAddict · 23/07/2022 22:18

People do eat too much processed food, but a GP shouldn’t be giving antibiotics for a temperature in any country, so she’s way off there.

justhereforthisthread · 23/07/2022 22:20

fakenamefornow · 23/07/2022 22:18

I had a friend from Kenya who said everyone had 'servants'. I said 'oh yeah, even the servants?

Grin

Servants who probably had no employment rights in a country with no minimum wage for 365 days a year. Yeah, that sounds like something we should all be aspiring to....

InChocolateWeTrust · 23/07/2022 22:21

the rest of Europe has far better standards of food prep

Speak for yourself. UK supermarket shelves have plenty of raw ingredients and plenty of us here cook with them.

eekyeeky · 23/07/2022 22:21

I know children who have been waiting more than 3 years to see an NHS dentist.

kinda proves the point?

Shandaz · 23/07/2022 22:25

We have a lot of foreign visitors, and I often end up feeling that Britain and the British are rubbish compared with the wonderful countries they come from. They always have better food than here, their health provision is better, their people are more sociable, their children are better educated and excel at sport, etc etc.

IronCurtain · 23/07/2022 22:25

MissHavershamJoinsTinder · 23/07/2022 20:38

There are over a million Ukrainian refugees in Poland and just under a million in Romania. Maybe you could make enquiries for her to get out of this shit hole and go to one of those locations.

Ukraine was not some Eden before the Fall. Significant parts of it were a corrupt shit-hole.

She sounds plain bloody rude and I'd be making plans for her to shift her arse elsewhere. She's pitched up in another country, you've taken her in. She has education for her child, a GP, a dentist and Universal Credit.

What else would she like?

This reply really annoyed me. Romania and Poland have taken in millions of refugees since the beginning of the war - and they are all housed, fed and clothed. Children going to school, students to university, healthcare assistance provided (yes, including the mental health support many on this thread believing we have never heard of in ‘Eastern Europe’). The vast majority of first hand accounts from how Ukrainian refugees have been welcomed in those countries show huge solidarity and practical support.

Yes Poland and especially Romania are much poorer than the UK (and should we go into a history lesson as to why?) and this is reflected in the standard of living. But for you to be so disparaging of the efforts to support Ukrainian refugees in those countries? That is frankly insulting.

thankfully I know most people in the UK, OP clearly included, have more empathy and understanding regarding what’s going on than you do.

Youcansaythatagainandagain · 23/07/2022 22:26

QueenCamilla · 23/07/2022 22:11

I doubt you'd say I'm from "Western Europe" as opposed to from UK.

In fact, I've never heard anyone utter a sentence that starts with something like : My friend from Western Europe...

The term "Eastern Europe" is often used to refer to all European countries that were previously ruled by communist regimes (the Eastern Bloc), due to the concept of the “Iron Curtain” separating Western Europe and Soviet-controlled Eastern Europe throughout the period of the Cold War.

Its a political term rather than a geographical term.

Shandaz · 23/07/2022 22:27

Oh, and if you have a plumbing problem someone will come round immediately and sort it for you. You're not on a waiting list for weeks like in my area. The same with other trades. And dentists. you don't have to wait weeks for the dentist to look at a serious dental problem.
We are behind other countries in lots of ways.

HijadelaLuna · 23/07/2022 22:27

Pyewhacket · 23/07/2022 22:13

The Germans, lecturing others on racism !!!!!!!. Oh the irony.

oh what a cheap Point. And i am not Even German but czech. Good Luck to you- i am sure you will cope with the very few refugees that make it to the uk while the rest of Europe looks After the vast majority

allibaby · 23/07/2022 22:28

HijadelaLuna · 23/07/2022 22:03

I am sorry but i think this is hilsrious . I Love the uk and its people but it might take some ukrainians to make you realise that you‘ve been fed lies for a long time and things from healthcare to scholing are shockingly bad in the uk🥴

Actually most people are fully aware of the problems we have here and we are also fully aware that most other countries have their problems too.

allibaby · 23/07/2022 22:30

HijadelaLuna · 23/07/2022 22:06

I‘m Not 😊

Good 😊

justhereforthisthread · 23/07/2022 22:34

HijadelaLuna · 23/07/2022 22:27

oh what a cheap Point. And i am not Even German but czech. Good Luck to you- i am sure you will cope with the very few refugees that make it to the uk while the rest of Europe looks After the vast majority

Because if you were going to flee a war there it would make sense that you would go to a neighbouring country. Funnily enough, Ukrainian refugees have fled to Russia, Poland, Moldova, Romania...

It's not rocket science, is it?

Entwifery · 23/07/2022 22:35

I've really got to say that I agree with her on the dental situation. I'm from another country and dental abscesses and infections are treated as an emergency there. My husband has an abscessed tooth and he has been pursuing treatment for it since March, and has just now been put on the waiting list for the local dental hospital. The tooth will probably just have to come out by the time they bother actually treating it! I think it's outrageous

QueenCamilla · 23/07/2022 22:39

User952539 · 23/07/2022 22:14

That’s because we are in Western Europe. Eastern Europe is a perfectly normal way to describe the former soviet/communist European countries

It very well may be a reasonable way to describe a region in terms of historical political situation (and some ongoing issues those regions face as a result of their historical political situation ).

However, the term has no use in wider conversation (particularly as a cultural reference).

Someone's Easter European friend is who? Eskimo? Azerbaijani? Polish? Bosnian? What am I supposed to deduct from "Eastern European" description?

gnilliwdog · 23/07/2022 22:42

eekyeeky · 23/07/2022 22:21

I know children who have been waiting more than 3 years to see an NHS dentist.

kinda proves the point?

No, I don't agree. Her point was that in Ukraine things are better for Ukrainians, not that in Britain things are bad for the British. Which they are. My point is that, given the lack of NHS dentists, British children should come first. Yes, it would be nice to have so many dentists they could take on Ukrainians as well as British children. That is not the reality. I would never expect a country that took me in to privilege my children to the detriment of their own.

SeGermanCzech · 23/07/2022 22:47

So which refugees
would be acceptable to you? This is not how asylum law works by the way…

fakenamefornow · 23/07/2022 22:49

User952539 · 23/07/2022 21:45

Can I join you op. My guests are lovely (mother and four children). However I’m struggling with the fact the they are about to go back to Ukraine on a five week “summer holiday”, plus the fact that the husband is in Spain working, plus the fact that I know they have assets in Ukraine and didn’t declare these when claiming universal credit. They have been very critical of our schools. They can’t believe how much bad behaviour is tolerated.

This makes them sound awful which they are not but I am feeling like I’m funding economic migrants rather than people truly in need. It’s costing us a lot of money. I have to admit to feeling a little jaded by it all.

I'm in touch with another family who have taken a mum and daughter in. The Ukrainian mum is really angry with many other Ukrainians who are here for reasons such as this. She said some people from western Ukraine have come here, living with UK families, claiming universal credit while working remotely in their Ukrainian jobs. Worse of all they rent out their homes, at a huge premium, in safe(r) areas of western Ukraine to people from eastern Ukraine who have been bombed out.

How she knows all this, I have no idea. I can't believe it's a lot of people doing this and if some are , well as far as I'm concerned, Ukraine is fighting the wests war, if some people are taking advantage, that's the price. Having said that, if someone in my house was doing that, I would be very clear with them, that I would be reporting them for benefit fraud if they didn't stop claiming.

OP posts:
SeGermanCzech · 23/07/2022 22:50

Beacause if we Go by „neighbouring countries“ you“ll Never get any untill things go very wrong in scotland🤣

Youcansaythatagainandagain · 23/07/2022 22:50

QueenCamilla · 23/07/2022 22:39

It very well may be a reasonable way to describe a region in terms of historical political situation (and some ongoing issues those regions face as a result of their historical political situation ).

However, the term has no use in wider conversation (particularly as a cultural reference).

Someone's Easter European friend is who? Eskimo? Azerbaijani? Polish? Bosnian? What am I supposed to deduct from "Eastern European" description?

Eastern Europeans - Historically, all countries that have been under the influence of the former Soviet Union were considered an eastern bloc (Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary, Ukraine, Belarus, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Romania, Moldova, Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro, Macedonia).

At some point, some of these countries will be seen as central Europeans or just Europeans but generations have referred to the Eastern bloc countries as Eastern Europeans and this is how people think.

You might not like it or agree with it but you can't change people's mindsets.

gnilliwdog · 23/07/2022 22:53

SeGermanCzech · 23/07/2022 22:47

So which refugees
would be acceptable to you? This is not how asylum law works by the way…

Sorry, what do you mean? Does asylum law state asylum seekers must receive NHS dentistry in preference to citizens? There is intense competition to get NHS treatment, particularly for children in poverty. Is there a law that preference for a place must go to refugees? Genuine refugees are always acceptable to me, that has nothing to do with whether they should have priority over citizens for NHS dentistry though.

worriedatthistime · 23/07/2022 22:55

@Hdj2047da but you don't have to live here if its so shit
No countfy is perfect and honest people know this
My friend is polish and some of things we have here is better whilst others are worse they say its just different things

MissAtomicBomb1 · 23/07/2022 22:55

@QueenCamilla
I'm being deliberately vague as I for obvious reasons I don't want to give away too much information about my family on Mumsnet.
Also I don't particularly want to invite a pile on from all the ex pats of said country, However it is pretty much as east as you can get so I'm not sure why describing its exact geographical location is now considered an insult? It is literally in Eastern Europe.

worriedatthistime · 23/07/2022 22:58

@gnilliwdog they probably do get priority yes , due to sutuations
The reality is though that we should all be entitled to an nhs dentist but we are lacking and thats an issue the goverment need to address
I went to my nhs dentist and he was I think from ukraine and he told me to get treatment i needed abroad as was a quarter of price and he was shocked by uk prices