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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be worried about Rainbows

234 replies

justanotherguider · 20/07/2022 08:57

As a guide leader and as a mother I find this worrying:

girlguiding.foleon.com/guiding-magazine/guiding-summer-2022/rainbow-girl

OP posts:
ScrollingLeaves · 22/07/2022 11:03

Didimum
Evidence-based practice is very important to me, so I'll always be interested in the review of that for all industries.

In case you didn’t know, (this is not being sarcastic), the interim Cass Report is available to down load. The final review will be interesting when it is ready.

Didimum · 22/07/2022 11:17

ScrollingLeaves · 22/07/2022 11:03

Didimum
Evidence-based practice is very important to me, so I'll always be interested in the review of that for all industries.

In case you didn’t know, (this is not being sarcastic), the interim Cass Report is available to down load. The final review will be interesting when it is ready.

Thank you! Yes, I'll be interested to read it too.

RockandRollsuicide · 22/07/2022 11:29

What is stonewall I've noticed dd secondary school has raised money for it.

Cutesbabasmummy · 22/07/2022 11:32

The poster who wanted her daughter to have a safe space away from penises! Really?! How about all those poor girls at Beavers ( which used to be just boys - there is now no boys only section away from vaginas) and those at mixed sex schools? We live in a society made up of mixed sex/genders whatever! Get used to it!

LillithCraneosaurus · 22/07/2022 12:24

Cutesbabasmummy · 22/07/2022 11:32

The poster who wanted her daughter to have a safe space away from penises! Really?! How about all those poor girls at Beavers ( which used to be just boys - there is now no boys only section away from vaginas) and those at mixed sex schools? We live in a society made up of mixed sex/genders whatever! Get used to it!

What is so hard for people to understand? It's not about mixed sex in girlguiding. They do not view or treat a transgirl as being of a different sex. An anatomically (i.e. penis) intact, possibly sexually active and interested, 14 year old transgirl guide will be treated as a girl along with all the other 10-14 year old biological girls in a unit. Data protection will prevent a leader warning the parents of the biological girls that their daughters may be sharing space, toilet/shower facilities, dorms/tents with a male bodied individual. Data Protection prevents leaders from even letting on to parents that this may be an issue. Therefore, parents of biological girls are letting their girls take part without informed consent.

Co-ed institutions like Scouts and schools can minimise risks because they have safeguarding procedures in place to account for the 2 different sexes and their needs. Now, granted, if you have a transgirl or transboy in those institutions, they will probably (because all institutions have been captured by TRAs) be pressured to allow them to choose the facilities they want to use. However, the point is that there is a choice and available alternative provisions (in schools there is usually a unisex option); and in the event that facilities may be shared between the two different sexes, these institutions can warn parents that this is the case because they have a mix of male and female bodied children anyway, ands parents therefore have informed consent when sending their children along.

The whole point of guides is to give girls a space away from boys. We have discussed this a lot with the girls in our unit, and time away from males is extremely important to them for a plethora of reasons.

ScrollingLeaves · 22/07/2022 12:26

RockandRollsuicide · Today 11:29
What is stonewall I've noticed dd secondary school has raised money for it.

Are you joking, or putting out bait? If not, what it is, is a very bad idea for your DD’s secondary school.

It is a lobby group originally formed to help gay people have rights in society. It did very good work in this regard.

When that was largely achieved, it moved on to transgender rights but using Lesbian, Gay and Bi-sexual ‘orientations chained to Transgender identities^ so that the T gets the sympathy for the LGB. Thus people are supposedly now grouped as being LGBT (Q+)

They are not just lobbying for trans gender people’s well being, but for the promotion of the acceptance of T people by gender to be included where people were previously classified by their sex. This matters say if a woman’s refuge now feels that trans women (male bodied people) must be included.

One of the most contradictory things said by their head last year was the suggestion that lesbian women should examine their prejudices if they are not attracted to trans women (male bodied people). This is conflating sex with gender. Of course there is no reason why a lesbian woman should feel attracted to a man who has become a trans woman. So in that context the T is being set at odds with the LG apparent umbrella of LGBT.

There is also the concern that gender non conforming children, or simply children who feel they don’t fit in, ( or have experienced trauma, or are autistic) most of whom will grow up to be heterosexual, but some of whom may grow up to be gay, are instead being given the impression starting from Stonewall and Mermaids influenced resources at school and on-line, that they have a female brain or soul trapped in a male body, or vice versa. If this leads to them trying to change their body, the effects are more harmful and permanent than simply being gay: ‘transing away the gay’ can be the result.

Every kind of institution was/is paying for it not only to advise them, but also validate them according to their adherence to its principles. If an institution does not do as they say, they will lose points and appear to the public to lacking.

Public money is being spent on them.

It has been very harmful in spreading false ideology , often based on lack of scientific evidence, and sometimes misinterpreting or manipulating the law, though it even influenced guidance for the judiciary, and NHS. In the NHS information now ‘gender’ free language can mean erasing words like ‘woman’ or ‘breast feeding’.

Last autumn the House of Lords had to fight for the word ‘Mother’ to be included in a bill regarding leave for female MPs who were pregnant. They really wanted to be allowed the word ‘woman’ but ‘mother’ was finally allowed as a compromise. Words like sex ‘assigned at birth’ are wrongly used, and confusion over whether gender is being used as a euphemism for sex, or to mean an identity, are everywhere.

People are now being pressured to specify ‘pronouns’ at work even if they do not share the belief that they have a ‘gender identity’

The Nolan podcasts about Stonewall

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/brand/p09yjmph
explains much better than I can, as could other more knowledgeable and eloquent posters.

Some institutions have now pulled out, famously the BBC.

Rainbowshit · 22/07/2022 12:31

Cutesbabasmummy · 22/07/2022 11:32

The poster who wanted her daughter to have a safe space away from penises! Really?! How about all those poor girls at Beavers ( which used to be just boys - there is now no boys only section away from vaginas) and those at mixed sex schools? We live in a society made up of mixed sex/genders whatever! Get used to it!

Oh FFs. For the hard of thinking. Beavers will not allow mixed sex changing. Boys and girls will have separate facilities.

The difference with guides is that they claim to be single sex but are actually single gender and do allow mixed sex changing. So they will allow someone with a penis to change next to a female.

ScrollingLeaves · 22/07/2022 12:34

^RockandRollsuicide* · Today 11:29
What is stonewall I've noticed dd secondary school has raised money for it.

I had forgotten to use bold RockandRoll’s to quote.

ancientgran · 22/07/2022 18:58

tillytoodles1 · 20/07/2022 21:48

My nephew was the only boy in his mums group of friends, they all had girls. He played with pushchairs and Barbies, and all the other "girlie" stuff that their mums thought they loved.

At home he still played with his Barbies and stuff, but also cars and other things. It's what kids do, they don't have to like certain things to be girly or boyish.

It really annoyed me when my granddaughter was born that all girls toys were pink.

I absolutely loathe pink since having two granddaughters. They are so brainwashed, they immediately identify any toy as "That's for boys" or "that's for girls." If you ask them why they have no idea but they can still state very definitely that that is the case. Hair is another one, girls have to have long hair even if they hate having it washed or brushed and it is the bane of their lives because girls have to have long hair. I point out all the women with short hair and still they are emphatic that you must have long hair if you are a girl.

I look back on my childhood in the 50s playing Cowboys and Indians, we were never the womenfolk stuck at home we were always fully armed fighting cowboys/braves. My favourite dressing up outfit was Zorro and I loved my mask and sword even more than the cowboy outfit and guns. I did have a doll and a teddy, one of each, and that it was for girly stuff unless you count skipping ropes as girly, boys firmly put in their places if they suggested that and were informed that boxers all skipped.

After all the years of fighting for equality why have we got to this state with children?

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