To think that toddlers don’t need screens when they’re out and about?

[anotherscroller]

From the other “things you find rude and others don’t” thread, but it’s quite a big one so I thought it could have its own thread.

Here goes:
People who give their toddlers (let’s say 18 months to age 4) tablets/phones to watch tv on in public during incredibly short interludes of time.
e.g. A train journey of less than an hour, a bus ride, while they’re ordering coffee at a café, at the bus stop. While they’re in their buggy being driven back from nursery! That one blows my mind.
If it’s a long haul flight I do it myself, but I think such young children don’t need a screen entertaining them the whole time. AIBU? They are interested in trees, ants, the contents of your bag, playing beekaboo with your sun hat, everything. Watching the world go by.
EXCEPTION: Unless they have, or their caregivers has, a health condition that requires it, makes life easier, make life worth living..

Why do I find it rude?
In the same why I find anything where people are shutting themselves off from other people in public and not being aware of others. Even with headphones on. With toddlers, as an adult with my own toddler, I feel like they and people around them are being deprived of the opportunity to “be present” together. My toddler always wants to be curious about a child on the next table, show them her teddy, or something, and nine times out of ten they can’t because said child is completely lobotomised in front of an iPad.
i think part of being a parent is creatively keeping small children occupied during a waiting time.
i think part of being a child is learning how to be ok with boredom or waiting time, and not constantly having flashy tv to watch.
AIBU?

I get your judgement. I too have in the past thought parents were lazy etc. For giving their child a phone or tablet to entertain them.

Just the other day i was in a shop and a mum had a toddler in a pushchair who was playing a game on a phone. I was a bit WTF for a second and then realised I had no idea what that mum had been through that day, what battles she'd had with her toddler, how she was feeling. I also knew nothing about the child, did they have additional needs, was this an occasional treat to get a job done. I pulled my judgement in and realised its not my place to judge.

Would i give my child a phone or tablet all the time? Probably not (never say never) but equally that's MY choice. Same as it's another parents choice to give one.

Stop being so judgey and leave parents to make their own decisions regarding their parenting.

I totally agree with your last sentence - boredom is essential for kids to learn and build curiosity.

however do you know the scenario and situation of every parent who publicly uses a tablet? You will be voted YABU tons on here with that kind of snap judgement

Tldr I'm a better parent than you

Fair enough. Point taken.
I do remember having a newborn and feeling so misunderstood when people were for example rushing me at the checkout, and I just wanted to yell, “you have no idea what my life is like! If you knew you would understand why I’m not “on top” of things!!”
But what about the watching tablet in the buggy one then? The parent isn’t getting anything out of that, they have to push the buggy home anyway. Just seems like a bad habit.

My toddler always wants to be curious about a child on the next table, show them her teddy, or something, and nine times out of ten they can’t because said child is completely lobotomised in front of an iPad

Other parents don’t owe your child entertainment. Stop being so judgey 🙄

You are right imo.

You've recognised that in some cases it's due to differing needs.

But the parents who push healthy nt 3yo around town in buggies whilst they watch a screen are doing them no favours.

In fact they are making life harder for their child in future because when they get to school they get screen withdrawal and don't know how to manage time that isn't filled for them.

i was on holiday last week and there were kids sat with tablets and headphones on during the evening entertainment. Seemed very odd for kids to be watching tablets when there was live entertainment aimed at them in the same room!

I think a train journey is quite a good place for a tablet. It stops your toddler annoying the family on the next table!

Otherwise I am inclined to agree with you as a general rule, though with any specific individual case you never know.

It’s more than entertainment. It’s connecting with other people. Learning about how to live with other people in the world. Learning about trust and friendship.
Maybe it’s a bit dramatic, but I think that all of these screens all the time are eroding our ability to live in society together, and the toddler thing is a prime example, because these are skills they are so good at acquiring at this age. Equivalent of how bad (completely necessary, but bad) caregivers wearing masks was for little ones during the height of the pandemic.

I think you're being incredibly judgemental here. If you see a kid being given a phone in the coffee shop while mum orders, you have no idea whether that happens every time or whether mum is giving toddler the phone today because they've been grumping all morning and otherwise they're liable to explode with rage in the middle of the shop. Obviously it's not great to have a child on screens all the time but in my experience most parents use them as an occasional tool to buy a few minutes of containment on a tricky day. They really don't need people like you judging them for it.

I agree with you op. People always say not to judge as you don't know what's going on etc which is true but this has now affected the general standards of parenting where 9 out 10 of these parents are doing it because they think it's ok and it's what everyone else does.

This is exactly the kind of thing I mean.
Maybe the train one was a bit unfair. I’m maybe an annoying parent who does colouring books etc whilst talking to my kid for the whole journey.

I agree. It’s just copycat behaviour.

Urrggh! I have one of these todders on tablets, he's 3 and has autisum and is only just verbal.. I'm sure you'd be annoyed at a constantly screaming child or a child endangering them selves by running off. It's really none of your business and it's not your child so don't get your knickers in a twist.

The bus journey home from nursery is extra time my son and I have together. We point things out on the bus, out the windows, say colours and he eats snacks.
I don’t feel a need for him to be on a phone or tablet. He’s 2.

i have prepared my tablet for a 3 hour coach journey we have on Saturday. The idea is I’ll get it out when he starts to get grumbly to save others from the inevitable tantrum. It’s a treat not an all the time thing.

it is sad to see kids glued to tablets but as adults we can be glued to our phones as they’re so necessary in today’s society so they are learning from us.

@Prinnny the OP isn’t saying adults should be entertaining her child. She’s talking about the children interacting with each other. Isn’t it important for children to have opportunities to build social and communication skills with peers in public?

OP I agree. I think judging individuals is inappropriate for reasons mentioned already, but as a social trend I think it’s hugely problematic. We do make liberal use of sticker books and fidget toys like poppits for moments when they need a calming and focused activity on the move.

In the same why I find anything where people are shutting themselves off from other people in public and not being aware of others. Even with headphones on. With toddlers, as an adult with my own toddler, I feel like they and people around them are being deprived of the opportunity to “be present” together.

The thing is it isn’t rude though. If you don’t like it don’t do it but your faux outrage at it being rude because they are cutting themselves off from society is clearly just a thinly veiled judgement of screens.
Is it rude to read a book on a bus and therefore cut themselves off from society?

The problem is you don't know who fits into your 'exception'.

Many years ago I took DS for lunch he was sound 10/11 and he sat with his headphones on and used his phone the whole time. He did not talk to me at all, after I established what he wanted to eat. So, I picked up my phone and started to browse various websites, as you do. I suddenly felt a huge sadness because of people like you OP. That one lunch out was a massive step for DS and you would not have known how absolutely difficult it was for him before, during or even the 2 day come down at home before he fully relaxed. I felt so judged in that moment for doing something I had always done with him, ever since toddlerhood. I felt like the worst parent in the world but what I was doing was the opposite. I was trying so hard to get my son through a lunch out, because we were working on those skills. Fucking hell the judgement police make me sick.

Well it wasn't an option for us - portable DVD players for long car journeys were a bit of a godsend, but there wasn't really anything else

So I completely agree that they're not necessary, whatever factors there might be, as all those things can be dealt with by means other than screens.

I do think that it's a shame to see the world through screen versions, rather than actually engaging with it.

It was part of old-fashioned holidays too - not even telly for a week or so

Back in your box 😂 different children need different things. Different parents have different needs. You never know what someone is dealing with behind the scenes. Live and let live.

YANBU I completely get that in some situations it is a good distraction tool but it has become the go to child pacifier without any thought for the consequences or impact on the child's development. I think it's become more prevalent and acceptable due to lockdowns. I noticed this recently at a park cafe where some kids seemed to prefer to sit on a screen rather than running off to play. I see it in shops all the time very young kids on screens in pushchairs. I just feel we are raising a generation of sedentary screen addicted kids who will struggle to function in life. To think there was a time where we were concerned about kids watching a bit too much tv, at least they couldn't cart it about with them.

If you want your child to interact with other children don't take them to a coffee shop. If a parent gives their child something to distract them that might be the only 10 minutes peace or hot drink they're getting that day.

My child doesn't want to talk to yours about their teddy.

I also don't understand why you get to judge what's a suitable length of time. An hours train journey is a long time so why's that less reasonable than your long haul flight.

If you'd read her post, you'd have seen she wasn't meaning kids like your son. She is meaning kids with no problems, although they will develop problems from their parents just shoving screens in front of their faces every day. But that's their call, it won't make their life easier long term.

I dunno. I get a gold medal here as I've never given either of my DC (4 and 2) a phone or tablet when out and about. But, you can bet they get lots of cbeebies at home when they need downtime or I need to do something.

You mention the walk home from nursery - both of my DC tend to be overtired and overstimulated by that time and if there's only one crying on the way home it's a good day. Is it really worse to give them ten minutes of chill time with a screen? I honestly don't know. Especially if it means they're calm by the time they get home and all concerned can have a pleasant evening.

A friend's DC was running by 8 months. You think a child like that wants to sit nicely in a highchair so mummy can have a cup of tea and a bun with her friends? Absolutely not, so yes she used YouTube and I don't blame her as I would've found a day with her live wires exhausting.

Basically, my view is that I do think it's not ideal in general, and should be avoided. But each individual time you encounter it that parent has their reasons and I wouldn't judge.

Please stop judging. You don't know anywhere near enough about a person's life to pick and choose when a child should or shouldn't be on a tablet. You can only judge when your child should/shouldn't be on a device.

For example when we take our toddler out for a meal in a restaurant I take the tablet and lobotomize (🙄) him. I get to talk to the other adults there and eat mostly in peace whilst he has his tablet before and after eating.

At home he never has his tablet at the dinner table. But that's fine. We're there as a family, not paying a fortune for it and whilst he's waiting for his dinner to be ready he can run around and play. He only needs to be seated from the point his food is plated up until everyone has finished.