Page 7 | To be hopping mad if Rishi gets pm job?

malificent7 · 2022-07-10T08:47:59+00:00

Simply because he is super rich and his wife evaded tax while we all struggle with the cost of living? How can they let him stand? This is not a racist thread btw.

TullyApplebottom · 10/07/2022 12:37

user1497207191 · 10/07/2022 12:35

You have to ask why he's an MP when he has so many other options. He has no connection with "ordinary" voters. It's all part of a bigger plan, by people behind the scenes. As soon as he's either done the job they want him to, or he doesn't get to be PM, he'll be cast aside as he'll be of no use to them and he'll be off to do something more lucrative.

Show quote history

As well as racism of course there’s just flat out bonkersness

ChipsRoastOrBoiled · 10/07/2022 12:39

Stuff all your patronising 'it is not evasion, dear, it is avoidance' crap.

His wife didn't want to pay her fair share into the public pot that so many of us are reliant on and that we all benefit from. She (and he) just wanted more and more and more money to themselves. I loathe people who don't want to pay their fair share; be that £2 in VAT or £1M in income tax. It is sick that rich, well-connected people get to run our lives, treating us like their latest plaything.

LemonSwan · 10/07/2022 12:39

user1497207191 · 10/07/2022 12:11

@LemonSwan

Not really fair to double tax someone because of their husbands job and I am pretty sure India needs that tax more than we do.

That's not how double tax treaties work. You don't pay it twice. You pay the going rate in one country (i.e. India), and then if the other country's (UK) tax rates are higher, you pay the difference in the other country. So, say, if India's tax rate is 20%, she'd pay 20% to India. Then because the UK's tax rate is, say, 40%, she'd pay the difference of 20% (i.e. 40 less 20) to the UK. Nearly all double tax treaties between countries worldwide work like that!

Thanks User I get that.

To be exact it’s apparently as follows…

As the owner of a 0.93% stake - thought to be worth around £700m - in her father's company, Askshata Murty would receive £11.5m in annual dividends from her investment.

The UK normally taxes such dividends at 39.5%, but because Infosys has its headquarters in India and Ms Murty herself is an Indian citizen, the Indian government would levy a 20% tax of its own.

As you can't be double taxed, that would leave HM Treasury with the right to demand a remaining 19.5%, or £2.1m a year.

Ms Murty has had shares in the company since at least 2015 and so may have avoided £15m in UK taxes.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61034496

I agree it seems outrageous. But the more I thought about it, the more I thought it’s not her fault there’s the non Dom 30k rule. If her husband wasn’t her husband she would happily be paying that - but because her husband is her husband we expect her to pay double what she ordinarily would. If you don’t agree with it - It’s the rules which are wrong not Rishi or his wife.

00865jkk · 10/07/2022 12:41

@AnaïsM seeing as everyone pays 20%VAT I think you are factually incorrect and poor people do indeed have quite a hefty tax burden

SnowyLamb · 10/07/2022 12:43

LemonSwan · 10/07/2022 12:39

Thanks User I get that.

To be exact it’s apparently as follows…

As the owner of a 0.93% stake - thought to be worth around £700m - in her father's company, Askshata Murty would receive £11.5m in annual dividends from her investment.

The UK normally taxes such dividends at 39.5%, but because Infosys has its headquarters in India and Ms Murty herself is an Indian citizen, the Indian government would levy a 20% tax of its own.

As you can't be double taxed, that would leave HM Treasury with the right to demand a remaining 19.5%, or £2.1m a year.

Ms Murty has had shares in the company since at least 2015 and so may have avoided £15m in UK taxes.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61034496

I agree it seems outrageous. But the more I thought about it, the more I thought it’s not her fault there’s the non Dom 30k rule. If her husband wasn’t her husband she would happily be paying that - but because her husband is her husband we expect her to pay double what she ordinarily would. If you don’t agree with it - It’s the rules which are wrong not Rishi or his wife.

Show quote history

But Sunak was responsible for the rules 😆

Plus it's not at all clear that she had paid any tax on it. They refused to confirm she was paying Indian tax, only that tax had been paid correctly "overseas", leading to a stong suspicion that these investments are held in a tax haven somewhere.

Misunderestimated · 10/07/2022 12:44

@TullyApplebottom Rishi was headboy at Winchester. Compared to some of his colleagues) he has an easy communication style which gains him fans. He is very, very slim which makes him look 6'4" when he's by himself, he's actually 5'7" which shouldn't affect his chances on a world stage, but will.
He - and the very smart wife he met at Stanford - like California and the £5m apartment in Santa Monica may well be where they feel most at home.
His parents' heritage and his complexion aren't the reasons that we doubt his commitment. Before fluffing the non-Dom and Green-card issues, he was my preferred candidate for the job.

AnaïsM · 10/07/2022 12:44

ChipsRoastOrBoiled · 10/07/2022 12:39

Stuff all your patronising 'it is not evasion, dear, it is avoidance' crap.

His wife didn't want to pay her fair share into the public pot that so many of us are reliant on and that we all benefit from. She (and he) just wanted more and more and more money to themselves. I loathe people who don't want to pay their fair share; be that £2 in VAT or £1M in income tax. It is sick that rich, well-connected people get to run our lives, treating us like their latest plaything.

But she was paying her fair share.

Sadly a load of left-wing racists wanted her to pay more than her fair share and howled in rage about it.

As though any of them contributes anything much.

AnaïsM · 10/07/2022 12:46

00865jkk · 10/07/2022 12:41

@AnaïsM seeing as everyone pays 20%VAT I think you are factually incorrect and poor people do indeed have quite a hefty tax burden

Again, you seem to have skipped over the word “net.” Deliberately?

If you pay £2,000 in tax and receive £5,000 in tax credits and benefits you are not a net contributor. The bottom gheee quintiles, as a cohort, are not net contributors.

SnowyLamb · 10/07/2022 12:47

AnaïsM · 10/07/2022 12:44

But she was paying her fair share.

Sadly a load of left-wing racists wanted her to pay more than her fair share and howled in rage about it.

As though any of them contributes anything much.

Show quote history

How do you know she was paying her fair share? They refused to say where "overseas" the tax was paid.

00865jkk · 10/07/2022 12:48

@AnaïsM I think the voters may have found it insulting that the wife of a chancellor and residing at number 11 see the UK as nothing more than a brief sejour on their way to better things. It's not racism

Thebestwaytoscareatory · 10/07/2022 12:48

Nanananananana99 · 10/07/2022 12:22

Oh hello Russian bot. Do jog on back to your miserable troll factory. If there is one thing the whole country can agree on it’s that we don’t need the Russian state or it’s corrupt money and we support the people of Ukraine who are being murdered in War crimes every day.

Remember that poor mother and baby murdered by Russia shelling a maternity hospital? I don’t think you will get much sympathy for your abhorrent views here!

And the Russian state murdered a British citizen on British soil by leaving a nerve agent lying around in the street that a child could easily have picked up.

Never forget Salisbury.

Show quote history

I'll remember the poor murdered Ukrainian mother and child and fully support a boycott of Russia if you'll remember the estimated 371,000 innocent civilians murdered in Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syria and Yemen since 2001( including the 3,000-4,000 who were killed directly by Western bombs in the initial invasion of just Afghanistan) and fully boycott the West. Or do they not count?

Cheesecakeandwineinasuitcase · 10/07/2022 12:48

I can’t believe the cheek of the man to be honest. It’s not like he needs the money is it. It’s all about the power and status of having been pm - even if it is only for five minutes. He did nothing to address the cost of living crisis when he was chancellor, bar a pathetic and insulting 5p off fuel duty. We can all look forward to energy bills that match our monthly mortgage and rental payments if he gets in.

duvetsonsunday · 10/07/2022 12:50

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

WhileMyGuitarGentlyWeeps · 10/07/2022 12:51

Most are corrupt in one way or another. Can't think who would be any better TBH.

Nanananananana99 · 10/07/2022 12:52

user1497207191 · 10/07/2022 12:30

I think it was around that time that "tax avoidance" schemes became pretty common place. Beforehand, tax avoidance schemes were the preserve of the super rich/upper classes, so in the big scheme of things, didn't really matter as the overall loss was pretty trivial (simple due to how few people were doing it). It was around Brown's reign (partially caused by his mistakes), that tax avoidance schemes became mainstream amongst middle and higher earners, i.e. film partnerships, offshore trusts, etc., made more accessible because of the internet giving people more information etc. Suddenly you didn't need a top "boutique" accountant, financial advisor or bank manager to tell you about tax avoidance schemes! Because the "wrong" people were using the schemes, Brown and his cohorts in The Treasury and HMRC called foul, and started to reign them in. Poor legislation drafting and poor policy didn't help tax avoidance schemes gain popularity either. Prior to Brown's years, tax "avoidance" was regarded as legal things, and tax evasion was the illegal stuff. Brown changed the terminology by stealth and started saying tax avoidance was illegal (which it wasn't in most cases) and that has now filtered through into modern day terminology, but still isn't supported by law, as we still have the illegal stuff being called, rightly, tax evasion!

Show quote history

Gordon Brown was a moralist, whose father was a Minister of the Church of Scotland so it doesn’t surprise me that he started to talk about the morality of legal tax avoidance.

As chancellor “Brown presided over the longest period of sustained economic growth in British history” and he was at the forefront of saving the banks from collapse through nationalisation etc

As PM his main focus was on early year’s education and it’s a shame he didn’t get a second term.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Brown

plugee · 10/07/2022 12:54

We can all look forward to energy bills that match our monthly mortgage and rental payments if he gets in.

Better to load debt onto future generations?

Trinity65 · 10/07/2022 12:56

perimenofertility · 10/07/2022 10:04

Whether it's tax evasion or avoidance, illegal or highly immoral, you shouldn't do it when your husband is chancellor of the exchequer. That alone makes me not want Sunak to be new PM.

This

JocelynBurnell · 10/07/2022 12:57

Ncwinc · 10/07/2022 10:50

Why have a green card while serving as an MP and minister? How loyal is he in supporting the interests of UK and its people.’

So you must have been terribly disappointed to find out that Boris Johnson held US citizenship until 2017. So that was while he was:

MP for Henley June 2001 - June 2008
Mayor of London May 2008 - May 2016
MP for Uxbridge and South Ruislip May 2015 -
Foreign Secretary - July 2016 - July 2018 (renounced citizenship during this period)

I wonder why it was different for Boris?

TullyApplebottom · 10/07/2022 12:58

Misunderestimated · 10/07/2022 12:44

@TullyApplebottom Rishi was headboy at Winchester. Compared to some of his colleagues) he has an easy communication style which gains him fans. He is very, very slim which makes him look 6'4" when he's by himself, he's actually 5'7" which shouldn't affect his chances on a world stage, but will.
He - and the very smart wife he met at Stanford - like California and the £5m apartment in Santa Monica may well be where they feel most at home.
His parents' heritage and his complexion aren't the reasons that we doubt his commitment. Before fluffing the non-Dom and Green-card issues, he was my preferred candidate for the job.

You do realise all of this sounds awfully like the way people of a certain type used to, and to an extent still do, discuss another minority with a history of bejj in be successful in education and business?
like I said, it’s all a bit whiffy

AnaïsM · 10/07/2022 12:58

00865jkk · 10/07/2022 12:48

@AnaïsM I think the voters may have found it insulting that the wife of a chancellor and residing at number 11 see the UK as nothing more than a brief sejour on their way to better things. It's not racism

Brief? That’s not what non-domicile status means.

Again with the dishonesty to paint a false picture. There really is a pattern here.

plugee · 10/07/2022 12:59

There really is a pattern here.

yes, everyone who can does it

reesewithoutaspoon · 10/07/2022 12:59

At the start of the pandemic, I would have said maybe. But it's now becoming more obvious that this has been his agenda for a while. registering his ready4rishi domain last December. Partygate pictures show from the angle they were taken and the floor plan of downing street they were from the chancellor's office. Changing the domain name so it looks like it was only set up after his resignation. None of it screams honesty or decency. It's all a game and I dislike intensely people who lie and manipulate for their own gain.

Happyher · 10/07/2022 12:59

Wouldn’t give you tuppence for any of the current candidates - a bunch of hapless wannabes. Johnson had really dumbed down the Tory party

Ncwinc · 10/07/2022 13:00

’Stuff all your patronising 'it is not evasion, dear, it is avoidance' crap’

Tax evasion is a criminal offence. It’s not just untrue it’s libellous to accuse her of tax evasion.

Wheretheskyisblue · 10/07/2022 13:00

AnaïsM · 10/07/2022 12:16

The bottom three quintiles pay zero on tax, on a net basis, receiving more back in tax credits and benefits than they pay in.

It’s not right to claim that they have any tax burden at all as a cohort.

Show quote history

How do you calculate that? Public spending per person is around £13k
commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn04033/.
Mean household disposable income is around £30k