To be shocked that in the 21st century there's still a staggering amount of women who rely entirely on their husbands?

[EllieRosesMammy]

I see it far too often on MN, women saying their husbands have been cheating on them for years or treating them absolutely terribly, but saying they can't leave because they are entirely financially dependent on their husbands.

Is it just me who finds this mad in 2022? Or is it still normal for men to be 100% the provider of the household?

I just couldn't imagine being stuck in a rubbish situation simply because of money

I am absolutely in no way slating stay at home mums, or house wives here either. I just believe all women should be self sufficient enough that if they're in a bad situation they can walk away

@limemintice

Also, you seemed to be confused between discussing the impact of the sahm role on a sexist society and being 'bothered'

Its very odd you are so triggered by my views

I know a lady around here who is a SAHM and she just dropped into the convo that she's actually her husband's second wife and the other wife is abroad in a Middle Eastern country but only has one child. It's ok as long as a man can prove he can financially support all the wives.

People like OP who are "staggered" by "SAHMs in 2021" on here - what happens if you go to certain other countries? Do you spontaneously combust?

SAHMs in 2022 even

@limemintice

Back to ignoring questions you cant answer huh.

Yes. Globally women are in much worse positions.

We should all be spontaneously combusting about how horrific things are in other countries

Having kids does not make you financially dependant on anyone.

@MummaTrinee I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Unless a woman is financially independent in her own right then she'll be financially dependant on someone. But more specifically having kids makes women vulnerable - no matter what their set up. Having kids puts women in a very vulnerable position.

When we shared parental leave we wanted to take the time off together to spend a few months as a family.
When I say he works flexibly, I mean he can arrange his diary so that he can attend sports day, or to occasionally school pick ups and drops offs. He works full-time Monday to Friday so couldn't cover a full day of childcare.
So i took roughly two years off with each of mine and then went back part time. Yes there were sacrifices financially but for me it felt like the right decision. I loved those years off with my little ones. It was important to me to to get to spend those early years with my little ones.

@3wildones

But not important to your oh?

If I could marry rich and never have to work again, I would. Working is shite. Spending most of your life working and barely any time every day at home is shite.

The fundamental difference between me and you TopGub is that the only type of equality you seem able to comprehend is one where women and men work the same hours do everything 50/50 and use some form of childcare if they have to. Or work shifts around each other.

As far as you are concerned, this is what you think all women must want and if they don't they are anti-feminist.

I don't think there is anything wrong with your type of home set up. I can see it would very well work for many people.

But I also know, that if I were to have my time again and someone gave me the option of having a different husband who worked the same hours as me and we could both do that and the kids could have some kind of childcare to facilitate it - the answers would be NO.

You may think that is the only way to be 'equal' to men is to want and do exactly the same as them. I don't see life like that. And Im not the only one. I am a woman though and my perspective is as valid as yours surely? So how will your brand of feminism account for that?

In my marriage, we are quite different people. Sometimes opposite types attract. I don't want a man who does the same as me day in day out. I don't need that. I would find it boring. Maybe I'm not attracted to that type of man. I'm attracted to my husband for the man he is - I don't need him to be here at the same time every day. I don't want to keep tabs on who does what. He is who he is and I am who I am. I'm all for women working and doing what the hell they want but for me, I wanted to be with my children. That's all there is to it. If I was with a man who expected me to put them in childcare full time, I would have been utterly miserable. Frankly, I wouldn't have had children with that type of man in the first place. It would have felt like losing an arm. That's how feel. I don't expect everyone else to feel the same. But again, I know I'm not the only one to feel like that.

So no, I don't want your cookie-cutter vision of equality where all men and women work a specified number of hours and the children are in childcare to enable that. If that works for some people, great. But it would not work for me and it would not work for my husband and that's the end of it.

Depends on your job thought surely? I love my job

@limemintice

Again, you appear to be making up what you think I think rather than my actual views

Its really very odd

You honestly seem very upset by the idea that someone could think and feel differently to you and that in thinking differently to you they must want to remove your rights.

I dont. If you want to be a sahm, be one. If you're devastated by the thought of spending a minute away from your children, dont be away from them.

If you're ok with your oh focusing on his career and not his children, thats fine

I dont think any of these things help equality but thats not your concern.

I've not said anything about childcare or a specific amount of hours.

Only that ideally, from an equality pov, both parents working and sharing childcare is better. It allows both parents to equally involved with the care of the kids and home and to have a chance at a career. Also better work life balance for both

Quite why thats quite so offensive I'm not sure

No, my husband is happy seeing them for a few hours each day in the week and all day on the weekends. Just as lots of women who work full time are happy with seeing their little ones for the amount of time, many of my friends included.
I wasn't happy with that set up, I would have missed them terribly and i got so much joy from spending those early years with them. We all enjoy different things in life and I think that is OK. Just the same as some people love to go out hiking and others find the very idea horrifying. Some of my friends founds maternity leave mind numbingly dull and couldn't wait to get back to their jobs.
I have a couple if friends where the woman works full time and the dads are part time too.
Ultimately staying at home in the earlier years and then going back part time was what made me happy and was the set up that i felt my children would be most happy with. Do you really think I should have made a different choice just to be more feminist even though I would have been unhappy?

@3wildones

Nope

But you can't respect someone's choice to be a sahp?

TopGub, come on, you know full well what you have said on these threads and others.

If you are saying flexibility is key to equality, then I would agree.

I just think women should respect each other's choices.That includes you. No need for snarky comments about "coiffed women in land rovers" or "SAHMs wasting their education" or "husbands with SAHM wives opting out of fatherhood" or working to eliminate SAHMs so their children can't get extra attention. All things from you on this very thread. Can we just agree that this kind of thing is boring and doesn't lend well to the discussion about structural inequality you claim to be here for?

@3wildones

Nope.

People do tons of shit I don't respect and I'd rather they didn't. Doesn't mean I think they should be prevented from doing it.

Why does it make a woman vulnerable? I wouldn't have said I was vulnerable after having children. This might be because I was raised by a single mother who was and is fucking awesome at everything.

Also this is assuming that women do not work before having children. Women who have children are stronger than they realise they are not victims. Sooner they realise that the sooner they can find their feet of they decide to leave someone who is toxic.

Being in a financially supportive relationship doesn't mean they cannot have financial independence, the reality is a lot of women are because its easier to do so and they haven't made any life assurances for themselves.

That's just my opinion on it. I was brought up and surrounded by strong women in and out of relationships and even though some found it hard when they left it wasn't impossible it's about weighing up comfort vs willing to work hard to get themselves out of that situation.

Ecxuse the rambling lol.

@limemintice

I don't have to respect your choice.

And I stand by saying that we absolutely should not be raising girls to aspire to be well groomed women in land rovers as the pp suggested we should.

Come on! You can't possibly think we should be?

I dont think the rest were snarky and really pot kettle much

Keep your tone policing

@limemintice @3WildOnes
Gub continuously deflects, answering questions with questions.

They never divulge anything about their circumstances but feel they should probe others for the purpose of scrutinising them. They never offer an explanation when challenged about their pov. A lot of posts with little substance.

To be this obsessive over women being full time parents (I mean it's ridiculous even having to type that) isn't healthy.

If gub had the perfect set up to prove everyone wrong, I'm sure we'd know. Those in glass houses.

TopGub - you are constantly deflecting. Nobody mentioned raising girls to be well groomed women in Landrovers. They were YOUR words and your words only.

@Foxgluv

Oh behave

As if commenting on a mumsnet thread counts as an obsession

You seem obsessed with me, I'm not sure that's healthy either.

Not being able to cope with an opposing view without mortal offence being taken isn't healthy

No one is compelled to divulge anything. Or answer a question. (Ask @limemintice )

You're getting personal because you can't actually counter anything I've said.

I caught the end of another thread when TopGub was divulging about her work. Let's just say, she wasn't very happy about it.

Ummmm.

Yes they did.

Truth hertz said that's what all women were secretly wishing they could be when they saw them

I was responding to their points about not wanting to work.

If you cant keep up with the thread thats not my fault

What question is it I've not answered by the way?