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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

"gently move away from..." can fuck off

181 replies

MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 01:38

If you'll pardon my french. But I've been trying to "gently move away from" feeding my baby to sleep (as advised by so many on here) and I just don't get how it's supposed to be possible without screaming! I remove the nipple, she thrashes, demands it back, and then sobs if she doesn't get it. As soon as she does get it, fast asleep.

And before I get a huge influx of people telling me to just go with it cs it's normal, I was completely happy to do that until a fortnight ago, when it became impossible to unlatch her without her waking up and screaming. She will literally only sleep with my nipple in her mouth. No amount of gentle this or that will do, it is boob or bust. Ive tried feeding lying down/safe cosleeping but I've got a bad back and literally cannot sustain the position needed for safe cosleeping/boobsleeping without waking up immobilised by pain.

She's 4.5m and I'm genuinely counting down the days to 6m when I can try Ferber.

OP posts:
ChagSameachDoreen · 23/06/2022 08:05

FFS, it isn't a "problem" if a 3-month-old baby doesn't sleep through the night.

Ardmano · 23/06/2022 08:06

Making any big changes at 4/5 months seems risky to me. They all go through a massive leap here. Maybe it will be easier to attempt in a couple of weeks. Can anyone else put her down for a couple of nights to break the association? Sorry if you've said that there's not.

Original poster
MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:06

@Topgub Tried shhh pat, tried rocking, bouncing, swaying, walking, singing... Everything that isn't boob is met with hysterical screaming. Longest I've tried is an hour, I can't do that to her every wake it's barbaric, she's a tiny baby. Not sure what font vo sleep is, Google isn't helping.

@EatYourVegetables the issue is she never gets into that deep sleep because she never stops sucking! So the instant the nipple disappears she is distraught.

Can I ask what you did? Our HV is massively anti sleep training and suggested gradual retreat no sooner than 12m, which just isn't going to work.

OP posts:
CallmeMrsPricklepants · 23/06/2022 08:07

Pantly pull off method works a charm.

SeaToSki · 23/06/2022 08:07

You can sleep train as soon as they can get their hand to their face, which is usually around 4 months. Its so they can self sooth by sucking a thumb or finger etc

Original poster
MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:08

ChagSameachDoreen · 23/06/2022 08:05

FFS, it isn't a "problem" if a 3-month-old baby doesn't sleep through the night.

No, it isn't! But it is a problem if she refuses to sleep without my nipple in her mouth, because I then get absolutely no sleep. I don't mind night wakes. I just need to sleep in-between.

And she's nearly 5 months.

OP posts:
Original poster
MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:08

CallmeMrsPricklepants · 23/06/2022 08:07

Pantly pull off method works a charm.

Tried it! Hates it! Screams!

Honest to god she will only accept my nipple permanently in her mouth.

OP posts:
Original poster
MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:09

Ardmano · 23/06/2022 08:06

Making any big changes at 4/5 months seems risky to me. They all go through a massive leap here. Maybe it will be easier to attempt in a couple of weeks. Can anyone else put her down for a couple of nights to break the association? Sorry if you've said that there's not.

This is what I ended up doing last night, DH coslept with her in the spare room.

OP posts:
DorritLittle · 23/06/2022 08:11

I agree OP. I couldn't manage to 'gently' do any sleep or stopping feeding method and was still comfort feeding for a long time. Everyone I asked for help just kept telling me things I had tried and I started to feel like the problem. (She still sleeps lightly at 12. If I go into to turn her light off she sits bolt upright...) I hope you find a method that works for you.

Original poster
MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:18

@DorritLittle yuppppp the helpful suggestions 😥 people are so damn kind and I'm just here desperately hoping that the next suggestion will work and it never fucking does.

OP posts:
Topgub · 23/06/2022 08:18

OK well if you cant cope with the screaming then you'll just have to keep doing what you're doing because picking a method and then giving up because she's crying is setting yourself up to fail

And you certainly won't be able to do cc

Childbeinganiggtmare · 23/06/2022 08:20

Are you liking to stop breastfeeding ? I had this issue with mine, couldn’t stop until a health visitor told me how to do it and it worked!

Folklore9074 · 23/06/2022 08:25

Sorry to hear things are tough OP. But from one busy tired AF mum to another I feel you. I think sometimes we cloak the hard reality of parenting young babies with words/terms like ‘gentle, fussing, hard to settle’ etc. when actually we mean screaming. Sometimes exhaust all options and just have to let them cry a bit while checking. We resorted to controlled crying last night after many nights of absolutely rubbish sleep for all.

Original poster
MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:26

@Topgub I'm perfectly happy to do CC once it's developmentally appropriate (IE not at 19 weeks) but I really feel like letting a baby who is practically still a newborn cry hysterically for hours on end each night, even if I'm right there with her, isn't OK. Im resigned to waiting it out, because I've tried every gentle method in the book and they don't work for this baby, but I'm not willing to not be gentle until she's bigger.

@Childbeinganiggtmare no I'm not willing to stop breastfeeding, and she doesn't take a bottle anyway so that wouldn't work. I don't even really mind feeding to sleep! I just need to be able to get my nipple out of her mouth.

OP posts:
Topgub · 23/06/2022 08:30

So why are you posting?

Youve decided no method will work (because you give up when she cries) so they won't work. There are no 'gentle methods' that will work with zero crying. She wants the nipple because you've created it as a sleep crutch. She will cry when you take it away until she learns to self settle.

Its also unlikely that any method will work until you've stopped bf

frazzledasarock · 23/06/2022 08:31

Stop feeding her whilst she’s awake hand her to your DH and he co sleep with her for a while till she is used to falling asleep without a nipple in her mouth.

the only way I could wean mine off was when I had to be away for a couple of nights over night and she got used to it. But this was when I was weaning her off the boob entirely and mine was older.

MakkaPakkas · 23/06/2022 08:35

It's like torture isn't it? No advice, but I've been there and huge sympathy. It does eventually end but I can't remember how as I've literally blocked the first year from my memory.

Original poster
MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:35

@Topgub I posted at 2am because I was losing my mind and wanted to vent! As far as I'm aware that's allowed.

I'm not looking for zero crying, but I'm not comfortable with an hour plus of hysterical crying in a 4m baby, I think that's too much. Up until a week ago she'd feed to sleep and then go down for a bit and that was fine, this is new, so I was ranting.

And I don't agree that nothing will work til I spot BF, it's perfectly possible to night wean and sleep train and still breastfeed, I've done it before. Just not with a tiny baby, because again, I don't think that's appropriate.

Did you really let your 4m babies scream for hours?!

OP posts:
isthatwhatyoureallywanted · 23/06/2022 08:36

My children are older now but I still remember being completely confused by the whole "pick up, put down" method which involves putting the baby in the cot, if they started to cry you picked them up, settled them and then put them down again. Mine never got down in the first place. As soon as I gently inclined my body or arms in the direction of the cot, we'd get full blown screaming instantly.
Virtual hugs & chocolate.

3WildOnes · 23/06/2022 08:40

I think you just talked the nipple out, let her scream but comfort her whilst doing so. She will soon learn to fall asleep without the nipple in her mouth but in your arms, then you transition to her asking asleep in the cot whilst you shushand pat and then soonafter you should be able to slowly transition to her falling asleep without you in the room. You probably won't even need to do ferber.

Topgub · 23/06/2022 08:42

Theres a difference between venting and demanding solutions and blaming everyone who gave you one because they havent worked.

About an hour yeah.

He was younger than 4 month. He cried every time he was put in the Moses basket. I wouldnt co sleep and picking him up made him worse so he cried while I did shush pat until he fell asleep. Took about 3/4 nights until I could feed and put him down asleep.

Same again at around 6 months when I stopped bf although he only cried for about 10/15 min then

Kendodd · 23/06/2022 08:42

MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:09

This is what I ended up doing last night, DH coslept with her in the spare room.

Show quote history

I get him to be with her every night until she's through this stage OP. For on thing, if she's hanging off your boob every night you'll get very sore nipples.

Kendodd · 23/06/2022 08:49

MolliciousIntent · 23/06/2022 08:35

@Topgub I posted at 2am because I was losing my mind and wanted to vent! As far as I'm aware that's allowed.

I'm not looking for zero crying, but I'm not comfortable with an hour plus of hysterical crying in a 4m baby, I think that's too much. Up until a week ago she'd feed to sleep and then go down for a bit and that was fine, this is new, so I was ranting.

And I don't agree that nothing will work til I spot BF, it's perfectly possible to night wean and sleep train and still breastfeed, I've done it before. Just not with a tiny baby, because again, I don't think that's appropriate.

Did you really let your 4m babies scream for hours?!

I remember my first screamed for literally 4 or 5 hours every night, there was nothing I could do, I still feel bad about it, it can't have been good for her.

Anyway, back to op, it must be really tough, especially with the bad back. I'd try to introduce a dummy during the day when she's awake to get her used to it then hopefully slip it in during the night. Ultimately, you might just have to wait for this stage to pass. Can you get some sleep yourself during the day?

TruffleShuffles · 23/06/2022 08:56

Are you holding her to feed or is she on a pillow or something? The only way I could get my baby from me to the cot was feeding her on a pillow, then as she fell asleep I tried to make sure none of my body was holding or touching her and she fell into a natural sleeping position on her back on the pillow and then I could eventually unlatch. I still wouldn’t be able to move her I would have to get my husband to gently scoop her up and move her into the cot. It seemed to work as she loosened her latch as she felt less contact with my body.

RedRobin100 · 23/06/2022 08:57

OP I haven’t read Ferber but followed Taking Cara Babies sleep raining course. We did it at 5ish months as I couldn’t wait any longer! LO was waking for night feeds and was always being fed to sleep - and would wake as soon as put down. It was torture.

I think Cara largely regurgitates Ferber (or so I’ve read). One part of it is night-weaning. It was great. There were no tears - it was a gradual process. Maybe it’s the same as the one referred to above?

if you want i can send you the pdf with the nightweaning process set out?

We did rhesleep training alongside but you could maybe try the weaning first?