My brother refuses to move out

[tryingtohelpmyparents]

Name change.

My brother is 37. He has always lived at home. Pre covid; he was travelling mostly the states on a specific visa (can't remember which one.... b1?) anyway, he was only home for like a month, then away back over again for 3-4 months at a time. Covid hit and he's found himself stuck at home.

Since this time, he has been incredibly troubled. I worry I may offend here but I'm saying as it is...

He says he's depressed. However he only treats my parents like absolute shite. He does nothing in the house and expects everything to be handed to him. He acts like everything is fine, and I'd honestly say he is his usual self to his friends.

He is very manipulative to get his way. My parents are late 60s and honestly I think they are verging on a stroke or heart attack. Believe me when I say this, they are at breaking point.

They have asked him to leave, says he won't as he has mental health issues and can't manage on his own.
They have offered to buy him a place, he refuses.
They have tried calling various groups, police (when he's in one of his aggressive outbursts), social services and no one helps. Just tell my parents to ask him to leave which he refuses to do.

Lately my dad booked them a holiday and my brother wanted to go. So he booked it. My brother paid. The night before the holiday, he had an outburst and refused to go. Ironically he survived in the house for 3 weeks absolutely fine despite claiming he can't live on his own.

My parents have been home less than a week and he's kicked off again. Claims my dad is aggressive and is a bully. He's anything but.

My brother is on medication but always taps the doctors all is fine. He smokes weed and vapes loads.

It's now at the stage my parents are fighting (verbally) with each other.

I'm worried about my parents. But I don't know what to do. He refuses to leave and says he will commit suicide if he's forced to leave. My parents fully believe he would do it.

He is a musician by trade so he does some work for his commissions, but half the time he blames my parents aggression as the reason he falls behind on work.

He hates my parents but he refuses to leave. He's got it good at home. I've seen how he manipulates the situation, makes my parents out to be the bad one when it's honestly him and his moods. I honestly think he might be bipolar.
He has counselling but he says it's a waste of time. He claims he had a life of bullying from my dad. He didn't and I know that for a fact.

What can we do? No one seems to want to help.

Sounds like your mum needs some counselling to help her realise this is domestic abuse

Effectively he's a lodger; so they could serve him a formal written notice to quit (with a date, minimum 28 days) for antisocial behaviour and harassment causing them alarm and distress. Harassment is behaving in a threatening manner putting them in fear of their own safety. Keep a copy of the letter.

If he doesn't leave by the given date, they can apply for a court order. If their "fear for safety" becomes acute they can call police. Be ready to press charges, call a locksmith, change all the locks etc.

Starting right away they need to keep a written diary of every threat and harassment, including verbal, and non- contact violence such as throwing and smashing stuff; holding up an item such as a chair or tool in a threatening weapon manner.

sell the house from under him. i know they shouldn't have to and don't want to...

Sellers have to declare any dispute concerning the property, and be in a position to sell it vacant and unoccupied.

So,. they need to permanently evict him first. Otherwise no buyer's going to touch it with a bargepole.

Of course, once he's gone they might change their minds and take it off the market....

Being manipulative isn't a symptom of bipolar. Avoid diagnosing him.

Thanks for all the helpful replies and suggestions.

My brother is due to leave for the US next week. I don't think he will go but if he does, I've sent my parents a couple of flats for rent in their area and told them to get it, pay rent for a couple of months and move all his stuff in for his return.

We will see what happens but I highly doubt he will go! This is what this latest episode is leading up to (he done this a couple of months ago when he meant to go to the states but said he couldn't do it).

I am really beginning to resent him for what he is doing.

Trust me, you don't know 95% of it. I work closely with mental health professionals and when I have asked their advice and given them examples of what he has been doing/saying, they have said that it is most likely bipolar or some other personality disorder.

The issue is, when he goes to the doctor, he says all is fine and it's his family making things up (me and my dad have contacted his doctor on multiple occasions during his episodes to explain what is happening). It's like a switch with him. He's always fine for professionals and his friends...

All you can do is work on your mum- be very blunt say over and over it is more likely you or dad find an early grave over this than he commits suicide.He won’t, he is just manipulating you - look what happened when you went on holiday. When he threatens suicide call the police. Tell your mum you will call them, every time.
and If he does go to the us this is your chance and you really have to push - rent a place, move his stuff, change your parents locks and hold firm.

Bipolar isn't a personality disorder. He might have one, but he can't be diagnosed by second hand, biased information.

If you dislike his behaviour, focus on that, not a diagnosis.

If he reserves the behaviour for family then it may be that he's abusive rather than has a MH diagnosis. He may also have psychosis because of his drug use. But none of us can diagnose him over the internet and the MH professionals you know definitely shouldn't be trying to diagnose him on second-hand information from you. That's very unprofessional.

Can you video him when he's kicking off and threatening? Then, at least, you'll have something to show his GP and the police.

Your mother is going to have to accept that he's an adult and he's being abusive. Eventually, he'll have to stand on his own feet, to some degree. What does your mother thing will happen when she passes away?

If I were a betting woman I'd say she's going to try and line OP up to take over.

Absolutely no way and they've said that themselves!

What would you say your mum thinks will happen once they've both passed away?

@ApplesandBunions I've told her that he will get a harsh slap of reality when he's on his own and will have to find somewhere to live as I've been told to sell the house. He will get half of the sale money and he will have to live on his own and get a place

Are any of the suggestions on this thread useful to you OP?
Nothing will change unless some direct action is taken

If I were a betting woman I'd say she's going to try and line OP up to take over

I thought the same - and yes they may well have insisted it'll never happen, but it's another of those things that, when the time comes, it can easily turn into "Ooooo what could we dooooo?"

My bf has a relative like this. We are worried that somehow this useless late middle aged man child who earns very little, is constantly off sick, has no life skills and has never left home will be an inheritance. We've tried discussing this for years and the last time we were told that the relative is independent so will be okay!

It seems irresponsible to allow your children to be so dependent for so long.

I hope your DB doesnt thing he is going to move in with you!

Rent somewhere for six months, then when he goes out change the locks. Leave his stuff outside. I'm sorry you feel so bad as it must be awful for you in this situation - but your parents really have to be strong as they are the only ones that can fix this.

It's like a switch with him. He's always fine for professionals and his friends... which is why this is highly unlikely to be bipolar disorder - bipolar is not that convenient. He may well have a personality disorder, which is different entirely. Or he may just be an entitled arse. I hope he goes to the states. If not I hope you can all find a way to do the flat rental and move him out. I bet you resent him - this behaviour is not out of his control so why would you not have strong feelings about it?

If your Mum won't force him out with your Dad then she could toughen up a bit and make hislife harder at home. I.e. stop doing his cooking and washing, don't buy him food, change the wifi passwords, cancel any tv subscriptions he likes. He

Posted too soon. It's too easy for him there, they have made a rod for their own back here really, they're not helping him or themselves by doing e everything for him. He's not that useless if he can manage in a foreign country on his own for months on end. He may need a mental health assessment. I would have one last go at talking to your parents about it and then just try and back away as hard as that is. If your parents won't change/do anything neither will he.

The only diagnosis you should be giving him is lazyitis. And why are so men this way? Because they were allowed to get away with being lazy sods all their lives!

Quite scary how many grown men are still living in their childhood bedrooms playing video games taking zero responsibility and expecting their Mothers to wait on them hand and foot until they become the problem of the state 😡

Yep. I truly don't get it. Is it just too much effort to build a life? They surely can't be happy.

My friends brother is like this a musician, same problems, his dad died years ago. Last year mum died in her nineties she left him the house. He's a sixty plus pothead now and the house is already a slum. It's been awful for the family for decades

Sorry, OP, one of your earlier posts wasn't clear. Have your DPs bought him a house previously and turned up with him and tried to make him live there and he refused? If so, where is that now? Did they sell it?

I would genuinely get him sectioned and then ask them to assign an adult social worker and help him find housing. I'd also move and cut him off. He sounds toxic and troubled and in need of more help than your parents can give.