To not make my DD play with someone she doesn't want to?

[prissywakeup]

I'm having such problems at the moment with my DD (8 - 9 in October) and friendships. There is a girl on the street who my DD is very friendly with, will call her Rosie. There is another girl on the street that my DD and her friend are really not keen on, will call her Bex.

I have invited Bex over for dinner and to play to try and smooth things over but my DD just doesn't like her. If she comes to the door for my DD she will hide and beg me to lie and say she isn't in. Rosie and my DD play together a lot. They would play on the street or at the park but Bex would turn up and it ended up that Bex would always go home crying because she felt DD and Rosie were leaving her out.

I tried to speak to DD about being kind and how would she feel if she was being excluded etc. I then had Bex mum at my door saying that the girls were being nasty to Bex and hiding from her etc. the mum said to me in future if they don't want to play with her then the girls have just to say they don't want to play with her.

Bex stopped coming for DD since then and everything was fine. However, the past few days Bex has been coming again and my DD just doesn't want to play with her. So after school DD was at the park and Bex came over to her. DD said, 'I've had a bad day at school today so I don't really feel like playing' at which point Bex went back to her house where her mum was standing on the doorstep. Her mum shouted, 'I'm fucking sick of them! Stand up for yourself Bex, push her!'

So DD left the park and came and told me. Now the worry is if Rosie comes for her she feels like she can't play with her as it will upset Bex and her parents. DD is actually scared to walk past Bex house on her own now due to them shouting at her s few times.

I really don't know what to do. I am trying to teach my DD boundaries and how to assert them, I think forcing her to play with someone she has been quite clear she doesn't want to play with is going against what I'm teaching. At the same time I totally emphasis with Bex and her parents and how they must be feeling.

When I have asked the girls why they don't want to play with her they have said that she never wants to join in playing what they are playing, always starts crying if she doesn't get her way and they find her annoying.

I'm really not sure what to do, it's at the point I'm thinking of just keeping my DD in but that seems a shame. Any advice? AIBU to not force DD to play with bex?

Bex has poor social skills. Many kids do. The way to improve them is through practice and she isn't getting that chance.
Poor kid.

As a kid, we had to play with my cousin who was a Bex. It was fine. He wasn't our first choice but excluding him wasn't an option and it helped him so much. And after a while, he was just one of the gang.

They do, yes. But if other children are noticing that a kid their age cries and make a fuss more often than anyone else, it’s probably an indication that perhaps it’s beyond the realms of standard child behaviour.

When I was a kid there was one girl in my class who would ALWAYS end up crying at other people’s birthday parties. She was very sociable and not shy at all but clearly something overwhelmed her or annoyed her about other people’s parties for some reason and she would always get in a strop and cry and then claim people were being horrible (they weren’t). And we, as kids, thought this behaviour was just as odd as the adults did, because it was extreme.

Exactly this.

No wonder there are so many bullying problems in English schools when so many posters say it's Bex who needs to change her "annoying" ways to become part of the in-crowd and it's her own fault the two girls don't like her. Maybe teach your kids some empathy and that it's not nice to exclude one person because one day it could be them who get excluded!

Yes. A child of our acquaintance has been very indulged. Her peers don’t appreciate Verruca Salt type tantrums whenever she doesn’t get her own way…at 13 she’s on very thin ice in her friendship group.

At work I had a colleague no one wanted to hang out with because she seemed very frumpy and no fun (she was young but dressed/acted very old-fashioned). No one wanted to invite her to lunch or for drinks after work. I made a point to speak to her and regularly invite her to lunch because it's just fucking awful to watch someone get excluded and ignored.

At primary school I was the kid no one wanted to play with. I was most certainly not a crier or tantrummer, I was quite stoic about it and learned to enjoy my own company. I wore glasses and had buck teeth. Kids can be very nasty about differences like that.

How do you know that Bex has tantrums though?! Girls can be bloody mean and exclude someone for no reason other than they don't like her.

I also suspect I am autistic which might have something to do with it.

And yes @XelaM even adults can be exclusionary about people they think are a bit eccentric.

I've rarely seen such a split thread! I feel sorry for Bex, but her mum has kind of sealed her fate, swearing and encouraging violence as an answer. I wouldn't want my child playing with her if that's the attitude from mum. She may well be frustrated and upset, but I don't find it fair to force dc to play in their free time with others they don't get on with. Are they not allowed an opinion?

Why does Bex keep trying? Is her mum making her come to knock? If so, that's really unfair.

exclude someone for no reason other than they don't like her.

And? If you don't like someone why would you want to play with them? My friends are people I like. I would expect my DD to be playing with people she likes.

DD has had some issues at school with someone not wanting to play with her so I just tell her that she doesn't need to play with them if they make her sad, not everyone likes everyone else, she should find friends who enjoy being around her and make her feel happy.

I think you need to go and talk to the mum alone. Explain that you wouldn't expect her to let you join her and her friends if she was going out for drinks. That you can't just force yourself on people and demand that they be your friend. Tell her what your daughter has said, that Bex says she wants to play but she only wants to play HER way and won't play what the girls want to play and cries when she doesn't get her own way.

They seriously need to work on her social skills they're not helping her at all.

But most importantly. "Don't you ever encourage your child to lay a hand on my child again." I'd be fucking fuming if another parent told their kid to push mine because they didn't do what they wanted. They're raising a violent little brat with that attitude.

I think kids are usually pretty good at sorting out their friendships and best stay out of it. Also later on they sometimes change their mind about people, so best not approach the mum.

Obviously anybody would feel for Bex, she's just a kid. But she's not being excluded because she looks different or anything. She's being excluded because she isn't being nice. We are absolutely allowed to refuse to socialise with people that aren't nice to us.

If Bex wants people to play with her then she needs to treat those people nicely. Her parents need to teach her that you can't demand your own way and tantrum if you don't get it if you want people to play with you.

Of course you need to jel with people you are friends with.

This is such a ridiculous statement.
People are different and I have had to explain to my kids that in life you need to find your people.

Many have to wait until Uni or work as adults

They don't have to be friends with her.

Bex's mother should be arranging play dates for Bex with children that won't exclude her or taking her to some structured activities to help her make friends (e.g. a sports club or Brownies) so she isn't just watching other girls playing without her. It's not about forcing OPs DD to play but instead Bex's mother should be doing something to help Bex make some friends and enjoy her childhood. Maybe over time DD, Rosie, Bex and Bex's friends could then play out together and there is less pressure; 3 is a crowd after all.

I'm really in two minds about this. Why should children be forced to play with other children they have nothing in common with, when as adults we get to choose our friendships?

That said, I've always encouraged my ds to include others. He has an autistic friend and his mum said she could have kissed me when ds invited him to his birthday party. Nobody had ever invited him before.

Children are very good at spotting how others are different, which can lead to neurodovergent kids being excluded. Often they're the ones like Bex - lacking in social skills and desperately in need of opportunities to develop those skills. This is my 5yo in a nutshell - too controlling in her play and not great at compromise and collaboration. We're focusing on trying to help her develop those skills but if kids keep excluding her from play (including party invitations) then how is she supposed to develop those skills.

Sorry op, not much help - I really can see both sides though.

Agreed.

Doesn't sound like Bex has done anything wrong other than 'be annoying', which is what exactly? Or crying because she feels pushed out because she is?

Maybe the mum is encouraging Bex to try, given little girls can be fickle, or maybe Bex is seeing 2 girls playing outside, is lonely and wants to join in.

Cliqueyness is not seen as a good thing in adults is it?

It's one thing encouraging your child to include the quiet children, those who aren't sure how to play, etc. It's quite another encouraging your child to become the victim of violence - and you know Bex's mum is encouraging her to push your DD!

My mum always made me "be nice" and include everyone. Two of my own birthday parties were spent hiding in the corner crying because she'd made me invite a spiteful little bully. I will never force my DS to "be nice" to children who aren't nice back.

I remember being 8/9 and the girl across dad came knocking one day complaining that I would never play with his DD, couldn’t stand the girl whiney, bossy, self centred etc. After he’d left my dad told me to go and call for her, I protested, he insisted until my mum intervened and said why I should I be forced to play with some girl I didn’t like just to pacify her dad?

Forever thankful to my mum and I’ll give my DD the same autonomy and support with her social interactions.

Feel desperately sorry for bex, who sounds like a lonely little girl who is so desperate for friends that she will keep asking the mean kids on her her street who continually exclude her in the hope that she’ll be allowed to play.
what on earth happened to kindness?

social exclusion is a form on bullying and most parents will eventually snap if they repeatedly see their child being bullied and the parents not doing anything about it.

How about instead of snapping at some children who don't have to do anything they don't want to Parents actually parent.

Bet Bexs mum is just lazy and is chucking her out the house hoping anyone but her will entertain her. Looking at her behaviour it's easy to assume the calliber of her parenting skills

@Imthedamnfoolwhoshothim i doubt a child’s desire for friends their own age is down to lazy parenting. Or that even the most intense helicopter parenting could remove the need for friends or one’s own age- or the feeling of loneliness that must come from looking out the window and seeing others playing and knowing that you are excluded

Then take them out and find social circles. It is not two children's responsibility to fulfill her wants.