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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Ukrainian refugee calling in sick and having new boyfriend over

200 replies

portugalq · 20/06/2022 21:21

At the beginning of May, my mum took in a 22 year old Ukrainian refugee. My 22 year old sister lives in the home too. I’m later 20s and live about 40 minutes away but see my mum often.

We welcomed “Anna” warmly and have provided all her food etc, helped her update her CV and get a job and been her support system. She now has a good job in a lab and some love friends.

A couple of issues have come up I’d like advice on. Three days into her new job, she caught a virus and spent a few days at home. She then mentioned to my sister that although she was feeling better, she’d stay off work for the rest of the week as there were seven days before she needed a sick note.

In the last couple of weeks, has met a local boy on Tinder and has been seeing him a lot. My mum was away and she had him into the house to spontaneously spend an evening with my sister and her boyfriend.

The next night he came over again. My sister went to bed and Anna told my sister the next day that he had been tired so he’d ended up staying. My sister was shocked but didn’t say anything at the time.

She discussed it with me and I was surprised too. The boy lives with family and seemingly can’t have her over. He told my sister he has been going out on dates to please Anna but he doesn’t like it and prefers to stay at home. I can see a situation where he ends up turning up often at the house.

I feel uncomfortable with these two things and feel she is taking advantage a bit. My mum can be a bit of a pushover and I’m worried about what to do next. What do you think?

OP posts:
RedToothBrush · 21/06/2022 17:06

mmmmmmghturep · 21/06/2022 16:07

As someone mentioned upthread, no hosts have seen the £350 yet

Holy shit still? In the middle of a cost of living crisis.

I don't think thats strictly true.

I think some hosts have seen it. However I don't personally know anyone who has had it in thr first 5 weeks. The first 5 weeks when the guests have a grand total of £200 to clothe and feed themselves with. And not forgetting the cost of bus trips to job centres, interviews, to get biometric passports etc etc. And that the emergency £200 thats supposed to be given in the first 48 hours (its not in a great many cases, they they literally have nothing until then and are completely dependent on the host bailing them out. Thats the host thats probably picked them up at the airport (potentially paying for airport parking) rather than being a douche and expecting them to get public transport on their own (they can get free rail trail within the first 48 hrs of arrival, but you have to know how to do this and it won't cover the bus).

Yep, unless you are well off then hosting is damn expensive. And if you are on the family sponsorship scheme you aren't entitled to the £350 a month (thats one of the reasons why family sponsorship arrangements are having a higher failure rate than the homes for ukraine scheme).

I think many hosts have anticipated this to an extent but even those who have have said to me that its still been more than they expected.

I think the phrase that the first two weeks is like hitting a brick wall in terms of what a shock it is. Its intense and hard work. Its not just having a lodger who you can just tell house rules to and they know how the country works as a system. You have to tell them how recycling works, maybe how to use a dishwasher, where the shops are, fill in forms, how the shower works, what time you eat normally, how universal credit works and how you have to go to the job centre, etc etc. All without them necessarily understanding the first time and doing it through translation apps. So it takes 3 times longer than it would to a brit. Then theres obvious conversations about cultural differences in terms of how things work. Its very easy to forget something or to have a miscommunication. However just randomly inviting strange people into your hosts home, is not just something that Ukrainians blanketly assume they can do contrary to bollocks on this thread. (Hell ive met a few lately)

Don't forget hosts may have bought beds, bedding etc to house them. They paid for a gas safety certificate and possibly other adjustments to their homes to make them suitable and pass council inspection (yep theres the time off to facilitate the inspection and vetting process too. The Extended DBS for kids requires all adults to be present at the meeting, so you cant just delegate to one person.)

And the £350 covers rent and utilities. So actually it isn't exactly a huge amount after expenses are taken into consideration. The reality is hosts are effectively subsidising refugees and then taking the chunk of the resettlement labour that would probably otherwise fall to local councils.

Does anyone else want more of a lecture on why it's not just a lodger and why aren't hosts just grateful for the income bollocks that keeps getting repeated?

People wonder why things are breaking down? Its not necessarily because their guests are bad or that the host hasn't adequately prepared. It can be the stress and financial pressures of those first few weeks of sorting all the shit out. Problems getting visas are well publicised. The problems after guests have arrived deserve a good journalist investigation and lots of publicity. There is a woeful lack of support for hosts. Its bad enough for refugees but the hosts also need it badly too.

OP youve been given a huge time by people who are happy to either go 'well what did you expect' in i told you so tones or people who are just utterly clueless and use the ignorant 'but they are just a lodger dumbshit'. Many hosts feel this massive duty of care to ensure their guest isn't exploited in various ways. Its not just relationships either. I am personally aware of a local employer who is an absolute prick who has been taking on Ukrainians without the proper paper work. Lets just say he has a prior reputation locally already...

I genuinely think there are multiple alarm bells on this one (including whether she actually wanted the guy to stay, or whether he applied pressure when he was 'tired'). But the guest also isn't covering herself in glory either.

Like any country there are people who work hard and there are also pisstakers. You can make allowances to an extent 'because the war' but you also need to be wary and protect yourself from piss takers too.

Maireas · 21/06/2022 19:33

So within a few weeks of arriving she had a job in a lab?
Within a month she was on Tinder?
Well that all seems to have happened very quickly. How come she doesn't live with her family that moved in nearby?

cadburyegg · 21/06/2022 20:01

Not quite the same thing but I have a friend staying with me atm and I would not be happy for her to have men staying over, partly because I have young children, but also because I just don't want strangers staying in my house. That's my choice. It's MY house and what I say goes. I also wouldn't bring back men i'd only just met myself if my children were here. If my children were teenagers and had partners that's completely different.

Your mum needs to spell it out that Anna isn't allowed to have overnight guests and any other guest needs to be cleared in advance

guerrillagirl · 21/06/2022 20:27

Maireas · 21/06/2022 19:33

So within a few weeks of arriving she had a job in a lab?
Within a month she was on Tinder?
Well that all seems to have happened very quickly. How come she doesn't live with her family that moved in nearby?

That’s what I was going to ask. Surely she should be living with her own family?

Maireas · 21/06/2022 20:34

Yes, they only arrived a week after her and have their own house, but didn't ask her to move in? It's most odd.

RedToothBrush · 21/06/2022 22:01

guerrillagirl · 21/06/2022 20:27

That’s what I was going to ask. Surely she should be living with her own family?

If they are being hosted there may not be space.

portugalq · 21/06/2022 22:29

Anna came home after work today with a bottle of wine and an apology for my mum. So she clearly had thought about the situation and wanted to make things right.

I do feel a bit bad now but I think I’m naturally protective over my mum. And it’s not like we could let it go on as it was - boundaries had to be established.

So I think it’s all good now. Thank you everyone for your thoughts! I will of course update if anything else happens.

OP posts:
Tillsforthrills · 21/06/2022 22:39

That’s good that she acknowledged it. Hopefully this’ll be a fresh start.

Maireas · 21/06/2022 22:42

RedToothBrush · 21/06/2022 22:01

If they are being hosted there may not be space.

OP says they were given a house.

RedToothBrush · 21/06/2022 22:46

Maireas · 21/06/2022 22:42

OP says they were given a house.

Giben a house still probably means someone with a second home has loaned it to them. It still means they will be restricted to how many will be allowed to live there by the council. You cannot just shove everyone into a house because they are related. The sponsorship schemes have strict rules about how many to a room and who is allowed to share with whom.

Maireas · 21/06/2022 22:51

RedToothBrush · 21/06/2022 22:46

Giben a house still probably means someone with a second home has loaned it to them. It still means they will be restricted to how many will be allowed to live there by the council. You cannot just shove everyone into a house because they are related. The sponsorship schemes have strict rules about how many to a room and who is allowed to share with whom.

I wouldn't classify living with a family member shoving. Surely preferable to living with strangers?
Anyway, possibly Anna wanting to get on tinder so rapidly meant that she wanted to hook up and her family may have disapproved.
Who knows. It's all very odd.

portugalq · 21/06/2022 23:09

My siblings had wondered the same but I think for Anna, this is her first chance at independence, never having lived apart from her family (hence pushing boundaries a little) so it’s understandable she wants to keep that.

She has a well paying job now and has mentioned cost of renting locally so I think she’ll look to move out on her own once her 6 months is up.

OP posts:
Maireas · 21/06/2022 23:11

If she's got a good job (not bad after a few weeks!) she can get her own place and please herself.

RedToothBrush · 21/06/2022 23:55

Maireas · 21/06/2022 22:51

I wouldn't classify living with a family member shoving. Surely preferable to living with strangers?
Anyway, possibly Anna wanting to get on tinder so rapidly meant that she wanted to hook up and her family may have disapproved.
Who knows. It's all very odd.

Well regardless of what you want to call it, councils wont allow it. You have to have so many rooms for the number of adults and children occupying under both schemes.

RedToothBrush · 22/06/2022 00:04

You should also consider how many people you can accommodate so they have sufficient space. Two people should not be in one room unless they are: adult cohabiting partners; a parent and child; two siblings of the same gender if aged over 10; two siblings regardless of gender if aged under 10. Individuals who didn’t previously know each other should not be given the same room.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/homes-for-ukraine-scheme-frequently-asked-questions

portugalq · 15/07/2022 17:46

Update in case anyone is interested. Once Anna made it clear to John he couldn’t come over to my mum’s, so their only option was to go out on dates (not allowed to go to his family home presumably), he became mysteriously very “busy at work right now babe”.

I’m sure her refusal to have sex with him without a condom in his car played a part too.

She made it clear she needed time and attention and didn’t appreciate having to wait around for him to decide if he could be bothered to see her and then when he didn’t get his arse in gear, chucked him.

I was really glad she felt comfortable to tell me all this so I could comfort her and support her decision.

Also glad we didn’t let it continue as it had been, with him taking more and more liberties.

OP posts:
ThreeLittleDots · 15/07/2022 18:17

Good job OP!

DFOD · 15/07/2022 18:25

portugalq · 15/07/2022 17:46

Update in case anyone is interested. Once Anna made it clear to John he couldn’t come over to my mum’s, so their only option was to go out on dates (not allowed to go to his family home presumably), he became mysteriously very “busy at work right now babe”.

I’m sure her refusal to have sex with him without a condom in his car played a part too.

She made it clear she needed time and attention and didn’t appreciate having to wait around for him to decide if he could be bothered to see her and then when he didn’t get his arse in gear, chucked him.

I was really glad she felt comfortable to tell me all this so I could comfort her and support her decision.

Also glad we didn’t let it continue as it had been, with him taking more and more liberties.

Brilliant @portugalq - this is a wonder thing you have done for this vulnerable young woman - to give her support to assert her boundaries - also like your DM did with her in her home.

He sounded trouble and you did a good job to look out for her.

Aquamarine1029 · 15/07/2022 19:26

portugalq · 20/06/2022 23:53

Sorry. Yes Mum is uncomfortable with unknown male visitors and doesn’t know what to do.

She tells Anna that male guests are not allowed to visit. Simple.

saraclara · 15/07/2022 20:04

Aquamarine1029 · 15/07/2022 19:26

She tells Anna that male guests are not allowed to visit. Simple.

Read. The. Thread.

1dontunderstand · 15/07/2022 21:20

Sounds like a great outcome

Mally100 · 15/07/2022 22:56

VaccineSticker · 20/06/2022 22:15

House rules or not, Anna, should not be bringing anyone to the house without prior permission from the owner of the house. Just because she comes from a war torn country doesn’t mean she can disrespect the house she’s living in.
I would be livid.

This! The op family has opened their home to help her get back on her feet, help with a job and provide accommodation. If she wants to have a boyfriend and have sleepovers then she needs to do it at his place. And the sister does not need the same rules in her own home. This isn't her sibling fgs.

Mally100 · 15/07/2022 23:19

TheWayoftheLeaf · 21/06/2022 10:09

She's 22... not 12

Yes and it's not her home. She is a guest there and needs to have respect and gratitude for someone opening up their home to her.

Baaaaaa · 31/07/2022 15:56

Beingadiv · 21/06/2022 11:15

So far she's been told 3 different things about guests: a) nothing, so assume it's fine b) ask first c) no overnight guests. Can you not see that your family are at fault for their own discomfort here? They need to think through a list of rules and perhaps provide them in writing as part of a discussion.

Get over the sick leave. It is really not your business.

I wouldn't assume it was fine to entertain my own guests in someone elses home.

It would seem spectacularly obvious to me.

In fact, it would seem deeply odd for someone to put it in writing.

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