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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Boris has survived the vote. Anyone pleased ?

273 replies

Heynowheynows · 07/06/2022 14:16

And do you think he can survive in the long term ..

OP posts:
TooBigForMyBoots · 07/06/2022 15:50

PM Johnson is not a gobshite. He's a corrupt, conniving liar with no respect for the law, who is rinsing the UK and destroying it at home and abroad.

MarshaBradyo · 07/06/2022 15:51

I felt a bit down this morning about it

But I’m trying not to let it dominate my thoughts too much

It passed and then I listened to Times radio which had interesting insight into the day

On whether he’ll last, who knows. the privileges committee has yet to decide and that might swing it

Blossomtoes · 07/06/2022 15:52

I’d have thought you’d be busy Googling @TullyApplebottom. No luck yet?

JassyRadlett · 07/06/2022 15:52

But I do give a massive shit about lying to parliament over it.

Yes, while I think there are issues about lawmakers breaking those laws with impunity (particularly in the light of the behavioural science advice on compliance factors), my much bigger issue is having a Prime Minister who thinks it is acceptable to lie to Parliament, repeatedly.

WatsonsToeTag · 07/06/2022 15:52

I really wish we aspired (and demanded) a different tactic in politics than "at least I'm not as shit as the other guy".

I wish our politicans wanted to be the best of the best, not the least crap of a bad bunch. The "at least he's not the other guy" tactic has allowed the quality of politicians (in all parties) to sink lower and lower because the bar is always being lowered...

Wor · 07/06/2022 15:55

Nope.

I would like the country to be led by someone competent with integrity. Any political party is fine, not too fussed about policies either, just competence and integrity would be great.

Apparently this is impossible.

So ashamed of the 211 Conservatives who claim to have confidence in Boris. They’re lying.

orwellwasright · 07/06/2022 15:55

forinborin · 07/06/2022 15:49

I am pleased from a pro-Boris perspective. If not for him, my birth country would not have existed by now. I find this obsession about who partied where a bit strange, to be honest, there are bigger issues at stake.

Do you mind me asking which country? This is interesting.

SleeplessInEngland · 07/06/2022 15:56

Morte · 07/06/2022 15:49

And there you go! “Demented Boris Apologists”. Bonkers. If someone has a different opinion they are “demented”. That’s why Mumsnet always gets it so wrong when it comes to real life.

Whatever. Maybe you want a govt that never does a u-turn when they’re wrong or a leader who is too frightened to say that women are women actually because Twitter. It doesn’t matter to me. The Tories won, they will likely win again. The Opposition isn’t currently fit for purpose.

And there you go! “Demented Boris Apologists”. Bonkers. If someone has a different opinion they are “demented”.

No, if someone feels compelled to defend Johnson they're demented. There's a big difference.

thecatfromjapan · 07/06/2022 15:56

Re. The windfall tax.

That is a great example of what is wrong with Johnson.

He doesn't do strategy or long-term policy. He doesn't think, 'I am here to serve my country. What can I do to improve the U.K.? How can I leave it better than I found it?'

He thinks in terms of Johnson, Johnson, Johnson. The Conservative Party is simply a vehicle for himself - he'll set it on fire to warm himself before he leaves. Likewise the U.K.

So he does tactics and manoeuvring - with his interests first and centre. He doesn't do strategy or long-term policy.

And so we come to the fact of him letting the Opposition do the work of developing policy for him.

Sure - it's probably good for the electorate for a government to take a good idea.

BUT

We've all had a boss like Johnson: he's an egotistical nutter, lazy as sin, gruesomely incompetent. And ruthless.

He steals the project you've worked on. He takes the credit.

You grit yourself teeth and tell yourself, 'Well - at least it's being implemented.'

But ... he's incompetent, lazy, venal.

The implementation is shit.

And now - now - he turns around and says, 'It was Cat's idea. The problem was the idea.'

So now your project has been wrecked, utterly trashed, by your venal, incompetent boss.

Just so the Windfall Tax.

It's implementation is already flawed: those who will receive the benefits and how; the loopholes to allow companies not to pay.

It's painful to watch Johnson take a policy idea and do it badly.

Which he does.

Because he doesn't do policy.

He doesn't do research and detail.

He governs like a medieval monarch - capriciously and non-collaboratively.

He's just shit.

Even the Conservative Party deserve better - never mind the U.K.

forinborin · 07/06/2022 15:57

orwellwasright · 07/06/2022 15:55

Do you mind me asking which country? This is interesting.

Ukraine, I think it was quite obvious.

the80sweregreat · 07/06/2022 15:57

Boris Johnson's positives ;
I'll bite and this is from people I know who like him and would vote conservative next GE. Not even shy tories , those happy to tell you they like their policies
I'm NOT a Tory voter myself : just to be clear.

He is very positive
He makes you feel his on your side
He knows what a woman is
He handled the pandemic as well as can be expected in the circumstances
He is trying to help with the cost of living crisis with these fuel payments and the council tax rebates
He is trying to help Ukraine etc.

A few vote this way because their parents do many have always voted for them and one or two are floating voters. I live in a conservative stronghold and many are working class who have done very well in life too and believe they look after them a lot more than the LP might.
People are not convinced by Starmer
A new leader might be a good idea for them too
For all his many many faults at least I knew what Jeremy Corbyn stood for and his policies.

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 07/06/2022 15:59

TullyApplebottom · 07/06/2022 15:50

“But starmer” is important. We are being invited to believe this man is a viable alternative. You can hate the tories til the cows come home but in the real world, you have to consider the alternative.

This thread is about Boris - but you won't talk about him.
The thread isn't "would Starmer be better than Boris"
OP asked what positives there were about Boris.
Your only answer seems to be "but Starmer" - from which we must conclude that the only virtue you see in Boris continuing is that he is less shit than Starmer in your view.
But surely there is one among the 148+ Tory MPs who would make a better Tory leader? Or is Boris really the best you can do?

MeanderingGently · 07/06/2022 16:02

To answer the OPs question, I'm pleased, I thought Boris would get through the no confidence vote but I did wonder if it would be by just one or two votes. It wasn't, it was 63 votes and despite the doom-mongering of BBC/ITV etc., that was a decent amount of votes.

To the pp who suggested that only a few "unhinged" still vote conservative/support Boris, well, I don't consider myself unhinged in the slightest although each to their own views and all that. I have commented before about my support for Boris (and so do many of my family, friends and neighbours...there are plenty of us in my social circle) but it only produces vitriol on here, so most of us just keep quiet.

To those pp who have said "where are the supporters in the last 24 hours"...in my case, I've been at work since 6am, only just got home and read this thread. Didn't want to read and run without making some comment.

Why do I support Boris? He is the only one who actually managed to get BREXIT done and I was, and am, a BREXIT supporter. I truly believe Boris has tried to listen to the people...I felt he led us through the pandemic, he was very forward-thinking in rolling out the vaccinations, he is doing his best in dealing with the Ukraine situation.

I honestly and truly think he saw his appearance at the so-called parties as work gatherings. Some were, some were held outdoors as per the rules, for instance. It is normal practice in the House of Commons to retire to the bar to continue discussions over a drink; I am assuming (but it is true, I have no evidence of this) that he saw it as the same type of thing. Perhaps this is why he was only fined for one so-called party. I do believe his apologies were sincere, and quite honestly, I can't get upset over the parties anyway. If the only thing a PM gets wrong is to appear at his own birthday party some time two years ago, I really think those who are "out to get at Boris" are scraping the barrel.

I think the public outrage at "party gate" is being whipped up by the media and those who are still angry over BREXIT. The media are particularly bad at not letting things go, and continuing the negative comments constantly, over and over. The BBC and ITV think they are speaking for the whole country when they use phrases like "the country's public do not want to let this go" (as ITV did on the 10pm news last night) ....this is not so, don't include me in your sweeping generalisations!
The BBC is just as bad, the early morning news reporter today delighted in saying "more than 40% voted AGAINST Boris" rather than the equally true "more than 50% voted FOR him".

I really do think we should drop it now and move on to more important things, I am happy for Boris to lead the country and would vote Conservative again in a general election.

daimbarsatemydogsbone · 07/06/2022 16:02

the80sweregreat · 07/06/2022 15:57

Boris Johnson's positives ;
I'll bite and this is from people I know who like him and would vote conservative next GE. Not even shy tories , those happy to tell you they like their policies
I'm NOT a Tory voter myself : just to be clear.

He is very positive
He makes you feel his on your side
He knows what a woman is
He handled the pandemic as well as can be expected in the circumstances
He is trying to help with the cost of living crisis with these fuel payments and the council tax rebates
He is trying to help Ukraine etc.

A few vote this way because their parents do many have always voted for them and one or two are floating voters. I live in a conservative stronghold and many are working class who have done very well in life too and believe they look after them a lot more than the LP might.
People are not convinced by Starmer
A new leader might be a good idea for them too
For all his many many faults at least I knew what Jeremy Corbyn stood for and his policies.

You nearly managed to post without mentioning Starmer and Corbyn!

TooBigForMyBoots · 07/06/2022 16:04

TullyApplebottom · 07/06/2022 15:45

But people who think that men can grow cervices are. Not only that, they get shadow cabinet jobs.

Or they could be PM @TullyApplebottom. www.google.com/amp/s/www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1501654/Boris-Johnson-GB-News-latest-Conservative-Party-speech-woke-cancel-culture-woman-cervix-vn/amp

orwellwasright · 07/06/2022 16:05

forinborin · 07/06/2022 15:57

Ukraine, I think it was quite obvious.

Hmm. You're talking about Johnson? Who refused to publish the Russia report? Which showed that the UK failed to investigate the Kremlin's interference in UK politics. Who made Evgeny Lebedev a Lord? And those are just off the top of my head. I suspect there's far more.

We're going to have to disagree on this one I think.

SleeplessInEngland · 07/06/2022 16:07

To answer the OPs question, I'm pleased, I thought Boris would get through the no confidence vote but I did wonder if it would be by just one or two votes. It wasn't, it was 63 votes and despite the doom-mongering of BBC/ITV etc., that was a decent amount of votes.

You really fell for expectations management with that 'win by one vote'. When the vote was first announced tory whips were aiming for less 'no' votes than May's to save face. In the end it was far more.

I think the public outrage at "party gate" is being whipped up by the media and those who are still angry over BREXIT.

Nah. The story's gone on way too long and been way too damaging in the polls for this to be a media concoction. Apart from anything else the biggest papers in the country spent the whole time saying it wasn't a big deal. But the angery cut through anway.

forinborin · 07/06/2022 16:09

orwellwasright · 07/06/2022 16:05

Hmm. You're talking about Johnson? Who refused to publish the Russia report? Which showed that the UK failed to investigate the Kremlin's interference in UK politics. Who made Evgeny Lebedev a Lord? And those are just off the top of my head. I suspect there's far more.

We're going to have to disagree on this one I think.

Yes, that Johnson, and I am well aware of everything you mentioned, but thanks for patronising anyway Flowers

Datgal · 07/06/2022 16:12

I could literally write a whole pile of stuff. But, Boris is a cunt and most of the cabinet members are cunts who just look after themselves. There.
We deserve someone much better. And if him or one of his team of said cunts does anything worthwhile for the benefit of a normal working person, it's only because they have to.

TooBigForMyBoots · 07/06/2022 16:14

@MeanderingGently , Brexit isn't done. It's not even close to being done.

orwellwasright · 07/06/2022 16:15

He is very positive

So is my nine year old

He makes you feel his on your side

Yeah, ok. That's a party trick isn't it? What genuine policies has he implemented that are helping people, particularly those who need to feel someone is on their side?

He knows what a woman is

Facile comment. Everyone knows what a woman is.

He handled the pandemic as well as can be expected in the circumstances

'Let the bodies pile high'. LET THE BODIES PILE HIGH. HE SAID THAT.

He is trying to help with the cost of living crisis with these fuel payments and the council tax rebates

Reluctantly and eventually implementing other parties' suggestions is not particularly impressive. Plus people would need less support now if it hadn't been for a decade of austerity, don't you think? Have you seen how many more food banks there are compared with 2010??

He is trying to help Ukraine

Lol. Russia report. Evgeny Lebedev etc.

All of those things are the barest minimum we could expect from a decent leader. And he's not even during them anyway.

thecatfromjapan · 07/06/2022 16:17

@the80sweregreat

That's really interesting.

I think you've identified a key demographic that voted for Johnson: oldest, working class (I'm guessing non-graduate) and comfortably off.
That latter point is pretty crucial. The 'help' Johnson is giving looks quite different if you are not comfortably off or in any public service dealing with the rise in poverty.🙁
But, yes, I can see that if you are just listening to what Johnson says he's doing, rather than being reliant on what he is actually doung, it probably all feels good.

As for Ukraine. I'll bet Ben Wallace is getting tired of his cheeky, loveable, on-your-side Boss ...

Anyway - that's a fascinating list. And lots of food for thought.
💐

orwellwasright · 07/06/2022 16:18

forinborin · 07/06/2022 16:09

Yes, that Johnson, and I am well aware of everything you mentioned, but thanks for patronising anyway Flowers

Why do you think I was patronising you? I was challenging what you said. That's not patronising. You think he's an ally of Ukraine. I merely pointed out some examples of how he's actually a pal of Ukraine's oppressor. Which you then agreed with.

valerianaofficiana · 07/06/2022 16:21

Yes and hope he does another term.

Datgal · 07/06/2022 16:22

It's interesting, as I was listening to a podcast ages ago. Which explained Boris and his bunch of cunts and why they chose their policies. It's all to appeal to the baby boomers. As that's who is basically keeping them in power. And there's a lot of them. So, bam. Have policies to appease the richer, older folk, and they'll get voted for. Fuck everyone else.