To ask your opinion on casual recreational drug use as a mum?

[Easylittlethrowaway]

this concerns two close friends of mine but I will state up front that my own opinion is that we should mind our own business - a friend disagrees strongly as has made me feel shit about it so reaching out here for opinions.

Friend A is a single mum of a child with SEN. She gets zero help from child’s dad, either in contact or maintenance. She is, in my opinion, a bloody good mum. Fights hard for her son to get him what he needs, works full time in a senior position to keep them afloat. Doesn’t so much as touch a drop of alcohol when her son is in her care. Gets minimal help from family but her son does go for a sleepover at grandparents every couple of months.

When her son is at his grandparents, she dabbles a bit in recreational drug use - usually either weed or occasionally mdma. This is in the comfort of her own home, with her partner. Never uses enough to get completely off her face but clearly gets an experience out of it. I’ve known about this for ages and it’s never phased me, and I’ve been in her company once or twice so I know she knows her limits.

friend B recently found out about this through friend C. Friend B now wants to report friend A to social services.

fWIw I’ve never taken drugs but I think Friend B is being ridiculous and that the child is well taken care of at all times and friend A is allowed to let her hair down once every couple of months. AIBU?

I grow my own magic mushrooms for my mental health. They are a class A drug. I take them recreationally at home. This doesn't make me a bad mother. Those little mushrooms have saved my life and made me a better person all around.

People can be extremely Judgey about things like this. In my view, if the kids aren't at risk it's nobodies business but the people having a good time. I would judge somebody for reporting a friend waaaay more than I'd judge them for drug usage.

But drinking alcohol - a powerful mood altering substance - in front of children at family gatherings, barbecues, Sunday lunches, weddings etc is fine?

If I had to leave my small children in the care of someone who had smoked a joint or someone who had drunk a bottle of wine, I would choose the person who had smoked the joint.

So would I, every single time.

Your friend who wants to report her is a nasty piece of work, and you should warn the friend in question about them.

She’s clearly not endangering her child. Why does this spiteful bitch want to try and ruin her life?

I don't know why pills or weed is seen as pathetic to not grow out of but continuing alcohol use/getting drunk is okay to continue to adulthood?

Now reliance / addiction to said drugs is another thing.

But a person taking pills / weed in their 30s on a night out is pathetic and hasn't grown up but the other 30s person getting drunk in the club is completely fine

Also, if she had MDMA in the house of course it should be secure, preferably she would only buy it when the kids aren't there and it would be gone by the time they are back.

Weed... Yes, should also be secure, but you can't just eat weed and get high. When people eat weed it gets decarboxylated, it has to be heated to a certain temp to get you high, hence smoking it, or baking it, or making butters and oils in high temps. Even if her kid did find a bud of cannabis and put it in their mouth, it wouldn't actually cause any harm to then. More harm would come from them finding paracetamol or anti-depressants or sleeping medication etc.

Even if weed could get you high just from putting it in your mouth... It still wouldn't be as dangerous as painkillers or mental health medication to a child.

Yes, pearl clutching.

I'm well aware of the cocaine industry. I lived in Colombia. I tell my friends about it.

What exactly does it have to do with whether taking cocaine as a parent is inherently dangerous? Lots of things cause destruction. I'm sure you're likely to be posting this while drinking coffee, eating chocolate, wearing a diamond ring on your finger...but let's pretend it's just cocaine that's an issue.

How on earth do you know that?

Actually I think that we should try to avoid causing all types of social ill where possible. I try to always buy the most ethical version of whatever but I know not everyone can afford to do the same. Clothes and mobile phones are essential, drugs on the other hand are completely avoidable.
I don’t drink either, nor do I buy alcohol as a gift for others.

If you read on you see I do say if it's moderate and occasional then they need to mind their own business but I guess you missed that bit.

I was commenting on several people saying drug use is safer than alcohol. It isn't that simple and the effects of drugs can be devastating so saying it's no worse or even better than alcohol doesn't make it OK. As I said I don't do alcohol or drugs so I have no skin in the game but it makes me angry when people tell kids it is safe and I've had friends of my children passing that message on when they were teenagers.

No!
regardless of any circumstances.

Completely agree, I’ve seen people who have over done it with all three of these drugs, MDMA, weed and alcohol. None of it was pretty, but alcohol is the most intense and immediately dangerous to the person who is drunk and the people around them, by a lot.

Moderate usage, where they haven’t over done it, of weed and MDMA would still seem to be far safer At the very least there would be less chance of falling over (in the short term with low usage, I appreciate cannabis related psychosis and mdma related depression/anxiety could become a bigger concern over time).

I've never taken any illegal drugs, but I have seen friends that do them, and honestly I think it's a very slippery slope. Personally I wouldn't get involved though - you won't stop them and they won't thank you for the interference.

Nobody?

Alcohol is the only drug that has been proven to make people violent. Statistically it is worse for you in most ways than any other drug in the world, but it’s perfectly legal

Alcohol wrecks so much more lives , and is way more widespread.

I’d rather be friends with an occasional drug user than someone who sinks multiple glasses of wine a night because it’s socially acceptable. The latter is far more damaging.

Just 3 of the comments I could have copied so I think you are wrong.

I didn't say alcohol was better, I was married to an alcoholic so I know about it, but the making out that drug use is better/safer etc is just rubbish.

The difference between a teenager who is institutionalised for years in a catatonic state after drug use and a teenager who will wake up with a hangover the next morning is so different but I guess you can't even imagine it.

I tried a good few drugs when I was younger, as did my friends. I don't admit it to people though, as a large proportion of the general public are heavily against drugs but know nothing about them.

Whilst I wouldn't do it myself now I'm a mother, I couldn't get worked up about what someone does in their childfree time.

A friend smokes a moderate amount of weed when his children are at their mother's. He's a fantastic father in every way. It doesn't make you a bad parent.

I doubt SS will be interested.

Actually, the biggest contributor to harm is its illegality. And that is coming from someone who would never use it. It is a fact that prohibition has never worked. Anywhere, anytime.

What prohibition does is hand the trade to criminals. People will find a way to access what they want, be that drugs, alcohol or anything else that someone decides they have no right to have. If there is a market... and there is always a market for what you cannot have, then criminals will step in and fill that gap. Because they are criminals, they have no concerns about quality control, about cost (the higher the better), or the humans involved in the trade from the beginning to the end of the supply chain.

Decriminalisation / legalisation has proven to reduce harm, reduce crime in every single country where it has been introduced. For example, Portugal decriminalised drug use over two decades ago. The results have included:

• Substance abuse and addiction rates cut in half since decriminalisation


• Public sector cost savings - addiction treatment and rehabilitation is less expensive than incarceration


• Individuals with substance abuse problems are much more likely to find recovery in rehab than in jail


• People completing treatment become productive members of society much more easily than convicted offenders with criminal records


• Violence related to drug trafficking has greatly reduced


• Courts are freed up for other work


• The rebellious, countercultural essence of drug use no longer exists when society sees it as a disease and not a crime - effectively, it is no longer forbidden fruit so it is less attractive.

@ancientgran I worked as MH HCA for years and in supported living so I'm well aware of the dangers. I think you're being a bit pedantic though. Gram for gram, purely looking at health effects, many drugs are more harmful than alcohol. But it's not that narrow, it is how you use it. One of the reasons why alcohol is so harmful is that it is socially acceptable and widely available and has a message that it is only dangerous if you're a stereotypical alcoholic. People rarely approach mdma use in the same way. Cannabis is physically less damaging than alcohol.

I mean, alcohol OD can kill you, alcohol withdrawal is one of the few that can actually kill you. Its scary how normalised it is.

Some people live in a complete bubble. Those who say they wouldn't be friends with someone who's tried drugs must be very naïve to think none of their friends have or do so now.

I smoke weed sometimes when my son is away for the night, have done for a while. I enjoy it and have never once done it whilst my son is here.

It doesn't really matter your opinion. I am not sure why your drug-using friend makes it public knowledge, and this really suggests her judgement is impaired.

If your other friend is going to report then I do think it's shitty if the drug use is not affecting the parenting, but how could I know to comment? Your friend knows better, or is it malicious?

Weed is a whole other issue, it's perfectly legal and normal in some places. In fact the only study ever done was on mothers in Jamaica where for some it was said to be completely normal to smoke throughout pregnancy. I read the study with interest, but because of ethics of course it's the only one ever done and won't be extremely robust, the woman did what she could with the data.

As for MDMA, firstly you keep that to yourself or you're a fool. Secondly, this carries a bigger risk to life as you can overdose, whereas with weed that risk doesn't exist.

Your friend's brought this on herself making it public at the end of the day. I don't do anything like that, but if I did it sure as hell would be the world's best kept secret.

@Chaoslatte yes me too, and it is stuff I talk about sometimes with family and friends, but I don’t screen my friends based on them making or not making the same purchasing choices as I do. That was my issue really, the ‘I could never be friends’ comments. I’m keen to live as ethically as my budget and responsibilities allow, but that feels personal rather than a way of directing my affections - I like having a wide range of different friends to keep me from disappearing up my own arse as I’m a bit of a self-absorbed overthinker!

Personally I would give zero fucks about what she does in her child-free, personal time.

I've seen many people ruined by alcohol , drugs also. In my opinion drugs and alcohol are as bad as each other. Im a t total because of a violent ex alcoholic and it just put me off, smoked plenty of weed in my youth and it just make me fall asleep. People should keep their noses out if the kids are looked after x

I have worked in a mental health facility and no one was admitted due to alcohol
We’re there any heroin addicts admitted? With respect this is because an alcoholic will hardly ever be sectioned under the influence of alcohol is it not? I don’t know how it works with other drugs but I assumed it was similar with all addictive drugs. But actually thinking about it nothing is as physically addictive as alcohol, as in you can quite easily die from withdrawal. I can tell you that alcoholics need all the mental health units they can get, but in truth many of them end up in a&e for physical health then get turned out because MH units can’t do anything with them. I honestly believe when used to extremes alcohol is bar far the most dangerous drug and leaves people completely incapable of accessing help. And withdrawal can induce what is effectively psychosis, although it’s not considered the same and I understand why, but the effect is essentially the same.

I think it’s silly to have a moral hierarchy of drug use. All have the ability to be very very dangerous. This woman is probably not using them to that level, same as most parents don’t abuse alcohol to that level. Its no worse.

I personally couldn’t be friends with B after that. Complete overreaction.