Permanent exclusion-how do I find a new school that will take an excluded child?

[Alwaystoblame]

Posting for traffic.
How do I go about finding my Dd a new school if she's been permanently excluded? How likely are good schools to take her on in year 10 with an appalling attendance and behaviour record? She's very bright and doing very well academically when are bothers to go to class and do the homework. Attendance in in the 60s for this year. Even when she dies go in she is late and/or truants classes.
I have 2 previous threads about the issues she's having but I wanted to ask specifically about new schools without getting detailed.

I'm sorry- and I know it goes against everything that you want to do- but stop. If she and him reckon that it's all going to be plain sailing getting in somewhere- leave them to it. Let her know she's always got your love and support, and be there when it all falls down. Let her and her dad sort it, since they seem to think they can

OP having read both this thread and your one about her bullying violent behaviour I can't see how getting another school to take her would benefit her or anyone else. Nothing changes, so nothing would change. The same behaviour would occur again. She would discount permanent exclusion as something to worry about as her and her Dad would just think she'd move schools again. She's not sorry for the violence or the bullying or the mental abuse she's heaped on other children and she would do it again, more children would suffer. I'd hope my school wouldn't accept a child who behaved like that. This sort of bullying can leave permanent mental scars on children and cause PTSD.

Having actual consequences, like going to a PRU might possibly get her to think about what she's done and see that the behaviour is unacceptable. A managed move wouldn't achieve that. She needs to feel the natural consequences of her behaviour. I'd be much more worried about the path she's on threatening violence then her achieving GCSE and University entrance. There are ways to go to university later, right now she needs to know her behaviour is unacceptable, the behaviour needs to stop before it results in life long consequences, referral to a PRU might be a step towards that.

I'm sorry for what you are going through, but trying to protect her from the consequences of her behaviour helps no one, including her and you. Make it clear to her you are there to support her when she's ready then take a big step back.

I can’t believe she’s been beating people up and you’re concerned that she’s lost a view of ancient woodland.

Op, having heard about her behaviour you seem to be focusing on the wrong things. I was shocked reading about what she had done to others and yet you don't really seem bothered about that. There are multiple children who are miserable because of her. Any other school will rightly be very wary about taking her. I think the PRU is the best option, not only for her but the safety of others.

I feel for you as her parent. Your devastation comes across in the posts, and I can see you want better and brighter things for your child.

Ultimately, I think I'd take a huge step back and let her face the consequences of her actions. Whilst she's always got people in her corner, excusing her behaviour, she won't change. Maybe she doesn't want to change, and that's on her.

At 15, she knows right from wrong. She's a violent thug. Her behaviour is abhorrent and she needs to learn the reality. Personally, I wish the law was harsher on dealing with violence committed by teens. Maybe she'd buck up if she could see she was destroying her own life by not receiving an education and getting a criminal record.

It's saddening to know her victims have suffered this, by being physically attacked and the cyber bullying telling someone to kill themselves. I was bullied for years. It never leaves you, and causes so many issues. Your daughter is ruining many lives.

I'm sorry you are going through this OP - it sounds horrendous. While the fair access protocols exist to help pupils who have been excluded find a school, there are limits.

Your daughter's behaviour sounds extreme and she is a danger to others - violently attacking other pupils and sending messages to the point that the police are involved goes beyond a teenager being challenging. She has, ultimately, committed a crime.

I think a PRU is the most likely option and it may be best for your daughter. The staff in PRUs are trained to deal with challenging pupils and the groups are very small.

I hope a solution is found 🌺

The view of rolling hills and ancient woodlands has clearly done nothing for your daughter, so maybe a change will help. She needs to reflect on the fact that she is fortunate not to be in youth custody.

This. I don't know the back story as haven't seen the other threads people are mentioning but I have a friend who teaches at an online British international school. She says there are more and more of them opening now since covid and a lot of the kids that are enrolling at hers this year are in the UK rather than expats but for a range of reasons regular school isn't working for them. Worth looking into. But as a teacher too, I would think repeating year 10 is going to be essential as sounds like she's missed a lot.

And where are the mythical PRU places?

I don't agree with this.

OP has repeatedly said what her DD has done is awful and she's gutted she's done it.

But it's also fair enough she's reflecting how sad it it that her dd has lost her way and become the person she is now.

You can hate your child's behaviour whilst still living and worrying for them because their your child.

Thank you @itsgettingweird that's exactly how I feel. Her behaviour is appalling and there is no excuse for it. I'm disgusted with her. She is still my daughter and I still love her and I'm extremely sad that this is the path she has chosen. The girl she has been bullying is someone who was her friend. They and younger Dd had sleepovers, went to the cinema, meals, hanging out and lots of fun together. The girl is lovely and I'm being supportive to her and her mum who both know I abhor dd's behaviour. I was bullied at school and was made so miserable and it was nothing like what Dd is doing. It was very low key and still I was scared to go to school. Younger Dd bullied at school and older Dd incensed that anyone is bullying her sister. The irony goes over her head and she doesn't see that her behaviour is far far worse. Dd2 is being bullied in part because of dd1's behaviour. Dd2 will be glad to have her out of the school to be honest.

As your ex is the resident parent I would put the ball firmly back in his court to resolve the issue.

I am leaving him to it but it won't stop me worrying.

Has your daughter been diagnosed with any additional needs? I would investigate and request a needs referral, you can refer her yourself via your La's SEND website. Don't wait for the school, get the ball rolling and if she has additional needs then she should get the appropriate support.

It's interesting you mention that your ex is similar and it could be she's inherited whatever he's got. Sometimes, you can see a pattern of inherited behaviour in families. I'm not an expert and you'll need professional advice here but have a look at PDA, Pathological Demand Avoidance.

Of course not
I hadn't realised you had a younger daughter also at the school. She's another one who'll benefit for dd1 being moved on.

having worked with teenagers I agree with posters suggesting sorting her behaviour is probably more important than her education at present., Find CAMHS or SS help or both and find out where all this anger is coming from and get her help to change her behaviour. If this doesn’t happen, any new educational placement will break down again.She will very likely encounter far tougher pupils than she is in an alternative placement.If her violence continues she will be looking at the judicial system in a couple of years.

I would tell her and her father to crack on and sort it themselves since she thinks her behaviour is no big deal and she'll just go elsewhere and he supports her with her shitty attitude.

Tell them you're out and to let you know where she'll be going and what she'll be studying.

Eventually, when they realise that it isn't going to be all sunshine and unicorns and more likely a PRU unit with serious restrictions. this might be the wake up call she needs to sort herself out. Let it play out.

@itsgettingweird

I'm afraid I don't agree. The original op didn't mention what her dd had done. That took many posts later.

You can care about the victims and also focus on your child. They aren't mutually exclusive.

The structure of the PRU might help her get her behaviour back under control. And give her a view of her future if she continues on this path that might help her decide to change. Is she getting mental health support?

How did this play out from your end? Did you remain amicable with your Ex? Has DD had counselling?

She has previously refused mental health support. She cites her mental health (and me) as the reason for her behaviour but refuses to attend appointments to help her. Too much like hard work and she wouldn't be abnd to continue to put the onus of control on external things/people.

Her dad and I are not amicable. He's an abusive narcissist and we have very limited contact. I've had to block him this week due to abusive messages again. Email only now. They are both very entitled people who think they can do no wrong and any wrong they do is the fault of someone else. Everyone else is responsible for their feelings whether good or bad. She is his puppet. Social services aren't interested and closed our file. Camhs recently discharged her because she didn't turn up to appointments but she is back in the system and has had an appointment already with another one due next week. She's had counselling at school and had a place again but refused to go.

And yet you have other children who didn't react in this extreme way? And let's face it, it is very extreme. Families split all the time, unfortunately.

Then she needs to suffer the consequences of her behaviour. If people want to bring charges against her then they should. She needs to see that it's her violent behaviour that will land her in a juvenile detention centre or prison if she's an adult.

A PRU might be her best way out of a life of crime and violence so if I were you I would let this happen. Don't look for another school for your dd, you need to protect other children from her as her behaviour is dangerous.

As hard as it is, sometimes you've just got to step back, let them make a total mess of it all, then be there for them when they realise and come to you.
It sounds like she's got a lot to lose from this exclusion. Maybe that will be the wake-up call she need that she can't behave like this as an adult or she could end up in prison.
Pity no one moved her before it got this bad.
And lastly, my sister was just like this (mum was always making excuses that it was "friends leading her astray" but she had a knack for finding those awful friends at every "fresh start" she got), she got excluded and ended up in court over her behaviour, and she's now got a decent job in the NHS and is very straight laced and the opposite of how she was as a teenager.