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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DS21 threatened DD18

485 replies

Safarigiraffe · 25/05/2022 22:30

Today when me/husband were at work DS was in the bathroom & DD had just got ready to leave to go to college. DD knocked on bathroom door & asked my son to hurry up as she was on a tight schedule to get the bus to leave, DS said to her no you have to wait and DD became agitated and started shouting at him to hurry up.
DS then came out the bathroom shoving daughter back in the stomach hard shouting/swearing & intimidating her so DD at this point was very visibly upset & shaking as it wasn’t like my son to react on this way and went to the bathroom to which DS then pushed the door open again shouting/swearing in her face.
DD was at college crying on/off all day, now we have spoken to DD & to DD saying this must never happen again, DS is refusing to apologise & DD never wants to speak to him ever again saying she now feels uncomfortable to be in the house with him however we both work and can’t take time off. (DD is at college DS at Uni)
Can anyone advise of the best way forward here
Many thanks to everyone

OP posts:
ThreeLittleDots · 26/05/2022 00:19

Me and my siblings would get in to fights over the bathroom

Were you "very visibly upset & shaking... crying on/off all day... feels uncomfortable to be in the house with him" after these 'fights'?

Thought not. This isn't the same situation at all.

sixthformdropout · 26/05/2022 00:23

It comes across like you are massively downplaying the situation in order to protect your son. Who cares if it’s ‘out of character’? A line needs to be drawn somewhere and this is unacceptable, the reason doesn’t matter. As others have said, your daughter deserves to feel safe in her own home. He’s 21, it’s time for him to fend for himself imo.

flyingdream · 26/05/2022 00:25

How dare he treat a woman like that. Think he could threaten other women like that too. Is he on drugs? It's triggering as reminds me of abusive men treating their partners like crap.

wellhelloitsme · 26/05/2022 00:30

OP - if your daughter had a boyfriend who did this to her, what would you tell her to do?

Stompythedinosaur · 26/05/2022 00:42

Safarigiraffe · 25/05/2022 23:51

I be hoping he moves out if there’s a next time - I love both my children equally however I will not tolerate this from my DS & just cos we are not kicking him out it doesn’t make us bad parents. DD is of course a priority here for us to protect however she’s very confused as to how/why this happened as she’s said herself he’s never done something like this before even when I’ve knocked/shouted for him I need to use bathroom/get something

How will you safeguard your dd then?

You have said (understandably) that you consider keeping your dd safe from abuse to be a priority, but it doesn't sound like you are planning to do anything to keep her safe other than hoping her brother moves out before he abuses her again.

honeyrider · 26/05/2022 00:48

sixthformdropout · 26/05/2022 00:23

It comes across like you are massively downplaying the situation in order to protect your son. Who cares if it’s ‘out of character’? A line needs to be drawn somewhere and this is unacceptable, the reason doesn’t matter. As others have said, your daughter deserves to feel safe in her own home. He’s 21, it’s time for him to fend for himself imo.

This 100%

GetThatHelmetOn · 26/05/2022 00:56

I think that the key is in “he is refusing to talk”, normally people who refuse to discuss a difficult situation are either very afraid or have little concern for other people needs or feelings.

He doesn’t seem scared to me though, but I guess you have the problem sorted, he is on the way to move out already, you just need to put a deadline on that.

blueshoes · 26/05/2022 01:05

ElegantlyTouched · 26/05/2022 00:02

Has your dd spoken to the police yet?

This.

It happened to me. I went straight to the police to make a report (this was in another country). My parents would have swept it under the carpet.

Derbee · 26/05/2022 01:08

I know everyone likes man bashing on here, so it was always going to go your DD’s way. Your DS obviously needs to control his temper, whether he’s living with your or not.

BOTH DS and DD need to learn to behave like respectful adults. Shouting hurry up at someone who is in the bathroom is unacceptable behaviour. Pushing and shouting back isn’t the appropriate response, but she should learn to behave too.

if they can’t behave, they should both move out

MrsTerryPratchett · 26/05/2022 01:12

Badgirlriri · 25/05/2022 22:50

This is a normal occurrence in my house 😂 it’s just fighting siblings!

It was a normal occurrence in my house growing up as well. My brother was abusive and violent and it's taken me years to process that. My mum still expects me to appease him.

Don't teach your DD that abusive men are 'normal'.

Cinnamon1991 · 26/05/2022 01:13

Contrary to what everyone is suggesting here...I would absolutely not kick your DS out. People here suggesting some cop out option. He is still your son so your responsibility. You kick him out and he becomes a fully fledged abuser, most likely chugging down all sorts of drugs and getting random chicks knocked up. It is the easy way out.

If you need to send your DD to live with a relative for a few weeks. But your son needs active intervention. You need to sit him down BOTH of you and ask him why he thinks this behaviour was appropriate. Why he thinks hitting a woman just cos his delicate little buttons were pushed is appropriate. This is where your husband needs to talk to him man to man and establish what it means to be a real man. He also needs therapy it looks like so get on that asap if you can afford it.

He is quite clearly going through something...drugs, depression, porn addiction (which makes you do weird things and act violently) whatever it is you need to get the bottom of it. Simply throwing him out the house is a very stupid impractical and cowardly thing to do as a parent and I am shocked at the number of people who see this as a permanent solution. Yes throw him out the house...basically guaranteed outcome of him being a total thug. Look it's a shitty situation but you two need to act like parents and do what needs to be done to help him realise this is not the way. Professional help should be sought if needed.

Meanwhile make sure your DD keeps her distance well away from him, send her to a close relative or even on college dorms to keep her safe. That behaviour is psychotic and he needs to be put in place by whatever intervention necessary. You should carefully monitor his habits and behaviours by the way. A lot can be deciphered when an adult child is rude, distant, cold and abusive. This is when professional help is needed.

blueshoes · 26/05/2022 01:15

Safarigiraffe · 25/05/2022 22:30

Today when me/husband were at work DS was in the bathroom & DD had just got ready to leave to go to college. DD knocked on bathroom door & asked my son to hurry up as she was on a tight schedule to get the bus to leave, DS said to her no you have to wait and DD became agitated and started shouting at him to hurry up.
DS then came out the bathroom shoving daughter back in the stomach hard shouting/swearing & intimidating her so DD at this point was very visibly upset & shaking as it wasn’t like my son to react on this way and went to the bathroom to which DS then pushed the door open again shouting/swearing in her face.
DD was at college crying on/off all day, now we have spoken to DD & to DD saying this must never happen again, DS is refusing to apologise & DD never wants to speak to him ever again saying she now feels uncomfortable to be in the house with him however we both work and can’t take time off. (DD is at college DS at Uni)
Can anyone advise of the best way forward here
Many thanks to everyone

Shouting hurry up at someone who is in the bathroom is unacceptable behaviour.

So you are saying she deserved to be physically assaulted for this? That is in effect victim blaming. Classic abuser's excuse that she made me do it.

Since when is physical assault by a larger older male on a younger teenage female ever justified. You need to give your head a wobble.

Cinnamon1991 · 26/05/2022 01:18

Also just want to add...though your son is clearly in the wrong, is your DD a total saint? Like someone else mentioned. She shouted at him to get out? What exactly did she shout at him? If it was simply...'hey hurry up I need to get so and so' then ok she is not to blame. However if she was calling him every swear word under the sun then yeahhh she is ALSO to blame. Not that it gives your son any right to lay a finger on her but she definitely also needs a stern talking to.

lameasahorse · 26/05/2022 01:29

This reply has been withdrawn

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lameasahorse · 26/05/2022 01:30

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SammyScrounge · 26/05/2022 01:35

Derbee · 26/05/2022 01:08

I know everyone likes man bashing on here, so it was always going to go your DD’s way. Your DS obviously needs to control his temper, whether he’s living with your or not.

BOTH DS and DD need to learn to behave like respectful adults. Shouting hurry up at someone who is in the bathroom is unacceptable behaviour. Pushing and shouting back isn’t the appropriate response, but she should learn to behave too.

if they can’t behave, they should both move out

DD is to be punished for being assaulted? What an strange way of looking at things.

blueshoes · 26/05/2022 01:38

This reply has been deleted

Message from MNHQ: This post has been withdrawn

Cinnamon1991 Yes, why make up a scenario that is not true. The son never said she swore at him much less 'every swear word under the sun'. That is YOU trying to find ways to blame her. Ask yourself why you are doing this and excusing his behaviour. A lame 'not that it give your son any right to lay a finger on her' is not a get out of jail free card. You have completely minimised his behaviour and sought to muddy the waters and throw smoke screens at her behaviour by making stuff up.

Maytodecember · 26/05/2022 01:39

Safarigiraffe · 25/05/2022 23:26

I don’t want to kick my son out as it was very very out of character for him & my DD said that he’s never reacted that way & she was very shocked

As he’s trying very hard to close the matter down I’d be concerned why he behaved like this. Drugs? Viewing porn? In some sort of trouble?
He needs to understand that a. He never assaults any female and b. He risks police action and the consequences of that.

Eightiesfan · 26/05/2022 01:43

OP, if this behaviour is out of character, do you think your son could be using steroids? I work in a school and have seen normally polite students start acting in an aggressive way. It’s very obvious as it coincides with bulking up, which is explained away by their constant working out.

Plus summer is time that a lot of young men start using as they want to look good on holiday and/or festivals and for them it’s an easy fix.

ThreeLittleDots · 26/05/2022 01:57

He is still your son so your responsibility

He literally isn't. He's a grown ass man, albeit behaving like a little bollix. It's not up to OP to fix her son. He doesn't seem to give a flying fig!

LetitiaLeghorn · 26/05/2022 02:02

What does your daughter say she wants to happen?

mathanxiety · 26/05/2022 02:03

Your daughter needs to feel safe in her own home. So do you. So does your H.

That is the bottom line here.

If you don't give your son a deadline by which he has to leave you are telling your daughter that while you love your children equally, you are prioritising his comfort over her feeling of being safe.

If your son won't apologise or even agree to discuss his wildly inappropriate behaviour, then he needs to be told to leave. What he did was massively disrespectful to you and your H as well as to your sister. This is your home. You need to assert your absolute authority within it.

Your daughter should not feel obliged to spend time under the same roof as a person who physically attacked her.

You will have no choice about throwing him out if she makes a police report about this domestic violence she has been subjected to.

Adult men do not assault women and get away with it. I don't care that she's his sister. He is an adult male and he shoved a woman in the stomach, screamed in her face, intimidated her. If he'd done it to a stranger he'd be in a police cell currently.
YY to this ^^

Coyoacan · 26/05/2022 02:43

I also think you should kick your son out and that the reason he is acting out of character in a violent manner is because he is probably using drugs.

Kicking him out now just might make him think twice next time he feels like assaulting a woman.

Readtheroom · 26/05/2022 02:45

Im really surprised and glad that people are being so supportive. I thought yelling parents, name calling and fighting among siblings was normal hence why there isnt support for it by police.

Murdoch1949 · 26/05/2022 02:47

There is a degree of over reaction by some, saying kick your son out. This was a one off occurrence between siblings. If it was a chain of physical outbursts, shoving, hitting etc, it would be totally different, but it was once. You have reassured your daughter, and she needs to understand that you believe her and have told her brother this is unacceptable. The 4 of you need to sit down and discuss what happened, how each of you feel about it and how you intend to move forward. Lines need to be drawn so everyone understands what happens next. There is obviously something troubling your son, maybe he's struggling at uni, maybe something else, you need to continue to try to get him to.open up. A further small matter, an agreed bathroom rota may prevent further outbursts connected to access. I wonder if posters would have been so judgemental if it were 2 sons pushing & shoving?