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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DS21 threatened DD18

485 replies

Safarigiraffe · 25/05/2022 22:30

Today when me/husband were at work DS was in the bathroom & DD had just got ready to leave to go to college. DD knocked on bathroom door & asked my son to hurry up as she was on a tight schedule to get the bus to leave, DS said to her no you have to wait and DD became agitated and started shouting at him to hurry up.
DS then came out the bathroom shoving daughter back in the stomach hard shouting/swearing & intimidating her so DD at this point was very visibly upset & shaking as it wasn’t like my son to react on this way and went to the bathroom to which DS then pushed the door open again shouting/swearing in her face.
DD was at college crying on/off all day, now we have spoken to DD & to DD saying this must never happen again, DS is refusing to apologise & DD never wants to speak to him ever again saying she now feels uncomfortable to be in the house with him however we both work and can’t take time off. (DD is at college DS at Uni)
Can anyone advise of the best way forward here
Many thanks to everyone

OP posts:
wellhelloitsme · 27/05/2022 16:40

@Aubriella

Why do posts from women sharing their experiences make posters called 'Brian' insult and minimise their experiences? I wonder...

Quite.

I'm surprised they didn't throw 'hysterical' in there for a full house!

Mumwantingtogetitright · 27/05/2022 16:43

I'm really not projecting anything. I don't have any experience of being on the receiving end of violence, thankfully. I'm just looking objectively at what the OP said and what I see is that the DS physically assaulted his sister.

If a man shoved a woman hard in the stomach in any other scenario, it would be regarded as assault, without question. I genuinely don't understand why the fact of it being a sibling relationship makes this ok? Would it be OK for a man to do this to his daughter, I wonder? For a son to do it to his mum? For a husband to do it to his wife? Personally, I can't see why any of these would be OK.

It seems to me that the people who are actually projecting here are perhaps the mothers of sons who believe that their sons would be capable of this behaviour towards their female family members, and they would rather not see it for what it is because they don't want to see their sons as potential abusers.

Don't people teach their children that violence is never acceptable (except perhaps in self defence)? If so, why is this OK?

Aubriella · 27/05/2022 16:45

wellhelloitsme Grin

and they never return to the thread

Original poster
Safarigiraffe · 28/05/2022 21:25

Hi all just to update, needed to see how things would turn out with DS & DD many thanks for all comments. At the moment DS & DD are ignoring each other however without taking sides I feel both of them are equally to blame - DS for pushing & DD for swearing at him first so yes DS shouldn’t of pushed but equally DD needs to understand she can’t just swear & call him all names under the sun (and no I’m not condoning DS behaviour at all)

OP posts:
wellhelloitsme · 28/05/2022 21:33

You're condoning a physical reaction by a stronger, bigger person to a verbal outburst by a smaller, weaker person.

The two aren't equal and it's sad for your kids that you think so. For your daughter, it's sad because she doesn't feel safe.

And for your son, because you've just taught him that sometimes, women deserve to be hit if they wind you up.

One more man with an increase potential (obviously not all come to fruition) to become abusive to women when he feels angry.

Good luck.

mathanxiety · 28/05/2022 21:38

Is physical force justified in response to swearing, or could DS have handled this better?

Original poster
Safarigiraffe · 28/05/2022 21:42

I don’t feel that my son should have used physical force he had been spoken to by both me/husband so my husband feels he’s more to blame for not only swearing back but using physical force even though DD18 started it all off by banging on door/swearing first - DS could have handled this situation better however so could DD as well by not banging on door & swearing when she was already ready for college and only wanted 1 thing from bathroom

OP posts:
Branleuse · 28/05/2022 21:42

Its not condoning anything, just because you dont kick your kid out for it

Scianel · 28/05/2022 21:43

You've let your daughter down.

mathanxiety · 28/05/2022 21:50

If DD had just banged on the door and not sworn, and DS had sworn back and pushed her, would that be different?

If DD had just shouted/sworn, and he had sworn and pushed her, would that have been different?

What you are basically saying here is that there are circumstances in which a man can push a woman - if she really annoys him, or disturbs something he's doing, for instance.

I'm just trying to get a feel for exactly the combination of behaviours your DD needs to avoid in order to not create the conditions in which she can expect her brother to push her.

Original poster
Safarigiraffe · 28/05/2022 21:54

I’ve heard 2 different versions of events - DD said she asked him to get out as she only needed 1 thing from bathroom & then was banging on door for him to get out & then as he came out DS shoved her hard getting in her face threatening her & DS said that she was swearing/banging on door calling him every name under the sun but when he came out he did shout/swear but did not touch her at all so both very similar but different versions of what both did

OP posts:
wellhelloitsme · 28/05/2022 21:54

Branleuse · 28/05/2022 21:42

Its not condoning anything, just because you dont kick your kid out for it

She said they're 'equally to blame' though. It wasn't. One (who also happens to be bigger and stronger) was physical and one wasn't. It wasn't equal.

honeyrider · 28/05/2022 22:21

wellhelloitsme · 28/05/2022 21:33

You're condoning a physical reaction by a stronger, bigger person to a verbal outburst by a smaller, weaker person.

The two aren't equal and it's sad for your kids that you think so. For your daughter, it's sad because she doesn't feel safe.

And for your son, because you've just taught him that sometimes, women deserve to be hit if they wind you up.

One more man with an increase potential (obviously not all come to fruition) to become abusive to women when he feels angry.

Good luck.

Agree with this.

MrsTerryPratchett · 28/05/2022 22:26

Safarigiraffe · 28/05/2022 21:42

I don’t feel that my son should have used physical force he had been spoken to by both me/husband so my husband feels he’s more to blame for not only swearing back but using physical force even though DD18 started it all off by banging on door/swearing first - DS could have handled this situation better however so could DD as well by not banging on door & swearing when she was already ready for college and only wanted 1 thing from bathroom

That's lovely denial there. It does feel good to plaster over the issue and pretend it's all sorted out.

Until next time.

Scianel · 28/05/2022 22:27

Which version do you think it likely to be true, given that your daughter was crying all day, and your son's version seems to have popped up after the fact?
There's no "equally to blame" when one party has used physicaly violence, espeically if they are older, larger and stronger.

wellhelloitsme · 28/05/2022 22:32

Scianel · 28/05/2022 22:27

Which version do you think it likely to be true, given that your daughter was crying all day, and your son's version seems to have popped up after the fact?
There's no "equally to blame" when one party has used physicaly violence, espeically if they are older, larger and stronger.

Well said.

Mumwantingtogetitright · 28/05/2022 22:36

Woe. I guess this is how men learn that sometimes women just deserve to be physically assaulted.

blueshoes · 28/05/2022 22:37

Scianel · 28/05/2022 22:27

Which version do you think it likely to be true, given that your daughter was crying all day, and your son's version seems to have popped up after the fact?
There's no "equally to blame" when one party has used physicaly violence, espeically if they are older, larger and stronger.

Read this OP and look deep into yourself. I mean really deep. Put yourself in your dd's shoes and tell me you did not let her down. You have also let your son down - a domestic abuser in the making, fuelled by drugs and whatever he was doing.

Categorically, you made the wrong decision.

If I were your dd, I would go straight to the police now, since my parents have failed to protect me.

Original poster
Safarigiraffe · 28/05/2022 22:39

My son doesn’t take drugs this was a very out of character situation for him We as parents did not condone what my son did he was spoken to

OP posts:
RunningFromInsanity · 28/05/2022 22:45

blueshoes · 28/05/2022 22:37

Read this OP and look deep into yourself. I mean really deep. Put yourself in your dd's shoes and tell me you did not let her down. You have also let your son down - a domestic abuser in the making, fuelled by drugs and whatever he was doing.

Categorically, you made the wrong decision.

If I were your dd, I would go straight to the police now, since my parents have failed to protect me.

Show quote history

Ridiculous.
No mother in real life is going to call the police and chuck her son out of the house for a shove in the stomach. And I can’t see any sister calling the Police on her brother for a push either.

The Op knows her son and knows whether this is part of a bigger problem or extremely out of character.

MrsTerryPratchett · 28/05/2022 23:10

The Op knows her son and knows whether this is part of a bigger problem or extremely out of character.

Bless. Mums can be in denial as much as anyone.

CPL593H · 28/05/2022 23:17

Nice job of sweeping it under the carpet and minimising, @Safarigiraffe . Still, on to the next thing, eh?

blueshoes · 28/05/2022 23:27

And I can’t see any sister calling the Police on her brother for a push either.

@RunningFromInsanity Just goes to show you don't know what you are talking about.

I am that sister who called the police on her brother. I was the same age as OP's dd too at the time. This is because I saw my parents trying to reason with my brother rather than kicking him to curb (metaphorically). Bloody ineffective appeasers.

The police came by our house and interviewed him. They got a statement from me and him. You know what, he never did it again. I did my brother a favour there.

Blanketpolicy · 28/05/2022 23:40

I remember, around the same age as you, my brother intimidating/shoving me around once when my mum and dad were out, all over what channel was in tv.

I was still upset when parents came back, and as soon as dad heard he ordered him out to the car and they drove off for a couple of hours. No idea what dad said to him but I imagine there would have been a fair bit of shouting, asking him if he thought he was a big man intimidating a girl, and a lot of what type of man he wanted to be and what men thought of men like him (this would have been in the 1980s).

It was never spoke of again and never happened again.

I think this is one for your dh to have a very strong word about how unacceptable it is and why. Making it clear there will be zero tolerance of a repeat.

lameasahorse · 28/05/2022 23:42

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