To hate most mixed sex fitting rooms

[Humbold]

I haven't been out shopping much post-Covid because it seemed pointless when the fitting rooms were closed. Went with my teenage daughter to pick up some summer clothes this week and was shocked by how many stores have gone for mixed sex changing rooms.

First stop was Primark. Headed to fitting room and noticed the mixed queue, got to the head and was pointed to changing area "it's mixed just pick any cubicle". I was a bit surprised but went with it thinking it would be fine as long as there were self-contained cubicles with floor-to-ceiling lockable doors. Got met with row upon row of curtained cubicles, hard to see which ones were occupied without angling myself to check down the gap at the side (they never seem to close over properly without much faffing) or looking at the bottom to see if I could see feet. Gingerly opened one and to my relief it was free. I hated it.

I was trying on a dress that involved me taking my shoes off and stripping down to my bra and knickers. My elbow would move the curtain every now and again so I was constantly checking it was closed over properly. I could hear teenage lads walking past and the girl in the next cubicle was squeezed in with her boyfriend who was chatting away. It was crazy. I felt so vulnerable and tense so didn't bother trying my other 2 dresses on.

Previously I would have got an outfit on and maybe if I needed help with the zip or wanted my friend/daughter's opinion I would come out into the communal area and look in the full length mirror. I might come out partially dressed (unbuttoned, unzipped etc...) and ask an assistant for the next size up etc... But there's no way you can do that in this mixed setting. When I pulled back the curtain there was a man waiting at the end of one row, looking on his phone, probably just waiting on his wife or girlfriend. It just felt wrong.

I remember when there were communal changing rooms and they were bad enough but at least they weren't mixed. My DD said she went to H&M with her boyfriend and they were exactly the same - just curtained. Her boyfriend came in and just sat on the floor at the end of a row of curtained cubicles and she said it didn't feel right but didn't say anything.

I've been to Cos and their changing rooms are completely self-contained, lockable, floor-to-ceiling cubicles. It's on a much smaller scale too which helps - probably a max of 10 cubicles. I can deal with that. But since when did shops think they could pile in 30/40/50 curtained spaces and mix in men with women and make the changing experience so bloody horrible? I haven't been in an M&S changing room for a while - are any of theirs going mixed? I'm concerned it's becoming a trend and I don't understand why.

As a young girl I'd have been worried about lads pulling back curtains 'accidentally'. As an adult I'm worried about anyone pulling back a curtain and exposing me in a state of undress but more uncomfortable if there's a chance my best mate's Dad is stood there! I'm not keen on shopping at the best of times but if this is the way things are going, it's online all the way for me. The High Street can do one.

AIBU?

Very rare is not never. And very rare means the possibility, never mind the accidental or 'accidental' opening of a curtain or door.

Never mind whether or not you shop at Primark (or never as in my case), changing rooms should not be invitations to voyeurism or harm.

They have been mixed for many years now in plenty of shops, perhaps always. Supermarkets etc have mixed changing don't see the issue. As long as there's cubicles with a curtain that is

If they are floor to ceiling lockable ones, I have no issue with mixed ones. Having been sexually assaulted at 7 by a man underneath the gap in a swimming pool changing room, I have real problems with mixed ones that have curtains or gaps underneath.

I think within 10 years store changing rooms will no longer exist.

It’s funny how teenage girls are told “consent is like a cup of tea”….. until women say they DON’T consent to sharing same sex facilities…. Then we are told we are weird, uptight, etc etc.
it doesn’t matter the reason, anybody can say they don’t want to change in front of men for any reason, and that should be respected.

Those are the ones it is easiest for men to install photographic equipment in. Like the MET officer in the news story just posted.

Perhaps you could try reading the thread and then you'd see why people have an issue.

It would be very helpful to have a list of stores that have mixed facilities so we can avoid them.
I wonder can any of these places acceot customer feedback

Speak for yourself! I would never wear a bikini in public as it feels too near naked for me.

It is the popularity of tiny hidden cameras that I really dislike. Floor to ceiling doors are not going to help with that.

So you can install spy cameras 'more easily' in self-contained cubicles so therefore mixed changing rooms aren't an issue?? Two different issues, same common problem - perverted men. And AlisonDonut you clearly didn't read the article I linked to - the Met officer stuck his camera underneath the gap between the changing rooms so it most definitely was NOT a self-contained cubicle.

And gogohmm what parallel universe have you been living in where there have hardly been any separate facilities for men and women? And changing rooms in Supermarkets? Is that the only place you've ever tried clothes on in? Strange. And yes, I've tried clothes on in charity shops and they're not separated by sex but I wouldn't choose to try my clothes on in there if there was any other option but I've taken my chances on many occasions because I live in the real world. But department stores that usually have different sections/floors for men and women's clothing have traditionally had separate sex changing rooms. Don't pretend this trend for mixed changing rooms isn't a recent development.

Yes I know he stuck the camera underneath. It would have been EASIER for him to just go in and lock the door. And install a camera. And go back another time and lock the door and remove it.

That's what I mean by easier.

Which is why the best way to protect women from voyeurism is not to allow men to enter in the first place.

There are probably dirty men wanking in such facilities knowing there are half dressed women mere inches away

They are common in my area, but are always full rooms with real doors. I have never felt remotely exposed because the rooms are very private.

there is still some risk from just access, someone being able to lurk more easily or place cameras. The larger places all have attendants in the changing rooms so that helps. I’m also not convinced that having a men’s and women’s side really prevents someone from slipping in. In some ways I prefer being aware that men may have been in the room recently or might be nearby, but I take that comfort from a closed room not a curtained cubicle.

How do you think a woman tries on a bra without taking off the one she’s wearing? Or she tries on a dress which requires a strapless bra and she’s not wearing one out, so takes hers off to see how the dress looks.

You don't understand this fetish.

It would have been even easier to go online and watch porn rather than secretly film it, or even watch livestream that other people have captured

The thrill is not in seeing naked bodies. The thrill is in the context. Some men like the kink of secretly filming - using installed cctv or cameras. Some men like the thrill of the risk - high risk activities with the rush of being caught. Some men like exposing their penis on changing rooms when they can't be challenged.

There are very good reasons why women don't feel secure around men.

Who are the voyeurs, the gropers, the exhibitionists, the rapists (not likely in this situation, I'll grant you), the upskirters, the ones who make sexual or threatening comments?

Hint. It's not women.

do you see the irony of you saying you would come out of a changing room with your clothes unbuttoned / unzipped possibly exposing yourself to a member off staff / public.

I do understand that fetish.

However are you saying that there is no market for hidden cams? Because there is. It is massive. Men invent more and more hidden cams each year.

Lime37 the irony? Is your name Alanis Morrisette? The member of staff or public would be female in a female changing room.

Nope.

You were saying it's easier to put a secret camera in than take photos under the gap.

I'm saying that wasn't the thrill seeking risk he was looking for

Ok so there is the market for hidden cams AND a market for putting their cameras under or through a curtain.

Both of which are available opportunities in mixed sex changing rooms.

Check how they are badged - ‘changing room’ with no male/female icon and chances are a male would not be challenged in the changing room in the ladies wear dept. That’s what M&S and JL did (and have confirmed that they are ‘whatever gender area you feel comfortable in because we are an inclusive company bla bla bla’)

Would they though? Or could they just say they were?