Support thread for those hosting refugees and advice for those thinking about it

[Honeysuckle9]

As per the previous thread this is a thread so we can offer support to each other and also outline the things we should be thinking about before making this leap

Really? Nothing I have ever read about people’s experiences taking in evacuees in WW2 would lead people to romanticise the experience. If anything it would help one anticipate the challenges. I very much enjoyed Marjorie Allingham’s The Oaken Heart recently, I was smiling with recognition at the evacuation passages.

Obviously romanticising what it’s going to be like is going to be a risk when you do something like this but I very much doubt that is more of an issue for the UK than anywhere else.

I said at the start that hosting long term is only going to work if they become like lodgers not house guests. Nobody can cope with guests for months on end, that's going to wear your down so badly. Those who are being expected to cook, have you given your guests a kitchen cupboard, and shelf in the fridge and freezer? I think that, and a tour of what's where in the kitchen is essential if they're to become independent. We still do some meals together (which is reciprocal) but increasingly cook separately. They like to eat at different times from us so that works ok. The fridge and freezer space is a swash I'll admit. But I'd rather that than be hosting them as guests for months.

Maybe it's just a communication thing but she doesn't ask.

I grew up abroad and know from many, many friends that my style of communication is much more direct than anyone who has grown up here.

I would encourage you to reply no, that won't work when you are 'told' that you will look after someone else's child. It may be a cultural expectation but it really doesn't mean that you have to do that.

Really don't want to imply that it's your 'fault' The thing about miscommunication is that it needs someone to change their style. Might as well be the person being inconvenienced.

I said at the start that hosting long term is only going to work if they become like lodgers not house guests.

I think this is a very astute observation.

I also think that it’s appropriate to review and re-set house rules and expectations periodically.

So if you have been hosting a guest - think what practical things grate for you and have a calm and open conversation.

I also think it’s important to have some self compassion and not judge yourself that you are having uncomfortable feelings - but important that you tend to them as they are telling you something is “off” and if you don’t take practical steps it will build and fester to resentment and contempt which is unnecessary.

I have had some issues but then took responsibility for calmly voicing new routines (or reinforcing existing ones that have slipped) - I felt much better for it.

But it is tough….whether it’s a lodger or a guest in your home long term.

My 3 are flying back from Ukraine on Saturday. I wonder how long they will stay here and if their trip home and the shift in the war will influence their decision to return permanently to Ukraine.

This is probably it but if I was told to mind the child I would say no. I'm only being told she's going out, the child will stay here. He's often in his room

only being told she's going out, the child will stay here

Fair enough, If the child doesn't, in your opinion, need supervision. If the mother is assuming you will supervise, then best to say 'sorry, you can't leave him alone' if that is the case

English can sound very abrupt if you use English words with the sentence construction of other languages, which is very easy to fall into if you are stretching beyond your true capability in a foreign language. If no-one ever corrects you, how will you learn . There are many, many nuances that native speakers take for granted that are baffling or just simple beyond the capabilities of many learners.

Many native English speakers only speak the one language so just don't know what it's like to struggle to make yourself understood. It's very very easy to be misunderstood in a different language. It's really not 'rude' to correct a non native speaker or ask then whether they really mean what they have just said. It's a kindness really.

Anyone hosting families is already doing a great thing and don't really deserve to be struggling on so many fronts at once. I hope you don't mind my mentioning the language thing here and hope it doesn't just feel like another thing needing to be done by the host.

Tell her no, your house is not suitable for an unaccompanied child. He could set the place alight for a start. And she’d be breaking the law.

Yes really. Wartime camaraderie and all that. People who took in evacuees will understand that. Lifetime friendships were made in doing so but I have a feeling few will be made from this. Perhaps some people thought it would all be cosy chats over a cup of tea and everyone out picking blackberries in the countryside with aunt Flo. But it turns out In many cases they are not like us, don't understand us, and in a number of cases do not really want to be here and won't even talk to their hosts. I genuinely think they had different ideas about what it would be like coming here and some hosts had different ideas about what it would be like having them stay, which as we now know has not met expectations from either side. Instead as this thread shows we have people who have little comprehension of how to adjust to living as a guest and are desperately unhappy doing so.

I also think that it’s appropriate to review and re-set house rules and expectations periodically.
So if you have been hosting a guest - think what practical things grate for you and have a calm and open conversation

This is spot on. We've tried to be clear calm and direct about things that aren't ok. Our guest speaks no English so we have done it through apps but sometimes emails have been better as the translation is more accurate. Plus it gives her a chance to digest it. She finds conversations very upsetting even if we are careful about things. It's been a really difficult balance to know how much to say and how much to bite our tongues, but I think a lot of that is because she is depressed/finds co-habiting very difficult generally (we were told this through a convoluted route a couple of months in to her stay, about a previous experience she had in Ukraine)/doesn't know how to handle her son, so inevitably finds talking about it difficult and would much rather avoid it.

From our side, it has been a real learning curve on communication and how just raising concerns is essential to trying to restore harmony in the longer term, whilst trying to understand as best we can from our positions of near ignorance quite how terrible her situation is.

@LuckyLil - picking blueberries? Come on, I’m not sure that was anyones idea of how this would work

Speaking for myself, I don't think there was any romanticising about how it would be. I had no real expectations of life long friendship, just taking in someone likely to be very traumatised with all that comes with that and doing our best for a few months. The problems we have had are undoubtedly partly cultural (bedtimes etc) but are in greater measure just a result of individual personalities and needs.

I don't get the sense from others I have spoken to that they have romanticised it. Just trying to help out in a terrible situation, recognising it was likely to be difficult for all concerned. And inevitably the group of us talking on this site are probably the ones who are having the problems! There are a huge number of positive stories out there, too!

That’s one of the strangest posts I have seen on this thread. Firstly that’s a really idealised view of WW2 evacuation which I have come across a lot less often than the more negative town-country culture clash stories, so I would be surprised if it set the tone for many people’s expectations.
Secondly you seem to have a very jaded view of how this is working. Are you hosting and having a hard time? There are many for whom it’s been difficult on both sides but among the people I know in RL who are doing it (as opposed to on this ‘let’s have a place to support each other’ thread which is by its very nature not going to be representative) a majority are getting on ok. Not always plain sailing, but not a hideous nightmare either. There are also a lot of Ukrainians who are unhappy… but not because of anything wrong with the expectations of them or their hosts but because their country is at war, people are being killed, parts of it have been destroyed… that is the real nightmare.

It's not illegal to leave a 10 year old home alone. It's probably around the younger end of when most British parents would consider it ok, but that that varies and if the mum is saying to you that she's happy with leaving him, and he's not causing any trouble (eg, he's in his room) I don't think you can really tell her not to do this, at least not by saying you refuse to mind him as in her mind that's not being asked of you.

I think there are various reasons hosts may be struggling.

For sure, in some cases guests are rude/selfish/violent/greedy/lazy/insert adjective here. Nothing to do with anything other than people being people and that being a refugee doesn't make you a saint.

In other cases, there are undoubtedly cultural challenges - no one is at fault but it's hard to have someone in your house doing things very differently to the way you do things. Children staying up late is fine when it doesn't impact on others, but in a household situation it's a challenge. Leaving children unaccompanied (a common complaint) is not ok here but seems very widespread in Ukraine. And while I can't see how leaving a 5 year old alone is anything other than a terrible idea, clearly it happens and (usually) everyone is fine.

And I do think there are hosts who entered into this with an unrealistic expectation of what it would be like. Doubt that has anything to do with WW2, but right from the start I wondered how those hosts who did everything for their guests, paid for everything and said "they are our new family" would feel four or five months in. My assessment of this, from various social media groups, is not great because it's exhausting and unsustainable, particularly if those on the receiving end then let you down in various ways. Or just people where you wonder what they were thinking - I'm aware of a family near here who welcomed a mother and 3 children under the age of 10 into their home, meaning there were 3 adults and 5 children in a five bedroom house with 2 bathrooms and not much living space. Unsurprisingly, this was a disaster and the Ukrainian family has had to be rehoused.

I suspect most hosts at this point, a few months in, are just a bit tired. Not desperate, not about to kick their guests out, just wanting their homes back and wondering how that is ever going to happen when there's unlikely to be an end to the war any time soon (and my lovely easy going helpful guest has said she doesn't plan on going back any time soon even if it does end - she likes it here and wants to earn money to send home and improve her English) and the prospects for most of renting in a cost of living crisis with a huge shortage of rental properties are vanishingly small. I did not expect it to be such hard work, because naively I thought support would be available. I did think that after nearly 6 months there would be some end in sight, and there isn't. I do want my home back but my commitment to my guest and my desire to make sure she is ok trump my own needs and wants, but I feel an overwhelming sense of exhaustion most of the time. And that's with a guest who is a single adult with good English, a decent work ethic and a relatively tidy and clean approach to living in a shared space.

My guest is looking to move out. Yes it'll be tough financially for her but the council do seem to be looking to offer some help so I'm hopeful that that will be the long term solution for her.

First I'm sure most of us had fairly realistic expectations about the realities of hosting. I expected it to be challenging at times and rewarding at others and so it proved to be - some of the specific challenges were not anticipated however.

The diet and lack of routine for kids is certainly very different to the way we usually parent in the UK - but we don't have young children so that didn't impact us nearly as much as it would have done if our kids were still small and at home.

I feel that Ukrainians give their children more independence at an an early age too. We had a 10yo staying with us - they cycled to school alone on Day 2 of term (quite a complicated route including hills & a section on a busy main road, and abandoned the high viz jacket & helmet I provided within a few days). The Mum often sent them alone to the local supermarket as well, a 10-minute walk away but again involving crossing a busy road.

When the 10 yo was not at school they were left to themselves for much of the day while Mum worked online, while the 4yo was plonked in front of an iPad in her room. She sometimes left the 10yo in charge of their 4 yo sibling, albeit we were usually in the house at the same time.

I should also add that both kids were very polite, engaging and generally well-behaved which makes a huge difference!

Excellent post LaurelGrove.
Among the hosts in my local area the one where it has broken down is the one that was the most ‘new member of the family.’ Lodger level is a far better place to pin your expectations. In our case we have ended up doing far more together than we ever had with any lodgers but that has grown organically and perhaps feels comfortable only because we all have a strong sense of boundaries.

No romanticism here either. I attended the Sanctuary prep talks and was under no illusions.

We continue to go over our house rules as things slip very quickly. Bedtimes and lack of supervision, cooking and cleaning issues, work/preparation for moving on are the challenges we're facing. We have finally had our host payment 14 weeks in. We have stopped buying all their food and paying their expenses (as per our original plan). It is definitely focusing the mind more and they've started to ask how to fill in the UC journal when previously were not interested. I wonder what has been said at their appointments.

We have settled into a more harmonious life together though. I would say lodger covers it. I definitely had visions of offering to go out together with the kids and trying to offer them nice social and cultural experiences, but the lack of supervision even in public unknown places was such a disaster we did this once and once only.

We have settled into a more harmonious life together though. I would say lodger covers it. I definitely had visions of offering to go out together with the kids and trying to offer them nice social and cultural experiences, but the lack of supervision even in public unknown places was such a disaster we did this once and once only.

This is absolutely true for us also:

'I definitely had visions of offering to go out together with the kids and trying to offer them nice social and cultural experiences, but the lack of supervision even in public unknown places was such a disaster we did this once and once only.'

Although I am still willing to take them out to places - but with long gaps in between for me to recover. 😁

And yes we too have settled into fairly okay routine. I was always happy to have a lodger style arrangement. I think they wanted more, if anything.

And the task for us now is to keep bringing to the front of mind that next steps are going to have to be decided on and taken at some point in the not too distant future.

My idea of WW2 evacuees (in so far as I have an idea of it) is of under-nourished tearaways sewn into their vest and pants. But maybe that is just from reading 'Goodnight, Mr Tom'.

One expectation I did have before hosting was that a guest would want to work and move towards independence. I now realise that many Ukrainians who came here are still in limbo and part of their mind is still in Ukraine. That makes it hard to put effort into learning English, finding work here etc. It's totally understandable and normal, but that is one thing I hadn't realised would be the case.

(PS Sorry about the previous odd post - not sure how that got out there before I was ready)

One expectation I did have before hosting was that a guest would want to work and move towards independence. I now realise that many Ukrainians who came here are still in limbo and part of their mind is still in Ukraine. That makes it hard to put effort into learning English, finding work here etc. It's totally understandable and normal, but that is one thing I hadn't realised would be the case.

^ in our case we were told they would want to work etc and they asked lots of questions about this before arriving. The reality has been somewhat different. As you say, the head and heart are still in Ukraine and wanting to return asap.

Well, today her kid came home unwell and she said he'll stay home and she was going off to her appointment. This gave me the opportunity to say I will not be here if something happens, he needs to be watched. So she organised a relative to mind him. If I said nothing she probably would have left him which annoys me- like I should cancel my plans to mind her kid but she goes ahead with her own?? No way. I have three smaller kids who are much harder work and I mind and feed and organise my own family which is quite frankly enough work

Are anyone else’s guests feeling the strain particularly at the moment? My family seem stressed. I talked to the mum about whether she is worried about friends and family in Russia (she lived there for a few years) and she said no she was mainly worried about people in Ukraine with the rising prices for basics. They are normally extremely good at not communicating anxiety to their kids but I think it is seeping through (which then makes their lives harder again as the kids play up). The 3 yo has suddenly started to talk about the war and his toys at home.

Mine are going back to the Ukraine. I gave them their leaving date which was earlier than 6 months (for various reasons but mainly my sanity and that of my sons) and because they didn't want to look for anywhere themselves or pay any rent etc have decided to go home.

Whereabouts in Ukraine are they from?