Is Starmer seriously going to resign???

[Swayingpalmtrees]

I have been waiting for a thread to come up about this, but I can't see one to date. I can't believe Keir Starmer has now said he will resign (and Angela Rayner as well) Potentially leaving the Labour party with no leader at all!

Looking at the 'evidence' that is well known and has been published, it appears the Indian takeaway was pre ordered (due to its size) and pre planned according to the staff at the Indian and the leaked memo, it did include quite a number of people and bottles of beer etc and drinking. It was late into the night, so not work related, and no one is suggesting anyone continued to work afterwards as it was so late. I don't see how this is any different to the No10 arrangements! So how on earth will they avoid a fine??

Sir Keir's speech was so wobbly I actually thought he was resigning there and then, and although I appreciate the sentiments of integrity and honour, where on earth does that leave the LP with under two years to the election or less?

Who would replace him? Do we have any thoughts on a plan of any kind?

I am kind of aghast, we are in the middle of a European war, on the cusp of potentially WW3, I am not sure this is a responsible action given the seriousness of our predicament with Russia whom are threatening us on a weekly basis with nuclear war. At the very very least, we need a firm hand on the tiller, so to speak, we do not have time to be squabbling over beer and cheese.
AIBU?

I didn't say it couldn't.

Although I doubt his interior designer or his baby were involved in those work discussions.

Exactly. The OP and subsequent posts are ridiculous, as I said before.

Ordering a sandwich/takeaway and sitting at your desk/or elsewhere eating it before resuming work is a 'work related' break

Standing around in a big group drinking beer and eating dinner was against the rules at the time, and no work took place DURING the dinner party nor afterwards! It has been confirmed by all concerned that Starmer did not continue to work at the venue afterwards and he (and others) walked back to the hotel. These facts are not disputed by anyone, not even Sir Keir!!!!

He has not said at any point that he continued to work at the venue post beer and Indian, and nor will he because it is not true. They have got him over a barrel with the memo. I wonder who leaked it, and what their motivations were?

I suspect that Starmer's team have a way better grasp of the law than the op, who is sounding increasingly like a young Tory staffer desperate to impress. With the exception of frothing DM readers, nobody thinks this is anything like the 2020 Downing Street party season.

Don't be daft. He's a politician and there will be a fudge way out if needs must and there is a problem. He won't resign.

I have no idea whether he broke the rules. Frankly at this point, I couldn't care less. Its just not relevant. Its not as if that changes anything. It doesn't mean Johnson is somehow off the hook either in anyway.

However, the ship with the idea over Starmer having integrity long since sailed regardless of this issue.

I wish we would focus on the problems that we all have day to day, rather than this nonsense which is ignoring the cost of living issues which are massive.

Boris Johnson is the Prime Minister, it is a disgrace that he is being investigated for multiple occasions. Of course he should resign, he is bringing the role of PM into disrepute.

Nobody seems to think him being on a work trip is relevant. Why is that? I've been away on business, had a meal and some drinks with colleagues and clients and that's a different thing to having drinks after work. Starmer wasn't having drinks before heading home, he was glad handing the Party Faithful in his role as Leader.

Yes, even in a pandemic

All those attending the big garden party did NOT get fined, unless Johnson has been fined twice & we have not been told?

I believe (but apologies, I can't find the link) that the police said they wouldn't issue any more fines for the Downing Street things until after the local election.

I saw a tweet (again, I can't find it, sorry) from Robert Peston that some people at the garden party had been fined, but that if Boris was going to be fined, it would be post-local election. I'm not sure how long after, or whether at some point they'll specifically say no more fines will be issued?

When you think of the photo of Johnson, his wife, baby and umpteen other people in No 10's garden and we are told that wasn't an offence I don't see how Keir Starmer eating with colleagues is an offence.

Different to inviting people to a party.

I find the whole thing ridiculous. Labour having beers and food in their work bubble was nothing, Tories eating Birthday cake and drinking (lots of) wine in their work bubble was also nothing. People being prosecuted or told off by the police for very petty reasons was the real scandal.

Keir should resign because the man is a sack of custard. He has fumbled the labour leadership and supported the government at every turn. Cronyism in the tory party is left unchecked.

OP, are you actually familiar with the miners hall? It's not exactly a party-friendly venue, infection here is what is looks like. Its very much geared towards a meeting/conference environment rather than entertaining, the layout also makes it very easy to maintain appropriate distances.

Are you also familiar with the Spice Lounge in Durham? You'd be hard pressed to feed more than 10-12 people for £200 never mind 30 and that's presuming everyone has a starter, a basic main with rice or chips, and a naan bread.

DH worked in politics a long time ago (actually for the Tories, when they were more sensible) and it is totally normal to arrange a takeaway / pizzas etc for the people who have been working. Lockdown didn't prevent this and campaigning was legal.

Starmer says he then worked afterwards, and I'd be fairly surprised if they couldn't prove this with emails, messages, etc.

BJ, on the other hand, appears to have just ignored the rules and did as he liked. Wine Fridays, Cummings leaving celebration, and so on and on and on.

Seems to me there is a good deal of difference between the two situations, but obviously benefits BJ to pursue a line that essentially drags everyone down to his level of mendacity and bullshittery.

I didn't say it couldn't.

well I doubt many would think it justifies Johnson's actions, so I'd be careful using it to justify Starmers.

Although I doubt his interior designer or his baby were involved in those work discussions.

Not particularly relevant to this discussion. In Johnson's case his home is also a place of work, so bringing the baby into it is a red herring.

But that's not the case in all jobs. Your individual experience has no impact on this issue.

Ordering a sandwich/takeaway and sitting at your desk/or elsewhere eating it before resuming work is a 'work related' break
Is it the standing up that bothers you? You don’t have to resume work afterwards for it to be a break. And in any case if he resumed work back at the hotel he fulfils your imaginary criteria:

Did some work
Ate some food
Resumed work (at a new venue)

I just brought this up with a group of people (adhoc not same social circle) the key thing that came up was will he resign - and that he’ll have to if fined, painted in a corner etc

I don’t think people care that much at this stage re the nuance of it all unless invested politically

I can't attach the whole menu s its too many photos but here are some examples

I think Starmer has had enough and wants an 'out'. I think Sunak will resign eventually too

I actually think there is something to this, given how badly the tories have performed in the last six months (and well before) with party gate, porn watching etc etc if Labour can not win a landslide on the backdrop of such incompetence then when can they? The local election results beyond London were pretty dire, it should have been a free win for the Labour but it was not.

There is a serious problem of another Islington suit running the party without the credentials to be able to win back the heartlands. They stand no chance in the election if the latest results are anything to go by, and perhaps Starmer is sick of flogging a dead horse? It is futile and an honourable resignation will preserve his next career move.

I don't think he is going to resign because I can't see how any valid FPN can be issued against him. But I think he absolutely means it. Unlike Johnson, he is a man of his word.

He has not said at any point that he continued to work at the venue post beer and Indian, and nor will he because it is not true. They have got him over a barrel with the memo.

So, he'll be fined and resign. Im not sure where your outrage is coming from. The police haven't said they won't fine him (which you would clearly disagree with), and he will resign if they do.

From your posts, you are totally confident he'll be fined, and him resigning seems like something you'd want. You should be happy with the turn of events.

I also think he should resign if fined, I think it would untenable not to given what he has said about Johnson and Sunak. And now he's said he will, so it's all good.

Sooty - complete failure to quite the message I was responding to (Ie another inane message from OP to tbe effect tbat people didn’t work together late into the night - and eat - during a pandemic)

< Sorry, not sooty >

In your job, but not in his or in mine. The Commons does lots of its business in Parliament's bars, as James Cleverly said last week. I work in publishing and on occasions where people are working late, it's very common for pizza and beers to be ordered in. I know in teaching (for example) the rules are rightly much stricter, but it isn't the case here.