Is Starmer seriously going to resign???

[Swayingpalmtrees]

I have been waiting for a thread to come up about this, but I can't see one to date. I can't believe Keir Starmer has now said he will resign (and Angela Rayner as well) Potentially leaving the Labour party with no leader at all!

Looking at the 'evidence' that is well known and has been published, it appears the Indian takeaway was pre ordered (due to its size) and pre planned according to the staff at the Indian and the leaked memo, it did include quite a number of people and bottles of beer etc and drinking. It was late into the night, so not work related, and no one is suggesting anyone continued to work afterwards as it was so late. I don't see how this is any different to the No10 arrangements! So how on earth will they avoid a fine??

Sir Keir's speech was so wobbly I actually thought he was resigning there and then, and although I appreciate the sentiments of integrity and honour, where on earth does that leave the LP with under two years to the election or less?

Who would replace him? Do we have any thoughts on a plan of any kind?

I am kind of aghast, we are in the middle of a European war, on the cusp of potentially WW3, I am not sure this is a responsible action given the seriousness of our predicament with Russia whom are threatening us on a weekly basis with nuclear war. At the very very least, we need a firm hand on the tiller, so to speak, we do not have time to be squabbling over beer and cheese.
AIBU?

From what I heard on R4 last night, his legal advisers have said it is unlikely he will be fined. Ordering a take-away to eat while working was not illegal, nor was having a beer as your drink with the meal (though that makes it look worse - if he'd been swigging a bottle of water in the photo I don't think this issue would ever have raised its head). Pre-ordering it isn't an issue. If anything, this make it seem more like it was a planned meal-break during campaigning rather than a spontaneous evening of socialising after work. However, they will have to find what the police investigation concludes.

I can't see that he had much other choice than to say that really. Otherwise he will never away public opinion towards him. Everyone would think he was a hypocrite for chastising Johnson for not resigning then refusing to say whether he would do that himself. It also said on the radio that the investigation could take 8 weeks and he would have to spend that time fending off questions about it. Now he has clarified his position and can continue with other political issues while the investigation is carried out.

"If I were caught drinking bottle of beer at work, I would be sacked immediately. They were clearly not working, it was 10pm at night!"

Obviously you've never worked for a high-ranking politician!

The next day Anne Widdicombe says anything sensible will be the first.

I feel like the alcohol is the bad look for the optics. Most people can’t relate to alcohol plus working being a thing. Not since the 90s anyway!
i appreciate it will be different (clearly) in politics but that doesn’t make it relatable.

The document stated that there would be a "dinner in Miners Hall" with City of Durham MP Mary Foy from 8.40pm to 10pm - and a note indicated a member of staff in Sir Keir's office was to arrange the takeaway curry from the Spice Lounge. The only business listed after the dinner was for him to walk back to his hotel

The idea he was working just doesn't stack up at all.
A 'dinner in Miners Hall' for up to 30 people at 8.40pm to 10pm!

Importantly, he does not claim to be working post curry and beer.

www.lbc.co.uk/news/keir-starmer-beergate-curry-takeaway-pre-planned-leaked-memo/

The police will be accused of corruption if they don't fine as it is no different from the other 'parties' that have happened elsewhere......

This whole story has been ridiculous from the start, if Durham has an Indian restaurant that can provide dinner & beers for the alleged 30 people all for 200 quid I’ll drive up there from London to pick up a takeaway!

I am guessing you have never done political campaiging OP? Whether you think it is impossible to work past 10pm, or would be fined for drinking alcohol, is irrelevant

Also this:
More to the point, why is the person actually convicted of lying to parliament and breaking the law not actually being decent enough to resign?

If they are fined they both have no choice but to resign after all he and AR said about partygate. How many other jobs are there where you can drink alcohol and carry on working, have bars to meet up in, can you imagine a doctor or nurse sitting down with a curry and lager midway between their shift, the whole set up is a disgrace.

It's wildly different to the No. 10 parties, and everyone with half a brain knows it. They were working very late and everyone needed feeding - that's normal when campaigning, and in any job where you work late. Some of those people chose to have beers to drink. It wasn't a pre-arranged party, after work - they were just feeding the people who had worked late.

And as for not changing leaders - I'm sure it'll be fine. I very much doubt Putin or Zelensky really care either way.

Do you honestly think the British public will believe that he was working, even though they can see people standing around at nearly 9pm drinking beer and eating curry?

It will look like a police stitch up if they do not fine. There will be an uproar and a huge backlash if the police are not seen to be acting fairly and treating both parties equally.
If he is double bluffing that is a huge risk to take and one that might see the end of his career now.

It’s madness and I don’t think he should resign even if fined

The next day Anne Widdicombe says anything sensible will be the first.

Yeah, all nice and cryptic, but she was right, as far as I can see.

Hopefully the likes of the Mail will think twice in future before stirring the shit.

It’s interesting the war in Ukraine means we can’t change leader, Churchill wasn’t the PM at the start of WW2 & we were definitely more involved with that one

it just makes Johnson look more and more like an untrustworthy bounder.

There isn't a person alive who doesn't know that already. Those who support him don't care.

"Do you honestly think the British public will believe that he was working, even though they can see people standing around at nearly 9pm drinking beer and eating curry?"

They have to eat. Doesn't mean they weren't working into the wee hours afterwards.

And yes, polling shows the public don't give a shit about this.

He’s being advised pretty well on how to politically make it work for him

When I was working late, unpaid, in the nhs I needed feeding too, usually a snickers or a packet of crisps, if I was feeling very rebellious I might even steal a cup of nhs tea and a few digestive biscuits out the ward tin.

Op on here they will always justify it as ok or not as bad as xyz , the reality js , they never needed to meet in large numbers like that or have beers however you look at it , most of is were still even avoiding the office and having teams meetings etc still

Do you honestly think the British public will believe that he was working, even though they can see people standing around at nearly 9pm drinking beer and eating curry?

Sorry OP but you are being really naive. Plenty of jobs involve working late and/or pre-planned eating and drinking at 9pm.

In my job - if we work late on a project we're ordered food to the office and there are beers in the Facilities cupboard we'd be able to take a limited number of. And actually, a lot of working lunches with clients feature alcohol (although less so than 10+ years ago, when you'd basically put your out of office on and plan to get the last train home. Times change!).

Of course a doctor doesn't have a beer halfway through a shift, but politicians aren't doctors, they're not responsible for keeping people alive, they were just working late.

The issue as far as I can see it:

They were not 'working' at the time, they can clearly be seen standing around and chatting, drinking beer.

Breaking for food during work would include sitting at the desk for five minutes and eating and for most companies a soft drink. There would be no need to stand around in a group drinking beer if you are claiming to be working!!

There is no mention of work continuing in the memo, only the 'dinner at Miners Hall' and then a walk back to the hotel. Had the memo also included resuming work/meeting/campaign planning then I think they would fair much better with the police investigation. The memo goes into great detail - and there lies the problem. There is NO mention of working/another meeting etc

Most people can see that this looks very much like an end of campaign dinner!! People are not stupid despite what the LP might think...

Also often missed when Starmer bashing - the rules were very different from when Boris had his gatherings. The photo of Downing Street when they are all in the garden was taken on my birthday, so I remember those rules very clearly. I was allowed to sit in a garden with EITHER my mum OR my dad NOT both. There are about 40 people in the Downing Street garden photo

Sorry OP but you are being really naive. Plenty of jobs involve working late and/or pre-planned eating and drinking at 9pm

Not in a pandemic.

For the third time, because apparently it's really difficult to grasp: the data shows people don't care.

If you're a boris supporter trying to fan the flames then fine, but stop pretending everyone's mortified by this and that no-one could possibly work late.