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Original poster

Grandparents not wanting to do childcare...

485 replies

Chewchewaboogiw · 04/05/2022 23:32

Have been thinking about several people I know whose planned retirememt or part time work has been changed as they have been asked to do childcare for their dgc and now they are doing chikdcare say 3 days a week instead of their plan to travel. And not massively happy about it ( in one case another.baby due also)..I have seen a post response recently that said that they take dgc out but they are not there for childcare. If you dont do childcare for your dgc how did you say no?( I am not in that position at present but i can imagine it would be hard work ..) I would imagine / fear adult ds would be hurt if they were told no dont want to do chikdcare and cant imagine how it would be phrased in a positive way.. anyone said no and is it bu to say you dont want to ... or is it now expected. I know that all families.different, am just asking about families who are comfortable in saying no .

OP posts:
MumsGoneToIceland · 08/05/2022 05:51

My parents made it clear way before I was thinking of children (I think when I was still living at home) that they wouldn’t do childcare, that they had done their time. MIL offered to do it after I had my first dd and I politely declined on the grounds that I wanted them to have a proper grandparent/grandchild relationship whereas if they cared for them the relationship would inevitably be different

ZigZagIntoTheBlue · 08/05/2022 06:48

My mum was always clear about not offering regular childcare, but she has gone above and beyond when we were in a tight spot and needed help in emergencies. If I get sick in traffic and won't make after school club I know she'll go get them for me.
I think any hurt feelings would come from mismanaged expectations - I knew from the start she didn't want to, if she had spent a year saying she did want to then suddenly said no it might've felt hurtful. Also, I knew she wouldn't respect our decisions as parents with respect to limiting sugar in a toddler etc so was personally happier paying for childcare.

BestDove · 08/05/2022 07:53

@dalmatianmad 💐 you sound absolutely lovely. Made me quite emotional reading how you support your DD

BestDove · 08/05/2022 08:04

Posts like this make me so sad. We get zero grandparent help.

My mum died when I was younger. My dad makes precisely zero effort and then complains when my DC don't want to engage in a monthly FaceTime call with him.

I remember asking him desperately if he'd please watch my 11 month baby for 4 hours so I could go to a job interview I needed. He said no "they [him and step mother] don't do childcare". It's a total lie. They don't do regular childcare as they go on holiday every 6-8 weeks (no exaggeration), but she's got 5 kids herself and countless grandchildren and they are always there for school drop off/pick up/tea/sleepovers!!! I then called him a couple of days after that conversation and begged him to please help me. The answer was still no. I ended up hiring a total stranger from a babysitting agency, so dbs checked etc, but a total random person. I took the babysitter and my baby to the office building where my interview was. I gave her money for a coffee and asked her to walk around the area and meet me back at the reception in an hour. I got the job and it was a godsend.

My heart still breaks whenever I think of that situation though. I never asked for help before and I haven't asked since.

My dear mum would be absolutely furious with him. He's a shit dad since she died and a total irrelevant, non-existent grandparent.

Momicrone · 08/05/2022 08:10

Plenty of people hire total strangers, what's wrong with that?

TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams · 08/05/2022 08:23

I struggle with the other extreme albeit with after school care for older children but too young to have a door key and a weekly early morning so 7-9am.

MIL is adamant she wants to do it, has a fit at any suggestion of an au pair or other carer but is clearly resentful of the tie on her time particularly if arrangements change. She is massively passive aggressive about it and it's doing my head in.

My parents were always very clear there was no way they were getting involved like this.

WildCoasts · 08/05/2022 08:27

HistoricMoment · 08/05/2022 05:31

Whyall the hyperbole? Looking after a child one day a week is not going to stop any grandparent from going out to lunch, doing a hobby, going out in the evenings, or even travelling. It's literally 10 hours or less out of the 148 hours of one week.

Show quote history

One day a week is one thing, a lot of posts are talking about more, sometimes much more. I would love to look after a GC one day a week. I can take the to the zoo, to the park, lots of things. I'd love it. That would be my choice and not an obligation though. I'd also expect that if I want to go for a three month cruise (not my thing, just hypothetical) that I would be able to do that and the child's parents would make other arrangements for that time. I could resume when I get back, if the parents want that.

DurhamDurham · 08/05/2022 08:28

Our youngest daughter was pregnant in her final year at uni, luckily we had just downsized and paid off the mortgage so both me and her dad were able to drop a day at work to help with childcare. We all helped out until she finished uni and her student placements, we looked after our granddaughter from her being a few weeks old. Our daughter didn't want to have to defer (is that the right term?) so went back to uni weeks after giving birth and we all pitched in.

Our granddaughter is almost four now and I've looked after her one day a week (I work the other four) every week, we do more when we can and often have her for sleepovers. My husband does the same, he has her on a different day. She goes to nursery twice a week, our daughter works a four day week too, although she does long days.
Our granddaughter is going to school in September and we're all having a rethink to make sure we can cover drops offs and pick ups.

I honestly wouldn't change a thing, it's been an absolute joy to be part of her life and to spend quality time with her. I also enjoy going to work and having a life outside of being a grandparent so I think I've got the best of both worlds.

I do wonder about young women who don't have help and support, our daughter would likely not have finished uni if she hadn't had hands on help, as well as financial support. She may have ended up on benefits, instead she has a job she enjoys and a life outside of being a mum.

WildCoasts · 08/05/2022 08:29

TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams · 08/05/2022 08:23

I struggle with the other extreme albeit with after school care for older children but too young to have a door key and a weekly early morning so 7-9am.

MIL is adamant she wants to do it, has a fit at any suggestion of an au pair or other carer but is clearly resentful of the tie on her time particularly if arrangements change. She is massively passive aggressive about it and it's doing my head in.

My parents were always very clear there was no way they were getting involved like this.

MIL has no business having a fit about whatever arrangements you want to make. You are the parents, it's your choice.

Robinni · 08/05/2022 08:51

WildCoasts · 08/05/2022 00:22

But you might not have quite a few years. I'm not even 50 and two of my friends have died from illnesses and I've seen that disabiliity, that stops people doing all the things they have put off, can stop those delayed plans. I've seen other people I know more casually retire only to have their partner die within a year. Cancer in each case. Time is not a given for any of us. We don't know how much time we have and shouldn't take it for granted. You can't count on being able bodied or even alive for as long as you think. This is something life has taught me that wouldn't have crossed my mind when my family was young. I am very aware of the need to do things now or maybe never do them at all.

I think the comment that GPs that don't watch their children are doing things like getting their nails done says it all. I'm out in the forest looking after my physical and mental health, so hopefully I'll stay healthier longer. I'm caring for teenagers. I'm making sure my dogs are walked, because they need that and I'm responsible for their needs. I chose to have them, so they are my responsibility. I'm going to the occasional social event which I couldn't do when I was raising mine.

Not do those things so that someone can advance their career? No thanks. They chose their career and to have children. I delayed my career to care for my children, I chose to SAH because that's what I valued and I had the choice. If I couldn't have afforded that I'd have delayed children till such a time as I could. We're all responsible for our own choices. If you want kids and career, pay for childcare. Did your parents get any say into whether you conceived a baby? I doubt it. If it was going too affect their life so much, they should get a say into whether it happens.

I'm not saying I wouldn't do childcare but I don't feel it is an obligation. In the end, I value family most and that is where my priorities lie. But I matter too.

I think it is shocking that someone thinks they can decide to have children and expect me to adjust my life to meet their needs. If someone has those kind of expectations and can't do it without me, they need to talk to me before those children are conceived instead of making decisions for my life on my behalf. The expectation that your parents should alter their life to serve your family choices and material needs is very entitled.

Show quote history

Dear God…

@WildCoasts

I am disabled. My DS is disabled. Some of my friends have been diagnosed with cancer in their teens. Some have died in their 20s and 30s. It crossed my mind at a very early age that I should not put things off and delay plans. That I should try and enjoy my life. Older people do not have a monopoly on death and disablement such that they can use it to be totally selfish.

My friends with disabilities/impending death did not run around with a “it’s all about me” agenda, nor have I - I have still cared for several people and developed relationships because I love my family and it gives me fulfilment to contribute to others. That is ok.

All of this focus on plans is coming from people who have spent their whole life being entitled and now have ample pensions to facilitate said plans - some of your contemporaries are still working into their 70s and 80s.

I'm making sure my dogs are walked, because they need that and I'm responsible for their needs. I chose to have them, so they are my responsibility.

How you feel about your dogs is how I feel about my DC and potential grandchildren.

I want my DC and GC to be successful and happy and anything I can do, while not compromising my own health and well being, I will do. If I found myself unable to physically help I might consider contributing towards childcare costs, many GP do this too and that is ok too.

My parents were very involved with my choice to have children and very supportive as they had seen me go through several operations, have to accept disability and have several miscarriages. Most daughters will discuss their hopes for a family with one or both parents. I know people who have promised the world and done nothing, and others who have promised nothing but then moved into the house to help in the first 6wks as daughter had a caesarean.

I don’t think anyone truly knows what is possible until the children are born, no matter how much planning they do. I don’t think anyone should be entitled to childcare or expect anything. However, for a GP to purposefully avoid helping out at all, ever -when they are fit and able - seems the exception and not the rule.

Good luck to you and the dogs.

Robinni · 08/05/2022 09:21

saltinesandcoffeecups · 08/05/2022 02:41

I really have no horse in this race, but would have found the discussion to be interesting if everyone weighing in started with their age and the time period their parents and grandparents did or did not help. I think that has a lot do with where the person is coming from.

for instance, those who spent loads of time with their GP or whose parents provided a lot of childcare, what was their situation? Did the GM work outside the home? Did/does the current set of GPs work outside the home? there is a lot that can change in a generation. It may have been a very natural pivot from being a SAHM/housewife to a care providing GP. But the transition from being a working mum to retired to full time/part time childcarer is totally different IMHO.

I’m in my mid 40s, my mother worked full time from the time I was 3, her mother (my GM) worked full time until I was about 8-10. So yeah, I get where both were very clear about not being able raise any more children. I think my mother finally fully retired at about 70 after years of being semi-retired but working full time hours) No way would she be willing to take on essentially a part time (or full time job).

the GPs of today have had children, careers, cared for or are still caring for their own parents, that’s a lot!

Hey, if it works out than it’s a great thing for kids to be raised by extended family, but I also think people need to extend some grace for when it doesn’t.

@saltinesandcoffeecups

re. My GP/Aunts/Uncles all professionals, all retired mid 50s in the 80s and cared for me from I was about 4 - 11. Care was distributed amongst them (they all met up and worked it out - then told my parents who had been struggling to get a stable childcare situation for me). They each did about 3-4hrs at a time 1-2 times a wk after school. I was very loved.

re. My situation, I was carer for my DM when first DC born, a few hrs provided by DF but that was it. Early - mid 60s. They contributed to childcare costs when I went back to work, about a quarter of it as I had no other support, including DH - long hours. And I was still caring for DM - couldn’t have done it without the childcare. Since she died I’ve had help as needs - at one stage 2 full days a wk from one family member and another 1-2 full days from another due to high work demands and increased caring for multiple family… ie. DF would take baby while I dealt with personal needs of female family members and fights with social workers… (said female family members the ones who looked after me as a child!!) I have been very grateful for all help I have had but it was essential for us all to be able to cope with the situation.

Now I only need help with school pick ups a few days a week and DC is brought straight to me. We’ve discussed that if we have any further kids the early years care from GP won’t be possible with being older, but I only have to care for DC now so I doubt I would need the same level of help anyway, intend to work part time.

All in all we work together as a family to care for the very young and very old amongst us. There isn’t really a distinction made regarding age…

Treesandsheepeverywhere · 08/05/2022 09:22

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Charming.

Treesandsheepeverywhere · 08/05/2022 09:27

Robinni · 08/05/2022 08:51

Dear God…

@WildCoasts

I am disabled. My DS is disabled. Some of my friends have been diagnosed with cancer in their teens. Some have died in their 20s and 30s. It crossed my mind at a very early age that I should not put things off and delay plans. That I should try and enjoy my life. Older people do not have a monopoly on death and disablement such that they can use it to be totally selfish.

My friends with disabilities/impending death did not run around with a “it’s all about me” agenda, nor have I - I have still cared for several people and developed relationships because I love my family and it gives me fulfilment to contribute to others. That is ok.

All of this focus on plans is coming from people who have spent their whole life being entitled and now have ample pensions to facilitate said plans - some of your contemporaries are still working into their 70s and 80s.

I'm making sure my dogs are walked, because they need that and I'm responsible for their needs. I chose to have them, so they are my responsibility.

How you feel about your dogs is how I feel about my DC and potential grandchildren.

I want my DC and GC to be successful and happy and anything I can do, while not compromising my own health and well being, I will do. If I found myself unable to physically help I might consider contributing towards childcare costs, many GP do this too and that is ok too.

My parents were very involved with my choice to have children and very supportive as they had seen me go through several operations, have to accept disability and have several miscarriages. Most daughters will discuss their hopes for a family with one or both parents. I know people who have promised the world and done nothing, and others who have promised nothing but then moved into the house to help in the first 6wks as daughter had a caesarean.

I don’t think anyone truly knows what is possible until the children are born, no matter how much planning they do. I don’t think anyone should be entitled to childcare or expect anything. However, for a GP to purposefully avoid helping out at all, ever -when they are fit and able - seems the exception and not the rule.

Good luck to you and the dogs.

Show quote history

@WildCoasts has also stated that she does help out.
It's about choice and what works for you in regards to helping.
Love to the dogs 🐶.

Robinni · 08/05/2022 09:29

SonicWomb · 08/05/2022 05:05

@bozna I know it’s common, I’ve done it and it was awful. A million times harder in my case than looking after children.

Agreed; with kids they are physically much more manageable. And it gets easier through time as they grow and develop skills. It’s much harder watching the reverse happen and seeing how hard this is on the people you love. You just try to maintain their dignity as much as possible and give them the best quality of life you can.

WildCoasts · 08/05/2022 09:32

@Treesandsheepeverywhere Yes, I do help out and will always be there for my children (but only in the way I can without stretching myself too thin). I also care for three adult disabled children (gene wasn't found till they were all born and half my kids had it) and will be for many years to come. I recognise how important it is to make some space for my own needs to keep this sustainable. No-one is helping me out.

BTW, the dogs are emotional support dogs. When I decided to go ahead with the request for those, I knew they were ultimately my responsibility. Before that, I didn't want dogs but wouldn't be without them now.

Borisblondboufant · 08/05/2022 09:32

I have a neighbour who was expected to arrange her life around her son having children. She definitely wanted to be involved but it’s all on his terms. She wanted very much to be a weekend granny, with the kids coming for weekends all the time.
That doesn’t happen. Instead she travels an hour to them only when she is required. She will get calls in the middle of the night to run down there and take over with a sick child. She makes no plans as she needs to be ‘available’. She was super active before he had kids and had lots of friends and a p/t job. All gone. His explanation has always been that her mum helped out so she needs to do the same, but she did school runs and lived on the same road.
Thing is, she is nearly 80 and I expect him to do nothing when she needs more support. She probably already does to be honest.

Robinni · 08/05/2022 09:38

WildCoasts · 08/05/2022 08:27

One day a week is one thing, a lot of posts are talking about more, sometimes much more. I would love to look after a GC one day a week. I can take the to the zoo, to the park, lots of things. I'd love it. That would be my choice and not an obligation though. I'd also expect that if I want to go for a three month cruise (not my thing, just hypothetical) that I would be able to do that and the child's parents would make other arrangements for that time. I could resume when I get back, if the parents want that.

Show quote history

@WildCoasts what you describe is perfectly reasonable and what I would perceive to be normal too. 5 days per wk 9-5pm is totally unfair and ludicrous… as is what happened to @BestDove with father unable to cover a few hours…. Sorry this happened to you…. Unfortunately when you lose one parent the other one is lost to a certain extent too and not the same. Hugs to you it isn’t easy.

LuckySantangelo35 · 08/05/2022 09:43

@Robinni

how can your parents have been “very involved” in your decision/choice to have children?!

BestDove · 08/05/2022 09:46

Momicrone · 08/05/2022 08:10

Plenty of people hire total strangers, what's wrong with that?

Of course people hire total strangers.... usually after interviewing them, doing reference checks and arranging settling in days before leaving a baby.

In this case I didn't have a choice to do any of that as it was last minute. I took a chance on the stranger being a trusted person.

So my dad did nothing of note that day. Whilst I paid the babysitter £15 an hour x 4 hours from start to finish, a £20 plus VAT agency "finder fee", then her return train ticket as I wasn't comfortable leaving her for a prolonged period with my baby in my house £22, then taxis in London because I couldn't use a pram on the tube £30 return to and from the station, about £5 for a coffee whilst she waited for me. Total expense £141 (in addition to my own train fare and local train station parking, as I would have had to cover those if I'd gone on my own).

It was a well paid job and thankfully I only had to go into the office twice for 4 hours of interviews before they offered me the role.

At the time I didn't have a job and that's a huge amount of money for something that could have resulted in no job offer. It was a risk that thankfully paid off. I hate my dad because of it though. Obviously this goes deeper than just this example, but it's really the pinnacle of a useless grandparent when their child was desperate for help.

Robinni · 08/05/2022 09:49

Also @WildCoasts your position with 3 disabled adult children is unusual and caring for grandchildren on a regular basis may be untenable, unrealistic and completely unfair on you….

It’s a different situation to say somebody who has no health problems, no other caring responsibilities, no job….

The people who took care of me took themselves off on two month trips from time to time, they did all of the things they wanted to do - I went with them sometimes! A few hours a wk good for all, all chipping in when things are tough good for all, being a slave to others needs is another matter…

Robinni · 08/05/2022 09:52

LuckySantangelo35 · 08/05/2022 09:43

@Robinni

how can your parents have been “very involved” in your decision/choice to have children?!

I have severe endometriosis. The alternative was having part of my bowel removed, a colostomy and potentially losing bladder too. It was very stressful.

Robinni · 08/05/2022 09:58

@LuckySantangelo35 they, along with DH supported me through several operations. I was headed for another major one and only way round it was to have baby several yrs earlier than wanted… involved a lot of logistics/planning and I was abroad at time as well…. Lot of discussions with DP about it all. Post preg/bf no surgery needed. It returned few yrs later.

LuckySantangelo35 · 08/05/2022 10:28

Robinni · 08/05/2022 09:58

@LuckySantangelo35 they, along with DH supported me through several operations. I was headed for another major one and only way round it was to have baby several yrs earlier than wanted… involved a lot of logistics/planning and I was abroad at time as well…. Lot of discussions with DP about it all. Post preg/bf no surgery needed. It returned few yrs later.

@Robinni
similar to @WildCoasts then I would think your situation is pretty unusual too.

You had little choice but to have kids earlier. Lots of other people however make that choice because it’s suits them and they expect grandparents to fall in line with that and help out with childcare so that they can continue work.

It shouldn’t be an expectation is what I am saying.

Their parents may still work. Or maybe travel a lot. I know a couple who twice a year will go abroad for about 6-8 weeks at a time. The way they see it is - they’ve raised three children to adulthood, they’ve had very stressful careers and they’ve earned these times where they can be responsibility free and kick back in the sun. When they are home they will look after the kids for a like a Saturday night kind of thing to give their parents a night out that kind of thing and have good relationships with grandkids. I just think it would be a really selfish, entitled son/daughter who would begrudge their parents those weeks away abroad that they love in order to be on beck and call for prescribed weekday childcare

Robinni · 08/05/2022 10:41

@LuckySantangelo35

As I said previously to you - we have very different opinions on this matter.

As I also previously said - there should not be an expectation but respectful discussions prior to birth, following birth and at regular intervals as to what is reasonable at a given time in terms of contribution.

Please do not use the fact that I have had illness to prove a point - I have had MUCH less childcare provision from GP than any of my friends - 2 are dead, 1 infirm - and in fact the only reason I got quite a lot for about a one year period was to facilitate my caring for other family members because they did not want my DF to do it.

What I’m saying is my family care for one another regardless of age and they don’t see it as a chore to help out. But equally everyone is respectful of each other’s needs. So perhaps that is the difference.

As I also said - the people who cared for me went off for 2 months at a time. My own DF takes himself off twice a month and has gone off for 2 months at a time. It is stressful when he’s away but we get on with it and use our leave to facilitate this as we believe he deserves it being the only GP.

This then leaves us with limited leave to be able to have a family time together bar a few wks in summer. But that is the situation. It’s give and take.

sowiwag · 08/05/2022 10:56

I am a grandfather who has been involved in regular child care for grandchildren throughout their lives. (They are currently top end junior school, so drop-offs/pick-ups and (some) weekends/holidays are what it amounts to now.)

From pre-talking all the way through toddlerhood (with, then without, nappy-changing, naps, etc., etc.) to nursery, infant school, and on. Dressing, cooking, feeding, changing, bathing, playing, reading, talking, listening, hugging, drying tears, managing tantrums, sharing lives ... but only part-time and hence with plenty of time and space to re-energise and live a separate life as well.

It has been - continues to be - an absolute joy. A treat. Children are so interesting when you have time to spend with them. Add in love given and received; there is nothing more excellent for an old man's life. So I have found.

I know some people do not wish to look after grandchildren; find it a chore, whatever. Such people - I know many, have discussed at length several times - are just different. I feel sorry for them for what they miss, but, well, people want different things. So be it.

One time not too long ago, I was sat in the nearby town centre, nothing to do, just watching people. Weekday, nothing special. Generally, people looked glum, distracted, other things on their mind; mostly not unhappy-looking, but not happy-looking either; generally we might say just not fully alive in their present moment. Different ages, types of people, all much-of-a-muchness. With one exception: single old people with a toddler in tow. Not the mums or dads: the grandparents. They, ubiquitously, smiling, full of joy, engaged with the world they shared with their charges. If you get a chance, have a look around. You'll see this if you're quiet.

This grandparent/grandchild relationship developing out of childcare is super special. Of course we can see how it is evolutionarily explicable. But that does not make it valueless. Far from it.

Best thing in the world, looking after grandchildren? Maybe not. (Slow afternoon sex in springtime with long-established lover and a modicum of appropriate recreational drugs is my personal number one; then there is having a book you wrote sell well enough to make a little money ... I know others enjoy other things too; chacun à son goût as ever.) Looking after grandchildren is in the top five, though, at least, in my opinion.

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