DS Bullied By Child with SEN

[ellie21]

My son who is at a mainstream Primary School is being bullied by another child who is undergoing assessment for ADD.
Initially this was low level bullying ( name calling etc) but has developed into threats of violence. In the last two weeks he has been physically assaulted three times by this child. The school have confirmed that this is one sided and is happening to other students too.
I have been into school a number of times to talk to staff and whereas they are sympathetic they say they have a duty of care to the child with SEN as he is struggling to cope at school.
AIBU to think that this is separate issue? I am absolutely furious my child is being hurt.

My Sen child used to get violent at school although it was lashing out rather than targeted bullying of anyone. I was quite lucky in that most of the children and parents in the class were quite understanding but we did have issues with some children in other classes deliberating winding him up as they knew he’d lash out and always get the blame as was less articulate and wasn’t able to explain what had happened they like could. Again we were fairly lucky as some of the children in his own class reported back what was happening. Whilst a found the individual teachers good and sorted out to an extent the slt weren’t interested and just wanted to put the blame on my son. We had a lot of exclusions even though he had an ehcp with 32.5 hours which the school didn’t put consistently in place. To cut a very long story short i eventually got him into a specialist school which is the best thing we ever did but it was incredibly difficult and until you’ve been through the Sen system I don’t think you can appreciate how difficult it is to navigate and it’s not just a case of asking for specialist and getting, you will prob have to go to tribunal and represent yourself unless you have thousands of pounds spare to pay for legal representation. Preparing a case takes hundreds of hours and some parents just don’t have that time to spare due to other commitments or just don’t have the capability. That said I’m not sure why the school aren’t excluding as that is good evidence for the child/ parents that the school aren’t meeting need.

This is harrowing reading, not only for your child OP who absolutely deserves to go to school without fear of being hurt, but also because I am the Mother of such a child.

My ds2 is 7, has had violent outbursts in private nursery and now school (although not in the outdoor school he attended for half a day before starting school, so environment obviously has an impact). OP I am in turmoil over my sons behaviour and i cant imagine what its like to be a child in his classroom or a parent of those children, I'm waiting for the day i am stopped by parents and shouted at. I WFH when as much as I can so I can have him over lunch, I instigate school meetings, I pushed for an ed psych, I make GP appointments, I have a quiet, stable home. Ds2 has tourettes and is on the waiting list for CAHMs which is over 2 years long here. He has punched teachers and children, he swears, throws resources...but when he's with me he's calm, articulate, he cries at nature documentaries, hes a great reader...its like jekyll and Hyde.

There is not enough support for children struggling OR those struggling to cope with those children. It's not as easy as just removing a child from school, and I suppose hope isn't a strategy but i do hope things change for your child.

Two of my kids have been hurt in the past by sen children lashing out at them or using force to get what they want. I regret not doing more. The teachers said the sen kids didn't understand and needed support but ignored the violence towards others. One of them was just an aggressive bully as were his parents and I doubt any actual sen. He eventually got excluded but only after seriously injuring another child.
All children have a right to feel safe at school.

"I'd suggest removing the SEN child if the school is failing to keep your child safe"

It is pointless suggesting that. Children don't get removed on other parents say so. In this situation you concentrate on continually pressing the school about keeping your own child safe, following the correct process for this.
The school shouldn't have given any details about the other child and in doing so they have shown themselves to be a poor school.
Those saying the child should be removed for parents to home educate - no parent can be forced to home educate. That is known as off rolling and is unlawful.

I think this thread is a prime example of why ALL parents should get themselves over to the pinned thread where you can questions for the mp on the Send green paper. Parents think send changes don’t effect them but they do. The paper proposes to require early intervention which sounds great in theory but we all know this will be an excuse for the la not to provide extra funds until the school has done the early intervention which won’t happen as the school can’t provide it as they don’t have the funds. It’s proposing to try and cut down send tribunals which most parents have to go through to get suitable provision by introducing mandatory mediation which will drag things out even longer. It’s also proposing to take away parent choice of school by reading the parents to choose from a list provided by the la. These changes are going to make the situation for all children worse.

SEN has slways existed but the violence hasn't. Its remarkable how violence is tolerated or explained away due to SEN. However, it does depend on the school. The child needs excluding. OP, if they mention the other child, keep coming back at them with your child. KCSIE is the document you need to look up - peer on peer abuse. Keep the focus on your child not being kept safe.

OP going in and having a chat isn't serious enough. You really need to email so that there is a paper trail. And get tough, quick, politely.

ihmlsnwidhks if he's has a one to one and is still prone to violence against other kids then he shouldn't be in that school and need to be in the appropriate environment. My ds is undergoing assessment for adhd albeit hes non violent but can have outbursts so I understand it's hard. But other children should be entitled to come to school and work and learn in a safe space.

@caringcarer that school sounds awful

I would be furious. The child with SEN needs does not trump your boys needs. Honestly keep him of school until they can make a to keep your child safe.

The abelist bingo on this thread is rife as usual.

SEN is over diagnosed (no idea how difficult the assessment/diagnosis process is! It takes years for many and involves multiple observations by multiple people, they don't just take one look at a child and give them a diagnosis. Plus you are not qualified to decide whether a child has SEN or not)
These children are violent through choice
These children shouldn't be in school, send them home for the parents to educate
The violence didn't exist back in my day

Seriously? Have a word with yourselves. This is the fault of government cuts and a misguided attempt to plonk all children with SEN in a mainstream school, whether it is suitable or not. These children are overwhelmed by an unsuitable environment and cannot cope.

Of course the OP needs to talk to the school and find out the plan to keep her child safe, absolutely unacceptable that a child is in harms way. The school need to look af putting additional supports in for the child. However, some of the attitude on here are quite frankly archaic.

Yes.

That's the way to do it.

"SEN has slways existed but the violence hasn't. Its remarkable how violence is tolerated or explained away due to SEN."

You are wrong. People with my son's needs have always existed but were put in institutions at an early age. He has a 100k a year package at a specialist school. My experience is that people do not want that sort of money spent on people with disabilities but then moan about the consequences when it isn't provided.

Bullying is about the victims perception, not the bully's.

@Shakeitshakeitbaby "ableist bingo"???! What even IS that??

That is true there was a thread the other day moaning that sen kids get more resources. People can’t have it both ways.

If you can't stop your child being violent then the child needs removed from school

It's not fair on other kids to be physically assaulted.

If that's means home education so be it. Your child's needs aren't more important than other kids

Kids should feel and be safe at school.

Yes but the solutions will be different.

And if the only choices of schools to move to were schools where my child would be terrified of the other pupils (and hence more aggressive), and likely to be assaulted by them?
I have looked at such a school for my DS yesterday. We are told he needs an SEMH school but they are all like this.

The police won't "keep a record" for a child under 10, unlikely for any primary school child.

Have you looked at all schools in your local area including specialist independents? It is very variable by area unfortunately. Does he have asd as I’ve found the asd schools seem better suited than semh. But I definately accepted your point I know of a violent autistic 5 year old girl who got put in a unit with teenagers and got beat up on first day by much older children then had to be locked in a room on her own every day for safety . Obviously those children also had sen but it was not the the right placement

Her child perceived that they got thumped?
Hmmm
How does that work?

Of course some children with SEN can also be bullies, but mainstream schools don't have the resources or the staff the training to offer the appropriate support and have the tools to be able to distinguish this. So they don't address it and just hope other parents are understanding when their children start to hate going to school as they are verbally or physically attacked by another child. Its not fair on anyone, but as has been said it is firmly the fault of those in charge of education budgets.

Something very similar happened to my daughter - she was low level bullied for 2 years which escalated to her being physically assaulted in school time witnessed by teachers/students who did absolutely zero to protect my child…I did make a call to the police as well the child in question was older than. I made a complaint to just about everyone, i once said to the head (who was completely useless and told me they had no safeguarding issues) ok that’s fine so if I just hypothetically just let me just get my husband to hold you down while I punch you (this happened twice to my child) and see what you do?? Everything at this school was brushed under the carpet and minimised - oh it’s just a bruise she could have walked into a table - yes that foot print on her thigh looks like she caught her leg on a table…they also did a lot of victim blaming

in the end I removed her from school and placed her in another sadly the damage had already been done and my child has no self confidence, anxiety and other issues, and now struggles with friendship,

my advice would be email after email make sure it’s all documented, quick chat the the playground follow up with an email…also it’s worth speaking to the safeguarding team at the local council and see if they can help also ask to see the bullying policy and ask them what they are doing to keep your child safe whilst in their care!

whilst I do feel for parents of SEN children other children have the right to feel safe in school.

OP you have loads of good advice. School has a duty of care to your child; peer on peer abuse is now being recognised as a serious issue and I would say you need to speak to the DSL in school as well. One last effort and then it is governors, the Local Authority and then Ofsted and maybe even your local MP.

You need to get into the school and have face to face meetings.

The SEN child is not your issue or your responsibility and the only concern you have is the safety of your own. Do not allow the school to try to make you feel guilty or responsible for what happens to the child - school can and must be much better for all involved.

This is such a thoughtful and well balanced reply. I hope that in the near future your son can feel as relaxed and calm in his educational setting as he does at home.