To wish we never had DC6?

[FartVandelay]

We have two DC, 8 and 6.

DC8 has ADHD and while impulsive and a charterbox at times is very sweet and has a heart of gold. I worry about them being taken advantage of at school.

DC6 is a different story. Sneaky, crafty, bullies their sibling, talks back at us, lies and cheats. Yet is a completely different person at school. Their teachers are baffled when we ask how their behaviour is at school compared to home. I have constant battles with food with DC6. Evening meals take hours. They refuse to eat 90% of what I put in front of them regardless of whether they've eaten it before and professed it the best ever. They constantly defy me, hide sweets in their room. I love DC6 so so much but am at the end of my tether. I came close to telling DC6 I wish we'd never had them tonight. Feel like the worst parent. I see all these other families so happy. I was happy when DC6 was born, so happy. I thought our family was complete but if I could turn thr clock back I'm not sure what I'd do. They just make life so hard. I'm exhausted fighting these constant battles with DC6. DH is away with work until Tuesday. I just don't know if I can do two more nights of handling the DC alone. We have no family local and my friends all have their own families to deal with. Is it really this hard?

Five other siblings? I thought OP meant DC8 and DC6 as in one DC is 8 years old and the other DC is 6 years old?

It’s the exhaustion and the desperation that sticks out.

If you have experience with having a special needs child you know how absolutely shattering this is.

And how it gets to a crisis point whenever your DH leaves for a few days.

Also the food issues and the fact that the older child is already diagnosed.

I know a tonne of families who have special needs kids. When it comes to ADHD/ASD etc… I know only one family where they have a lone SEN kid, all the rest with 2+ kids, all of them have something.

Yes first line of the OP states that.

😂😂

did you only read the headline?

Well that’s bs because I am a lone parent with a ND child as well as an advocate for parents of ND children and nothing in the OP’s descriptions of her second child suggest anything more than a parent with a negative attitude to her youngest.

I'm struggling to understand how posters are equating autism with sneakiness and craftiness. The opposite is true. Kids with ASD come out and say what they think, and they are not very skilled at getting their own way by manipulating others. Hasn't anyone heard of the Sally and Ann test? Simon Baron-Cohen, anyone ? Children with ASD don't imagine and interpret how others will perceive a situation, so they can't play on that knowledge.

It must be pretty bad to feel like questioning whether having a child has been a good move, so I'd feel OP has some concerns. I'm sure she knows that she doesn't really mean it, and this certainly isn't anything I would say, but I sympathize with OP and feel, perhaps, she feels that she is being controlled and manipulated by her child.

She isn't giving illustrative examples, as what she has commented on seems tame and not a problem, but she probably sees more of an issue in the method and planning of how to be sneaky. I think some expert advice will help, and she is right to acknowledge her concerns because peers and friends may begin to recognize scheming and sly behaviour, when they are older and more mature in terms of comparing how they would behave and how their friend does. The younger child's methods may become more of problem at school, towards the end of KS2.

@runnerblade95 naughty step 1 minute per year of life, anything over this is excessive and not good for them.

About the eating, similar here dinner we could be sitting an hour and a half encouraging him to eat and half the time having to spoon feed at the end to ensure he eats enough… he is 6 though so a slightly different situation to yours with a toddler.

@marktayloruk are you purposely being controversial for effect?

We get a lot of homework home!! No choice but to do it or they fall behind.

Okay, thank you for these pointers.

As for the eating, it’s a nightmare. I have a lot more patience than DH, I just let her do her thing because it’s food at the end of the day and I don’t believe in forcing a child, forcing anyone, to eat their food. I would even go as far as to say that doing so could encourage an unhealthy relationship with food and consuming food, which could lead to issues around food later in life such as eating disorders, and I’ll be damned if I cause my child to develop an eating disorder. I’ve tried to explain this to DH but he literally has zero patience.

I allow her to sit there for as long as she likes but it doesn’t mean I enjoy it and much like yourself, I have to end up spoon feeding it to her in the end.

What annoys me the most though is that if it was a chicken leg or some cookies or ice cream sat in front of her, I could leave the room for 5 minutes, by the time I return the plate would be empty. What is that all about?!

I don’t disagree with this the general trend of possibly ND/child knows they’re disliked, but I would also have a lot of sympathy if the OP has just listed a few examples and sorts of problems are minor, but very, very frequent. My DD isn’t particularly ‘bad’ in that nothing she does is extreme, but EVERYTHING she does is that little bit beyond what’s typical, ALL day, EVERY day. A drip drip of slightly sub par behaviour that occurs frequently can be incredibly frustrating without any one incident being noteworthy.

I have sympathy, OP. I often struggle to get along with DD. It’s hard to think of positive descriptions for her, actually, although I try very hard and am all over any teeny chance to praise her. . She’s incredibly difficult to be with compared to other children I mind, and it’s hard not to resent that, when it’s making your parenting such uphill work. I love her to bits, but I do wish she could not battle me over every single tiny bloody thing. I genuinely don’t think she can help it, and I try hard not to take it personally. She’s under investigation for ADHD, but her paediatrician seems a bit old-fashioned and quite quick to jump to conclusions on minor evidence. She ‘can’t’ be autistic because she occasionally played imaginary play (although I was very clear that it’s obviously mimicking something on tv). And, ironically, there’s no problems at school, so therefore no issues. I fear we may be looking at very little support, unless she has an awful behaviour breakdown at school, and how can I hope for that?

definitely recommend Laura Markham’s books. Also Ross Green.

The OPs example of sneakiness and craftiness were kicking their sibling for no reason and throwing away pizza crusts whrn they'd been told they hate to eat them.

I have 2 autistic DC and they don't come out and just say what they think, as that's not their presentation. My eldest cannot complete a book review as he finds the concept of potentially criticising someone's work really upsetting. He's 16.

Well obviously other parents of ND kids have perceived the situation differently.

Her attitude about the younger child isn’t great and little compassion. But she does say she loves them it’s just the behaviour that is the issue.

I think the eating disorder thing is taking it a bit far.

Our DS is very distractable, can’t sit still and he loses concentration at the dinner table. Needs constant reminders (like every few minutes) to eat food please, remember to eat, please sit at the table etc.

He is hungry. And if he says he’s had enough that’s it. But he has difficulty with fine motor and can’t handle the knife and fork easily for long periods amongst a tonne of sensory issues. So dinner time is really hard on him.

If we didn’t help him he would be underweight, and he struggles to eat lunch in school so main meal is important.

Cookies are wolfed here too, I think as he can hold him in his hands and chocolate is just easy right, less work!

He’s done very well and am proud of how much he is able to eat now by comparison to 18m ago. It gets better.

Helping someone out requires compassion. That extends to the OP and her feelings. It's pointless and no use to berate OP for how she feels about anything - we feel how we feel. So long as we continue to look after and care for our children, it's okay - in fact common or natural - to feel anger or even dislike at times, even maybe especially for those we love and spend most of our time with. I do think it's a sign that something needs to be addressed, but most likely what is needed is - as OP has said - more support, more help, a break, understanding.

Yes to Ross Green, 'the Explosive Child' was good. And yes to Playful Parenting, too, that's really helpful and can 'playing it out' can be transformative.

@Flatbrokefornow I am with you on the drip drip drip, complete same.

Not getting diagnosed due to imaginative play is silly. Our DS lives more in his imagination than reality (specific interests). Push for assessment for ASD too they often come together.

@Robinni I could have written most of your previous post myself! Except it’s not every few minutes here, it’s every 30 seconds or so. That is not even an exaggeration. It’s bloody exhausting!

As for the eating disorder thing, I actually read that on a parenting website some years ago. I think the whole negative association with food aspect is more in terms of verbally chastising the child for not eating, as opposed to spoon feeding so that they get enough food and don’t become underweight.

I think what I mean is that I don’t want her to feel like eating is a chore or something that requires an unnecessary amount of effort. Because at this age, it’s just mummy telling her to do something that is less exciting than, say, playing with her toys for example. Whereas when she is older, she may have memories of mummy getting stressed whenever it comes to eating and that could develop into something worse. But hopefully you’re right and that’s just me overthinking and over-analysing.

I can’t see any issues with using cutlery at this stage and she actually seems to be quite interested in using her knife and fork and seems to enjoy doing so. Again, only with foods that she enjoys though!

I’m sure I’m not alone and I’m going to do my best to be less analytic and more laid back. I’m sure she will find her way eventually.

She also cannot sit still at the dinner table for love nor money. She’s like a Duracell battery 😂

@Robinni I could have written most of your previous post myself! Except it’s not every few minutes here, it’s every 30 seconds or so. That is not even an exaggeration. It’s bloody exhausting!

As for the eating disorder thing, I actually read that on a parenting website some years ago. I think the whole negative association with food aspect is more in terms of verbally chastising the child for not eating, as opposed to spoon feeding so that they get enough food and don’t become underweight.

I think what I mean is that I don’t want her to feel like eating is a chore or something that requires an unnecessary amount of effort. Because at this age, it’s just mummy telling her to do something that is less exciting than, say, playing with her toys for example. Whereas when she is older, she may have memories of mummy getting stressed whenever it comes to eating and that could develop into something worse. But hopefully you’re right and that’s just me overthinking and over-analysing.

I can’t see any issues with using cutlery at this stage and she actually seems to be quite interested in using her knife and fork and seems to enjoy doing so. Again, only with foods that she enjoys though!

I’m sure I’m not alone and I’m going to do my best to be less analytic and more laid back. I’m sure she will find her way eventually.

She also cannot sit still at the dinner table for love nor money. She’s like a Duracell battery 😂

@Robinni I could have written most of your previous post myself! Except it’s not every few minutes here, it’s every 30 seconds or so. That is not even an exaggeration. It’s bloody exhausting!

As for the eating disorder thing, I actually read that on a parenting website some years ago. I think the whole negative association with food aspect is more in terms of verbally chastising the child for not eating, as opposed to spoon feeding so that they get enough food and don’t become underweight.

I think what I mean is that I don’t want her to feel like eating is a chore or something that requires an unnecessary amount of effort. Because at this age, it’s just mummy telling her to do something that is less exciting than, say, playing with her toys for example. Whereas when she is older, she may have memories of mummy getting stressed whenever it comes to eating and that could develop into something worse. But hopefully you’re right and that’s just me overthinking and over-analysing.

I can’t see any issues with using cutlery at this stage and she actually seems to be quite interested in using her knife and fork and seems to enjoy doing so. Again, only with foods that she enjoys though!

I’m sure I’m not alone and I’m going to do my best to be less analytic and more laid back. I’m sure she will find her way eventually.

She also cannot sit still at the dinner table for love nor money. She’s like a Duracell battery 😂

@Robinni I could have written most of your previous post myself! Except it’s not every few minutes here, it’s every 30 seconds or so. That is not even an exaggeration. It’s bloody exhausting!

As for the eating disorder thing, I actually read that on a parenting website some years ago. I think the whole negative association with food aspect is more in terms of verbally chastising the child for not eating, as opposed to spoon feeding so that they get enough food and don’t become underweight.

I think what I mean is that I don’t want her to feel like eating is a chore or something that requires an unnecessary amount of effort. Because at this age, it’s just mummy telling her to do something that is less exciting than, say, playing with her toys for example. Whereas when she is older, she may have memories of mummy getting stressed whenever it comes to eating and that could develop into something worse. But hopefully you’re right and that’s just me overthinking and over-analysing.

I can’t see any issues with using cutlery at this stage and she actually seems to be quite interested in using her knife and fork and seems to enjoy doing so. Again, only with foods that she enjoys though!

I’m sure I’m not alone and I’m going to do my best to be less analytic and more laid back. I’m sure she will find her way eventually.

She also cannot sit still at the dinner table for love nor money. She’s like a Duracell battery 😂

Oh for crying out loud. Sorry everyone! Bloody phone!

@runnerblade95 lols don’t worry about it.

We had to use a tablet when our son was 3 1/2 to get him to sit at table and eat longer than about a minute. Weaned off in about a month. This was also the point he dropped to eating only 2 foods so we tried really hard to keep him there until he’d had a good go at it.

We put the increased difficulties down to lockdown rather than his ASD/ADHD. Possibly a combination of both really.

He’s much better now, we give him breaks to move about and then return. If it takes an hour or so then that’s what it takes. He has struggled more with knife and fork since school - he is obviously writing and doing more with his hands now in the day and he’s really tired when he gets home after all the demands. So being as understanding as we can and grateful for the nights it’s easier.

@Robinni DH says to turn off the tv while she eats which I do once she starts messing about. But she is smart. Too smart for her own good. She will sit there and eat like an absolute angel for 5 minutes straight, dramatically turning around after every bite and showing me that she’s eating as a means of encouraging me to switch the tv back on. To which, yes, you guessed it, I always end up caving in. Then within 1 minute of the tv being back on, it starts again. I just don’t have the energy to fight with her. But ultimately, I am the parent so it’s my job to have that energy to go around the houses with her because ultimately, her getting her nutrients is more important than my energy levels.

She’s extremely energetic, to the point where she can function on 8 hours of sleep, sometimes less, without a nap during the day.

She’s socially adaptive to the point where she waves at everyone and I mean everyone, whenever we are out, she yells thank you whenever a car stops to let us cross, she has full blown conversations with complete strangers, she’s a very entertaining child to be fair.

I just worry that the over-excited behaviours could be a sign of possible autism? The inability to just … relax and chill out sometimes! She wants me to take her to the movies but I’m genuinely concerned that she won’t be able to sit through an entire movie.

Would you say that these all sound like quite normal behaviours for a 3 year old or should I consider having her evaluated once she’s a little older?

@runnerblade95 the things that stuck out for us were:-

1. Food issues
2. Sensory issues: including food (textures), issues with hair dryers, hoovers, hand dryers, sunlight, couldn’t take a warm bath, tooth brushing nightmare.
3. Inability to participate properly in hobby classes (ran around, totally overwhelmed, couldn’t follow instruction)
4. Meltdowns about clothes, haircuts, trying on shoes
5. Own agenda - his way or the highway
6. Slightly late speech development/toileting issues
7. Nursery teacher raised concerns that he had difficulties

You can read up about it and ask HV to come out and see your daughter see about doing a referral. Or do what we did - referral via gp, adding report from nursery/daycare provider and your own parental report. Once we had referral to nhs done we went private as wait list 3yrs and we felt too long. Private provider sends report through to nhs dept (so long as they are already referred there), so our son is back with nhs now. Felt he needed the diagnosis for the start of school. I needed it to put my mind at rest I’d done what I could.

Aside from the difficulties he is the most wonderful little boy, incredibly social - goes around shopping malls Hi! Hi! Etc and tries to hug everyone, but this is an issue (no stranger danger fear at all). The most entertaining person I’ve met, he’s very eccentric and very bright, what was previously known as aspergers.

Obviously, can’t diagnose your daughter but if you have concerns having an assessment may put your mind at rest. Very straightforward, not at all what I thought. If there are issues, the earlier support is in place the better for long term outcome.

@runnerblade95 I’ve only ever parented a neurodiverse child so I think it would be important for you to get perspectives from friends etc of neurotypical too. And consult with GP, HV, daycare/nursery as they will know your DD.

It could of course be your DD is very energetic and going through a fussy food stage as many 3yr olds do. But you’ve been drawn to post on this thread as a lot of Mums of ASD/ADHD have been so must see some commonality.

Whatever happens it’s not the end of the world. I wouldn’t change my son for anything he’s amazing! And your daughter will be too no matter if NT or ND.

@Robinni Aw he sounds wonderful! You must be so proud 🥹 Definitely sounds like my little one. Especially what you said about stranger danger. She understands perfectly when you sit her down and explain it to her but when it comes to actually putting it into practice when we’re out and about, it totally goes out of her head. This is something I do worry about.

So far, her teachers have nothing but good things to say about her. She’s settled in wonderfully and is very well-behaved at preschool.

A friend told me that she is still too young to be evaluated as of yet but I’m still going to take your advice and at least get the ball rolling from now.

She was also an extremely early talker. I could talk in full sentences and she would reply with 3 and 4 syllable words by the age of 2. My family were and still are astonished with her abilities verbally.

But it’s her high energy levels and inability to concentrate on any one thing for an extended period of time that worries me. Don’t even get me started with teeth brushing. I dread it every morning and every evening.

Thank you so much for your advice. Going to get on it first thing in the morning.