To think most ‘Mum guilt’ is perpetuated by incompetent dads

[TeaAndBrie]

So we’re going on a short European break for the weekend, me and 5 friends. We’ve not all been together for 8 years. We’re going to celebrate joint big birthdays.
The amount of stuff that some of them is doing before they go to make things easier for the dads of their children is just bonkers. Meal planning and prepping, food shopping, cleaning, washing, arranging play dates, organising parents to help etc.
Most of their husbands go away often for work/golfing weekends. You can guarantee they’re not afforded the same preparation or having to deal with children in years as they’re going to miss mummy too much!

I don’t disagree in part; but some of what you describe is also martyrdom. In all likelihood the dads would muddle through a long weekend just fine without the planning and instructions, and the children wouldn’t be irretrievably damaged from no play dates for a few days.

That’s actually a really good point, I hadn’t thought of it like that

It’s martyrdom. My mum used to do this for my dad when she went away for the weekend. It’s completely unnecessary.

@ComtesseDeSpair

I don’t disagree in part; but some of what you describe is also martyrdom. In all likelihood the dads would muddle through a long weekend just fine without the planning and instructions, and the children wouldn’t be irretrievably damaged from no play dates for a few days.

Well, yes, I completely agree with that. EXCEPT.... why is it that the view is that when the children are with Mum they are fed and clothed properly, bed time at appropriate times etc but then when Dad is looking after them, it's okay for them to be feral for a few days, live on McDonalds and wear dirty clothes?

If your OH is the kind of father who would neglect the DC to the point of them being feral, awake at all hours and wearing filthy clothing, then frankly you need to be separating or divorcing and ensuring he only has supervised contact after that, because he’s both a shit father and a shit partner.

More usually, dads will manage to feed, clothe and entertain their DC perfectly adequately without instructions - just perhaps with the slightly laissez faire approach most men seem to take towards their own life when their OH isn’t around with her “guidance”, and the reasoning that a meal that gets eaten rather than a battle of wills and tears over one that will be barely picked at is the way to go.

When I’ve gone away, I’ve left DH the basic routine of after school clubs, assemblies/trips etc that may be happening.
And have let him know what needs to be done in terms of prep. But definitely no cooking or shopping in advance! He’s a grown up. He can do it as well as I can.

I do have friends who leave dinner for their DPs if they’re even just going for a night out!

Ridiculous in my opinion.

Martyrdom is exactly it. If you don't trust the father of your kids to look after them it's a bit fucked.

Yeah I don’t know why women do it, just leave them to it nobody will die.

Societal pressure that women must do it all AND ENJOY IT.

Just seen on another thread that it is 'natural' for a woman to feel closer to her own mother and to stop PILS seeing their grandchildren except on a rare occasion and under sufferance. That it is 'natural' for mothers to act as gatekeepers for their children etc etc. There are lots of mothers on MN who moan about their husbands lack of involvement with their children but insist that interactions have to be run through the mother and that the father has to follow her instructions exactly etc etc.
Roll on the day when some of these competitive martyr mothers let their partners parent their children in the way they think best. There are so many mothers on here who moan about doing everything but are so controlling with the fathers. Time to let go and enjoy the freedom that comes from giving some parenting autonomy to their children's Dads

I don’t do any of this. I go away with work regularly and my DH copes fine. Wouldn’t even occur to me to start meal prepping or arrange their time together. I also manage when he goes away.

I go away regularly and have never had to do anything other than pack my case.

I agree with the comments re martydom. It's not necessary. An adult male can look after his own flipping children! I think women do this to themselves in the majority of cases. Set unrealistic standards, then judge themselves failures. Of course there are pressures from media etc, but it's up to us to grow a backbone and say no!

Oh, and when I used to go away regularly for work, all I did was organise myself. Dh managed, because he's a grown up. Only thing he couldn't do was breastfeed.

Rather than being “natural” I think it’s that when it comes to many aspects of motherhood (indeed, when it comes to many things about being a woman) the harshest critics of women are often other women. Women will judge other women over how they dress their children, what they choose to feed them, how they look after them, what activities they do etc, which piles on the pressure to be Super Mum.

Whereas it’s relatively rare that men give much of a shit what other men do when it comes to parenting - so many dads feel able to feed their DC beans on toast, not worry if an outfit matches, take them to the cinema rather than Sing-Song Time for Budding Geniuses, and just generally be a bit more relaxed about it all with the rationale that everyone having a nicer time is better than a fight with toddlers over vegetables and wellies.

BlingLoving

Yes I do think it's odd that mothers are told to have lower standards or expectations for the level of childcare provided when fathers are parenting.

Only a matter of time before martyrdom comes up. Yet again blaming some women for shouldering most of the parenting.

I’m not in this boat and leave my kids at the drop of a hat with my OH who is as competent a parent as me. But I’ve got a tonne of friends who’s partners simply haven’t pulled their weight in the same way and they’ve been left to do most of the parenting. So going away for the weekend does feel difficult because their husbands need spoon feeding about how to care for the kids. This isn’t been a martyr, this is dealing with a shit male partner.

I would probably do a grocery order, as I would any other weekend, and make sure the kids sports kits are washed but that’s about it. Definitely no meal prepping!

It’s martyrdom

Yep.

Before Covid hit I went away with a group of friends. The majority of us did nothing for our spouses/partners and just left them to it.

A couple tried to organise things for their spouses and were told to keep their noses out as they had it all under control. Their two spouses actually met up while we were away and sorted out things between themselves.

Next week my DP will be looking after our DD and will be meeting up with a male friend who will be looking after his children. I will be working full-time while the friend's wife is on holiday abroad.

I find it infuriating that fathers with grown up jobs are incompetent domestically.
Why do you have to tell your husband what your child’s routine is? Why does he not KNOW????
DH is very much an equal parent. He actually is on the school board (we are in the US). When I go away on work, I just go. Just as he does!

I mean mothers leaving after bedtime is a microcosm of this. I remember so many independent female friends confessing that their other half hadn’t done bedtime for 3 years and oh ‘Jack won’t settle for anyone but me…’ I mean 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️

I've found that Mum guilt is started by the mummy martyrs. You've only got to look on here when a Mum posts about going away without her child. There's always a large number desperate to declare how they haven't and couldn't leave their child until they are about 12. Other women attack Mums for their choices more than any man ever does.

They possibly don't want to come home to a shit show so try to mitigate that by doing loads of prep.
I can understand doing some shopping and prep if you are a sahm whose dh isn't familiar with everyday routines. But even then, a gown man who is a parent and capable of holding down a job is also capable of feeding his own kids for a couple of days and keeping on top of the housework!

@HousePlantNeglect

Only a matter of time before martyrdom comes up. Yet again blaming some women for shouldering most of the parenting.

I’m not in this boat and leave my kids at the drop of a hat with my OH who is as competent a parent as me. But I’ve got a tonne of friends who’s partners simply haven’t pulled their weight in the same way and they’ve been left to do most of the parenting. So going away for the weekend does feel difficult because their husbands need spoon feeding about how to care for the kids. This isn’t been a martyr, this is dealing with a shit male partner.

I think this is just as much of a sweeping generalisation. There certainly are some indisputably terrible male partners. There are also some women who think their partner is incompetent just because they may not do things precisely the way they do it themselves, particularly in the newborn PFB stage and unwittingly create an unhealthy dynamic.

Martyrdom. Competitive parenting. And somehow having a useless husband who needs your magical touch to sort things out can also be quite competitive between some people

I don’t think so, no. It’s what I would call martyrdom, whether people like it or not, and to some extent being a bit of a control freak. I do wonder about situations like this - I mean what do some mums think will happen if dads are left to their own devices? If you’re seriously worried about your child’s well being because you are leaving them with their other parent surely that’s a big problem in itself.

I may lay out some outfits (so DC doesn't wear old/ grown out of non matching clothrs) but not meal plan

He can at least heat up pizza snd fish fingers