To say no to my CF neighbour?

[MyVeryFirstCF]

I'm unsure if I'm being petty here.

Context:

Next-door neighbour has two children, let's call them Jenny (7) and Davy (4). Jenny is delightful. I don't really see Davy.

My children are DD9 and DD6. They don't see Jenny and Davy socially but go to the same school as them.

Their mum is always pleasant to me, but only ever WhatsApps me if she wants something - "Hi MyVeryFirstCF, how are you, can I borrow some eggs?" would be a standard message from her.

On a few occasions when there has been an emergency she has asked me to take Jenny to school. I have always been fine for this. However, when I had Covid, I asked if she could walk my non-Covidy child to school, and she made a bit of a fuss saying she normally drives to school (a 7 minute walk), and that little Davy didn't have any gloves and his hands would get cold. I offered to lend her gloves. She eventually agreed. (It didn't happen in the end as DH managed to WFH that day.)

Last week CF neighbour had a small car accident which has led to her car being off the road.

She texted me yesterday morning asking if I would take Jenny to school. I didn't see her message immediately but replied within 10 minutes saying yes, and saying I'd call for her at 8.30. At 8.30 CF neighbour answered the door wearing basically no clothes saying that Jenny wasn't ready, and she hadn't seen my reply (why wouldn't you check?!) So she had to take her herself.

Then she texted me again this morning asking if I would take Jenny. I did. Jenny is no problem at all - a really lovely girl, but my girls don't know her well and sort of clam up. This is a shame because I really enjoy the school run as a bit of time I get to spend talking to my girls away from the distractions of screens / homework / getting food ready etc.

The reason given for this morning's request was that her younger child was still asleep. Although, when I called, it was clear CF neighbour wasn't dressed again. She has told me in the past that Jenny hates walking. Jenny has told me that she loves to walk, and that it's her mum who hates walking! (It's literally 7 minutes.)

She also has a husband who WFH every day, but I literally never see him with the children, so I don't think she gets any support from him.

Would I be unreasonable to say no to any future (non-emergency) requests, and how do I do this whilst maintaining a decent enough relationship that we can ask each other for actual emergencies?

The issue with saying no to requests, especially for women, is the discomfort either imagined or experienced from not being compliant or a 'nice girl' and the reaction of the person you are turning down. They may be gracious or they could badger, guilt or be toxic towards you. There may also be a worry that they may 'dislike you'.

You can say no and add something like 'I don't see this as an emergency, can you ask a friend or your husband?' And keep repeating calmly if she persists. You may feel uncomfortable at first but it will get easier. If she tries to guilt you that you are her only hope, 'sorry but I don't see this as an emergency' Polite, non aggressive and firm boundary.

OP. I find your attitude a bit sad, to be honest. If she’s your next door neighbour and they all go to the same school, why don’t the girls play together normally? They’re all of a similar enough age?

I have no neighbours within about half a mile so there’s no-one nearby for DS to play with. He has a friend who lives around 2 miles away (nearest friend) who often bikes over to play.

She really has no desire be be a friendly neighbour and have a reciprocal arrangement.

She sees you as someone that is of use and can be used.

The easiest way is simply don't answer your phone and if she turns up at the door ask her EXACTLY is the emergency is.

If it's bullshit you say "Sorry no, neighbour, I really value the chance to chat with DDs during school run time and they clam up with someone else present"....just as @WildBlueAndDitzy suggests.

If she wants to be unpleasant afterwards, thats on her.

People like her do not make good neighbours so they really are best avoided.

I feel so sad for her daughter, how sad she wants to do choir but won't even ask the mum 😔 I'd keep doing it for the little girls sake. I think it's a shame your daughters clam up when she's there but for this little girl I think it's worth doing in my opinion. Especially as she likes to walk but apparently never gets to walk anywhere. I'd encourage my DDs to make friends with her and have her to play in your garden rather than out on the street on her own 😔 maybe I'm a pushover but I'd do all of that for the girls sake. Maybe at least it might make the mum realise she is being completely shit as a mum!

I’d think of the little girl and do it for her but I wouldn’t call her someone as unreliable as her for emergencies!

@MyVeryFirstCF

The whole "no is a complete sentence" doesn't really work for cordial neighbour relations, does it?

In the real world, I don't know anyone who gets asked for a favour and says no, without giving some apology and/or context.

It's especially awkward if I say no, and she can literally see me walking my own children to school 5 minutes later.

I know what you mean but you breeze over the social awkwardness in your ‘no’ and centre your own needs in your response. So in your case ‘sorry, that isn’t going to be doable for me today. Hope you manage to sort something’ or similar. The response doesn't need to be unfriendly but at the same time you don’t need to explain and justify either. I would absolutely not rely on this person in an emergency either.

I am friendly with a lady who has 4 children - 3 in primary school and a toddler. She is a sahm. One of her kids is friendly with another child in the same class. However child's parents are cf's.

So my friend would get calls from the child's father could you pick up X from school and I will collect him from your house at Y time. She did this a few times and the father then turned up late.

He would be all sorry and had excuses why he was late. He say to her we must have z (her child) up on Sat and this only happened twice. I told my friend store his name and phone number on your phone so you can see who's calling and not answer his calls. When she had her last baby he never once offered to drop her kids back home after school or never called around with a present for the baby. The last time he asked her she said no to him. She found out that he had pulled the same with other parents.

Another couple I know live about 3 miles from the nearest town where the local schools are. The father works long hours at times and the mother is sahm. They have a few kids that are now in their teens. They had a few parents who were CF wanting their kids bought to sports events that could be 10 miles plus away or minded after school. So this couple arranged with other friends to take turns bringing kids to sports events. She minded their kids an odd afternoon during the week but they had her child on a Sat afternoon or minded them when she had to bring another child to an appointment.
This worked out well for all of them as it gave them all some flexibility and it ment they could only drive their kids and friends kids to events.

I think at most people don't mind helping out in the odd emergency but no one wants to be used either.
In your case I say no your CF neighbor because she keep expecting you to do it. Along with this that time is when you and your kids might say things you need to hear.

@YoYoYoYoSup

I feel so sad for her daughter, how sad she wants to do choir but won't even ask the mum 😔 I'd keep doing it for the little girls sake. I think it's a shame your daughters clam up when she's there but for this little girl I think it's worth doing in my opinion. Especially as she likes to walk but apparently never gets to walk anywhere. I'd encourage my DDs to make friends with her and have her to play in your garden rather than out on the street on her own 😔 maybe I'm a pushover but I'd do all of that for the girls sake. Maybe at least it might make the mum realise she is being completely shit as a mum!

The problem is that the Op stepping in does not help this child in the long run. Her parents should be taking her to school, being involved, meeting her teacher etc. The Op stepping in actually makes it worse for her as her parents take an even bigger step back.

@strawflower

What does CF mean? 😄

Cheeky fucker

I don’t think you need a reason

@BonnesVacances

I'd think of the little girl tbh. She has shit parents who can't be bothered to get her to school sometimes. If it's no skin off your nose, apart from the principle of CFery, do it for her.

You could reply one time, I'll do it but would like you to repay the favour next time I ask. But I'm not sure it would make any difference.

Don't give her any more eggs though. Ignore the message.

This. YANBU OP, she is a CF but if it doesn't put you out that much to take Jenny with your own DC, I'd still do it. For Jenny's sake, not the CF's. That'd be all I'd do though! If she came on the scrat again I'd ignore her or say I couldn't help, too busy/hadn't got any/ not feeling well- something like that! She could buy her own bloody eggs!

I think you should adopt Jenny and have done.

@MyVeryFirstCF

The whole "no is a complete sentence" doesn't really work for cordial neighbour relations, does it?

In the real world, I don't know anyone who gets asked for a favour and says no, without giving some apology and/or context.

It's especially awkward if I say no, and she can literally see me walking my own children to school 5 minutes later.

Calling her a cheeky fu**er in the title of your post is not precisely cordial.

In the real world if you think someone is taking you for a ride, you say no. You can walk your children to school and it's completly fine. They are YOUR children.

I think you give more importance to "cordial neighbour relations" when you know she's a CF than simply being upfront what doesn't work for you.

Just say ‘no sorry, I cannot take on the responsibility of another child right now’

If she asks why just say ‘it changes our morning dynamic, and I don’t want to feel tied to this incase we have a morning emergency ourselves’.

Simple, and not unreasonable in the slightest.

This morning when she texted me to say Davy was fast asleep so could I please take Jenny to school - it was actually 6.30 a.m. I didn't read her text until about 7.15 - but surely (assuming her DH's penis prevented him from looking after his own child for 30 mins) that would be enough time to get him up.

When she answered the door to me this morning, she was literally hiding behind it, mostly - literally - undressed. Jenny was thankfully fully ready.

I don't think it would be punishing Jenny not to take her. As far as I know, they're not regularly late to school because they drive . I suspect her mum would manage to put her clothes on if push came to shove.

For PPs saying that I should let my DDs play with her - they're more than welcome to, but I won't let them play in the street (fairly busy through-road). I don't want to invite Jenny over "formally" for a playdate, firstly because my children have busy enough lives and it's hard enough to schedule time with their actual close friends, but also because I sense I will then be used even more as a childminder, and I'm bloody sure it wouldn't be reciprocated.

I think something along the lines of "Sorry, I promised the DDs they could have me to themselves this morning" will have to do.

I’d find it easier to say no over text. The next time she asks, send a message say “Sorry I’m not able to help you get Jenny to school, my mornings are manic enough without adding someone else’s child into the mix and to be honest, I really value the time chatting with my two on the way there”

Sometimes when CF type people ask me for favors, I say, "No thanks," which seems to get across the message that we all know they are not willing to reciprocate and that I understand I'm being asked for too many favors.

Can you say, "No. This only works if you reciprocate, which you don't. So, no."

@Alsoplayspiccolo

We had a similar scenario with our NDN, except that our children are much older than theirs and never had anything to do with each other (they weren’t at the same school). It started with her asking me to pop round to help with bathtime, as she had a 2 year old and new twins. Then it was asking me to babysit between the time the child minder left and she got back from a night out. After that, she’d phone me to ask me to look after her 4th baby of one of the twins had had a toileting accident at nursery and she had to collect them. Then she’d call my DH randomly to ask him to fix something/plumb in a washing machine (she has a perfectly able-bodied DH!!).

My favourite incident was when she knocked on the door one evening with a huge laundry bag full of dirty washing and asked us to wash it for her, as they’d just got back from Center Parcs and it was too much for her to do in one go…. At 10pm the same night, she called to say her DH was on his way round to collect it so she could get it in the drier overnight.

She ended up calling me for favours whenever she was at home with the kids, and on the one occasion she offered a favour in return - having me and my 2 DC round for tea when I was poorly - she jibbed at the last minute.

I stopped answering her calls, so she started calling DH’s mobile.
Now neither of us answer her calls, and if she knocks on the door, I ignore that too.

So what if OP's daughters don't want this other girl to walk with them every day? It's not her fault, but she's an interloper. It does change things to have someone you don't know well shoe-horned into the group every day or on a regular basis.

OP's daughters' happiness and enjoyment of time with their mother is more important to her than making life easy for a neighbour she barely knows (and who has a husband wfh who should be stepping up).

You have said -

I think something along the lines of "Sorry, I promised the DDs they could have me to themselves this morning" will have to do.

And the truth when not being unkind works well nearly every time.

If you dont want to do it you dont have to.

I might add that you can only do it in an unavoidable emergency so she doesnt ask again as you are leaving it open by saying promised the girls today.

I do wonder whats going on though as you dont contact someone at 6.30 am unless you are rushing off to hospital or something but....

Sounds like she wants a sleep in and you’re very convenient. Odious woman.

I have been in this exact scenario and I said that my morning walks were the only part of our day where we really got to talk about stuff, and I wanted to maintain that. I would however take Jenny in an emergency. I still have a good relationship with my neighbours. It's the absolute truth, and also sets a boundary.

How far is the walk again , it wasn’t very clear?

No is a complete sentence, do not need to justify anything to anyone.

Do you think if you didn't help Jenny wouldn't get to school on time?

We had a little girl in DS's class whose parents were very flaky, and she would often turn up late in school as they hadn't bothered to get up in time. The HT asked a parent who drove by this family's house every day on the school run to pick up the little girl, so she got to school before 10am