Teachers- be honest please - do you judge or make assumptions?

[BlingLoving]

And if so, how often are you right?

eg when the kid turns up on day one with crazy curls, no hair tie (especially boys) do you immediately think, like I do, "oh no, this family is going to be a bit precious."

Or if the kid's clothes are consistently stained etc, do you chalk that up to parents having limited cash and taking view that school uniform is to be worn (my approach) or do you think they're just careless?

What about the ones who struggle to spend the time doing homework with their DC? Do you think they're just bad parents or are you sympathetic?

@TimeForTeaAndMe if you get nowhere, can you look at changing schools?
It sounds heartbreaking for your poor kid, but tbh you can't make a school or TA/teacher behave in a certain way if they're not willing to. Some even do it on purpose to weed out "undesirable " children. While it's not your child's fault, and you have every right to fight and complain and expect/demand better the time is passing and his self esteem and interest/enthusiasm for school and learning can severely wane. You might get somewhere,you might not but by then might be too late.

It's not fair,and it's not right but please consider whether that school is the right environment for your son.

@CasZekey one of my Jaden's is at grammar school, so those posters can shove that up their pipe and smoke it.

As for foreign names, some teachers can't even be bothered to say them right and butcher them in English. That's another pet peeve of mine. No Andrii, is not a spelling mistake sneer sneer. No, Ioana is not eye oh na. No, Anoushka is not Annie or Ann or Anishka and no it doesn't sound like anus or whatever other bullshit. No, Isis and Ira aren't just terrorist organisations and Iris isn't just the part of the eye ... oh the horror. And so on.

Yes.. I have issues.

What is amusing me on this thread is the number of people wringing their hands and telling us that of course they never judge the parents who choose such names as Riley, Bailey, Jayden, Chardonnay, Lacey-Mae etc. Of course we should treat each child as an individual and in that sense names really do not matter. However, MN, is predominantly a very middle class forum and I am wondering just how many people here, particularly teachers, chose those names for their own children as opposed to such names as Harry, George, Oliver, Olivia, Sophie, Isabel etc.

@Violinist64

What is amusing me on this thread is the number of people wringing their hands and telling us that of course they never judge the parents who choose such names as Riley, Bailey, Jayden, Chardonnay, Lacey-Mae etc. Of course we should treat each child as an individual and in that sense names really do not matter. However, MN, is predominantly a very middle class forum and I am wondering just how many people here, particularly teachers, chose those names for their own children as opposed to such names as Harry, George, Oliver, Olivia, Sophie, Isabel etc.

Just because I wouldn’t choose a name doesn’t mean I’d find it funny to spend my break times ‘predicting what GCSEs children will get based on their names.’

Grotesque behaviour. There’s a huge difference between ‘judging the parent’ ie thinking hmm maybe Dick isn’t the best name for a child in 2022, and making nasty assumptions about the child because of their background or even just their first name.

I want to add to my post before I, too, am judged that I truly believe all children should be treated equally and fairly, whatever their names or backgrounds. However, in the real world with human nature as it is, this does not always happen. Even today, it is all too easy for teachers to see the youngest child of a large “problem family” and tar them with the same brush before they have even entered the school/class. I remember one boy in my class at school who was treated in just such a manner by some teachers. I think he was probably dyslexic but at that time dyslexia was only beginning to be recognised and it would not have been considered in his case. He reacted by becoming the class clown and left school at the earliest possible opportunity without taking any exams. However, he has worked hard all his life and now owns a business, is married and has two children who have both been to university. His strength of character has overcome the early adversity he faced but how many others were and are written off in life because they have the wrong name and/or background?

@Kanaloa, I hope l have explained my thoughts and l am in total agreement with you. The name should not matter. Unfortunately, not everyone thinks like you.

Yes it’s sad. You only need to look at how people will openly admit it on here. I don’t know how they get away with it though - no school I’ve worked in would accept or allow a teacher to go through the register snickering with their colleagues about how this child won’t get GCSEs because if they’re name.

I wonder why some people went into teaching in the first place.

I have always wondered about this, my DC are always clean and punctual but DS tells his aid absolutely everything in detail with access to her all day.

[quote ldontWanna]@CasZekey one of my Jaden's is at grammar school, so those posters can shove that up their pipe and smoke it.

As for foreign names, some teachers can't even be bothered to say them right and butcher them in English. That's another pet peeve of mine. No Andrii, is not a spelling mistake sneer sneer. No, Ioana is not eye oh na. No, Anoushka is not Annie or Ann or Anishka and no it doesn't sound like anus or whatever other bullshit. No, Isis and Ira aren't just terrorist organisations and Iris isn't just the part of the eye ... oh the horror. And so on.

Yes.. I have issues.[/quote]
I'm awarding myself a chufty badge, doing supply I often butchered names on a register (I always said, sorry if I get your name wrong, please correct me before taking the register).

But I was proud of asking a student (phonetic English spelling) Is it Yonna or Eye oh na?

@FairyCakeWings- What do you want highly literate five and six year olds to read? Phonetic readers are deadly dull. Enid Blyton isn’t well written. Horrid Histories are highly inaccurate. Captain Underpants and Wimpy Kid contain poor grammar and promote antisocial behavior. Barbie and Disney Princess books promote the outdated idea that women are nothing without a man.

Sounds like a lot of teachers need EDI training? Judging wealth, hair styles, nationality, clothes, first impressions are all unacceptable. I'm amazed people think vocalising their husbands prejudiced observations of Asian and Nigerian pupils is acceptable! Mind boggling that they are educating children.

Of course they judge
Most teachers I've ever met are not very pleasant people either.

May be there’s something about teaching that wrings the humanity out of you following a number of years.

Long curly locks on any gender sound beautiful- but it’s not doing a young child any favours if not tied back for work and play.

@the80sweregreat

Of course they judge Most teachers I've ever met are not very pleasant people either.

Gosh that’s delightful. And it’s the teachers who are judgy? 🥴

@Violinist64

What is amusing me on this thread is the number of people wringing their hands and telling us that of course they never judge the parents who choose such names as Riley, Bailey, Jayden, Chardonnay, Lacey-Mae etc. Of course we should treat each child as an individual and in that sense names really do not matter. However, MN, is predominantly a very middle class forum and I am wondering just how many people here, particularly teachers, chose those names for their own children as opposed to such names as Harry, George, Oliver, Olivia, Sophie, Isabel etc.

Hang on, you can’t notice xenophobia unless you’re appropriating that culture yourself?

However, MN, is predominantly a very middle class forum and I am wondering just how many people here, particularly teachers, chose those names for their own children as opposed to such names as Harry, George, Oliver, Olivia, Sophie, Isabel etc.

What's that got to do with anything though? Are you saying it's somehow hypocritical to try not to judge people dissimilar to yourself? Or that in order to prove that you're trying to be non-judgmental, you should deliberately choose names for your children on the basis of which names are popular with socio-economic, or perhaps even racial, groups different from your own?

@Violinist64

What is amusing me on this thread is the number of people wringing their hands and telling us that of course they never judge the parents who choose such names as Riley, Bailey, Jayden, Chardonnay, Lacey-Mae etc. Of course we should treat each child as an individual and in that sense names really do not matter. However, MN, is predominantly a very middle class forum and I am wondering just how many people here, particularly teachers, chose those names for their own children as opposed to such names as Harry, George, Oliver, Olivia, Sophie, Isabel etc.

Actually there are some teachers at my school that have kids with names from the "list". Just how some of the wc class parents have Harry,Olivia,Isabel,Oliver etc. and not one single child is actually called Chardonnay.

Aren't assumptions funny?

[quote sashh]@BlingLoving

I don't know about your son's SEN but something I've done with some students who struggle to organise or are always looking for things (and are often dyslexic) is a 'desk map' basically a piece of paper with boxes that are marked with 'pencil case', 'calculator', 'exercise book' so things are kept in the same place.

Depending on the child it can be a scale 'map' or an actual A3 sheet that goes on the desk first.[/quote]
Thanks. We don't think he's dyslexic but he is being assessed in May by an ed psychologist and she's going to look at dyslexia - not least because his cousin is dyslexic and we suspect my dad and/or brother/s are too (undiagnosed).

He's also got many dyspraxia markers but, oddly, none of the really big ones - he can ride a bike, has no problem with zips and buttons etc (although did take longer to master these skills than peers) so she's going to take another look at that too (he was assessed by an OT age 6 previously).

He struggles to organise in preparation - hence my concern about getting books/bags etc. But once he's in place, he does okay. The challenge is going to be getting him to the right place at the right time with the right tools. But he can and does learn routines so it's hopefully just about taking the time in the beginning.

Not RTFT

I was secondary so slightly different. I didn't judge hair as such, but always had spare scrunchies for science experiments and would judge if any of them made a fuss about tying it back. Whether that judgement was 'this child may have additional needs' or 'this child is stubborn' would depend on the exact nature of the interaction.

I tried to keep an open mind but after a few years your brain spots trends so you have to be aware of unconscious bias, mine were things like:

Ellie-Mai, Rosa-May, name. Probably going to have a low opinion of 'science' and a less confidence in her own ability than she should have, needs lots of encouragement. Much more confident in English and Drama.

Short red-haired boy with diamond earring. Reluctant to put pen to paper, sanctions tend not to work well, constant battle on effort, unlikely to complete homework.

Tall boy with floppy hair walks into first lesson with 'what up Miss?'. Socially confident, attitude in class could go either way depending on mix of peers. Studious peers will result in him working well and offering good answers, struggling peers will result in him causing disruption every time my back is turned.

[quote ldontWanna]@TimeForTeaAndMe if you get nowhere, can you look at changing schools?
It sounds heartbreaking for your poor kid, but tbh you can't make a school or TA/teacher behave in a certain way if they're not willing to. Some even do it on purpose to weed out "undesirable " children. While it's not your child's fault, and you have every right to fight and complain and expect/demand better the time is passing and his self esteem and interest/enthusiasm for school and learning can severely wane. You might get somewhere,you might not but by then might be too late.

It's not fair,and it's not right but please consider whether that school is the right environment for your son.[/quote]
Thankyou for your concern and replying to my rant.
We have put a few things in place now and complaints have been lodged.
The school have been given a set amount of time to meet his needs.
Or yes I will have to pull him out,
He really is a overly sensitive child so things can very easily upset him.
But there are no excuses for a TA shouting at him for his stuttering when trying to explain himself.
I'm also trying my best not to be so judgemental however his main teachers are littrally just out of school themselves,have no life experience with children and don't have children of their own..
While they may be kind. They haven't had enough time or training to understand the complex needs of some of these children.
We shall see what the new term brings I suppose. Love to see his confidence come back and that happy big hearted boy we have at home..starts to enjoy school again.

Ah yes this happened to me when DS started making dramatic improvements. Apparently I'd been coaching him. This was repeated over and over in a sort of mixture of sympathy and fake gratitude....except I genuinely hadn't coached him!!

my my how this thread has grown over night.

thats not the case with mine he maybe Sen with behavioural problems but he was top in the primary school in maths and tired top for reading comprehension. he only started secondary in septemer, since then I have had the science teacher asking if he can get medicated to calm him down and the maths teacher seems to think I do his homework.

I myself never went to school my parents never sent me and I didnt learn to write until I went to college, so the accusation is insane, he surpassed my maths ability when he was about 7 or 8 years old as I said its all greek to me.

@Keepingmytoeswarm

Homework at primary school? I struggled to show enthusiasm for this myself (beyond reading & spellings).

My kids HATED these mega projects and it made years 5 & 6 pretty unhappy - around the weeks homework was set anyway.

I guess it set them up for year 7 and having homework?? But still we thought it was ridiculous.

The idea of giving a 9 year old a large, weeks-long project without breaking it down always seemed like setting students up to fail and an awful lot of stress. Plus - lots of parents doing the homework to teach the desired standard. Pointless really. Your kid - who did everything themselves / just felt shit about their work…

oh god the projects, my son is fixated on cars, always has been, he was fine in primary doing maths etc but all the big "fun" building projects like make a rainforrest in a box, I had to do them because he had no interest in arts and crafts unless it involved cars, and even then if he'd made a land rover to crash thru the trees I still would have had to make the trees.

@Tsuni

What kind of dick judges someone for having curly hair?

Isn't it amazing? Yet there are schools who "ban" afros, long hair etc, essentially criminalising some ethnicities.

I don't judge names, wouldn't judge breakfast on the school uniform, or the odd bit of uniform that got a bit small.

I don't judge behaviour, but I massively judge when the parents are given support and time by the school but continue to make their children's lives harder and learning impossible (as well as disrupting the education of 28 other children). I judge the parents who try and kill aspiration in their children (unfortunately common at my school). I also judge parents who won't put the time in on things like spelling or learning the times tables (unless SEN is involved of course).

Mostly I judge parents at my child's own school - parents who are very well-resourced professionals but put zero time or effort into their children and allow some pretty shocking behaviour.