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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Reservations over Dads new will?

184 replies

MsMiaWallace · 20/03/2022 21:13

After a conversation with my dad this morning he informed me he was renewing his will following a health scare.

My Dad is currently retired, is very comfortable. Mortgage free 3 bed semi, owns a narrowboat & has around £70k if not more in his account.
He has a partner who lives with him.
She basically lives off him, barely works or contributes. This is how it has been since she met him.

I never challenge this as he's happy with the situation & it's his choice.
They've been together around 4 years. Since meeting her he has distanced from us & we were close.

This morning he told me that he is changing his will so although his house would be mine she has to stay at the property until she chooses to leave.
Again his choice however I am concerned that it is a large house. She's in her 60s & will be too big for her to maintain alone therefore I will have to upkeep the property whilst she continues to live there rent free?
I also have my own mortgage to pay, family to look after etc whilst doing this.
He told me I would be the landlord but without the rent.
She also has a son that will likely move in with her who also does not contribute.

I absolutely respect that it's his choice but
AIBU here to have reservations about this situation?

OP posts:
timeisnotaline · 21/03/2022 03:12

@gumball37

I'd just tell him not to leave the house to you as you don't have the desire or financial situation to fund the life of his girlfriend after he passes.
Why would the op be funding her life? There is no indication she would be responsible for upkeep. This advice is telling her to cut off her nose to spite her face.
SquirrelG · 21/03/2022 04:13

Having heard recently of a woman in her early 80s who is about to be forced out of her home upon the death of her husband I think your father is doing the honourable thing. Normally in these situations the person living in the house is responsible for the upkeep while they live there.

You sound rather bitter. Your father has a companion and is presumably happy with her, and he is not actuallly leaving the house to her, it will come to you eventually. He can actually leave his possessions to whoever he likes - I find all this angst about what people might/might not get from someone once they die distasteful.

StrawberryPot · 21/03/2022 04:51

He can actually leave his possessions to whoever he likes - I find all this angst about what people might/might not get from someone once they die distasteful.

SquirrelG - It's quite the MN thing to trot out this platitude - a very easy and morally superior stance for the casual, uninvested observer to take. I think most of us might be more than a little irked by this situation if we were on the receiving end of it.

I don't think the op is disputing her df's right to do what he wants with his possessions. She quite rightly - and very sensibly - is exploring whether his proposal will have ongoing financial implications for her. Something her df seems to have failed to consider. Yes the woman could be made responsible for maintenance costs, but I'm not sure how this could be enforced if she doesn't have the financial resources or the inclination to do so.

Cornishclio · 21/03/2022 04:54

My mum and stepdad had this life interest arrangement with the flat my mum now lives in although it was mums flat before she married my stepdad and he actually bought half of it and it was purchased tenants in common so effective my stepsisters now own half her flat. The responsibility for the upkeep is hers and that was written into the will. Your Dad needs to make this explicit. He could live for another 20 years or more though if he is in his 60s and a health scare doesn't have to change that so I would not worry too much about it. He just wants to make sure his partner is protected and not thrown out on the streets.

GCAcademic · 21/03/2022 04:56

I wish people would read the OP properly before rushing to accuse the OP of being greedy and grasping. It’s obvious that the problem is that she may be expected to pay towards the upkeep of the house her father’s partner is living in.

Why would the op be funding her life? There is no indication she would be responsible for upkeep.

Her father has told her she would be “the landlord without the rent”, so it does seem that this is what is envisaged.

Polyanthus2 · 21/03/2022 06:59

I would expect the solicitors response to this to be NOOOOO.

What if the gf or son eg damage part of the house eg through fire and it's their fault so no insurance to cover it. Would you be obliged to repair it as gf has the house for life and has nowhere else to go? What if gf meets new man with several DCs and moves them all in. She's 60 so could easy have another 30 years. So you d have 30 years of maintenance and repairs ......
You need to speak to a solicitor - gf will never move out, her home will be your responsibility. You'd be nuts to take it on.

HELLITHURT · 21/03/2022 07:01

@fallfallfall

Force them to leave when the time comes
How?

When they've got a legal right to be there?

This is a common way to write a will when you have a second partner.

Could be worse, he could give it all directly to her.

Porcupineintherough · 21/03/2022 07:02

She has really fallen on her feet

Well it's a bit early to say that yet, isnt it. I guess youd really have to see how long the relationship lasts and what she puts it to it before judging.

I think your concerns about upkeep of the property are valid and you should speak to your dad about them. But the idea that they could have a long relationship and then get evicted in old age doesnt feel just either.

The fact is you have no idea whether your dad will even end up living in this particular house all his life and, at this point, neither does he.

HELLITHURT · 21/03/2022 07:02

@Polyanthus2

I would expect the solicitors response to this to be NOOOOO.

What if the gf or son eg damage part of the house eg through fire and it's their fault so no insurance to cover it. Would you be obliged to repair it as gf has the house for life and has nowhere else to go? What if gf meets new man with several DCs and moves them all in. She's 60 so could easy have another 30 years. So you d have 30 years of maintenance and repairs ......
You need to speak to a solicitor - gf will never move out, her home will be your responsibility. You'd be nuts to take it on.

It really is very common to have a life tenant, it happens a lot.

Solicitor will not be surprised.

Juno22 · 21/03/2022 07:06

It's your dad's money to do with as he pleases and leave to who he wishes. He didn't have to tell you he is changing his will but he's chosen to do so. This woman lives with him and is part of his life. There's nothing wrong with him wanting to take care of her. Some very nasty comments on here about a woman who hasn't done anything wrong.

IncompleteSenten · 21/03/2022 07:08

You need to ask your dad these questions.

Who will be responsible for paying for repairs and maintenance dad? You need to specify that responsibility in your will.
Can she move anyone else into the house dad?
What if she meets someone else dad? Marries? Can they live together in the house?

Make him think about the practicalities.

Maybe suggest to him that she gets to live in the house until her death but is responsible for all bills, maintenance and repairs and if she fails to maintain the property she can lose the right to remain there (if that's possible, I don't know) and after her death the property becomes available for you to sell or move in to.

makeupfail · 21/03/2022 07:13

I wouldn't want that. I think I would say if those are terms I wouldn't want it. It sounds like a lot of grief that could end up costing and you may never get a return.

Polyanthus2 · 21/03/2022 07:14

I would guess most life tenansvwould be elderly or disabled family members whom you feel some responsibility for rather than a younger gf not known to you.

ThatsNotItAtAll · 21/03/2022 07:17

"It will come to you eventually is disingenuous"

I used to work in a dementia nursing home and so very many people outlive their children. A father's potentially somewhat younger female partner may very possibly outlive his daughter or only die a few years before her.

The OP is absolutely right not to take on responsibility for the upkeep and bills on a property she may very well not live long enough to sell, or only be able to sell when she herself is elderly.

ThatsNotItAtAll · 21/03/2022 07:18

sorry misplaced quotation marks above obviously. It should have been "It will come to you eventually" is disingenuous, of course.

PermanentTemporary · 21/03/2022 07:20

Perhaps just check if you would be liable for inheritance tax on the house, and whether paying it could be delayed until it is sold, possibly decades ahead?

Mn isn't the only place where people assume that planning for the future is grabby and unpleasant. If you're going to get landed with bills for tens of thousands and no means to pay it, it's perfectly reasonable to ask a few questions.

brainhurts · 21/03/2022 07:21

I would make sure she is responsible for all repairs and upkeep, and you as landlord have the right to inspect the hours at any time

ivykaty44 · 21/03/2022 07:27

Your father could put a caveat into his will that no one else can move into the house

I’d suggest to my father that it would upset me if a new partner was to move in and take his place, so would appreciate this clause

This would then mean if she needed long term care that would mean no one can move into the house to care for her, also her son

If this did happen an eviction could be possible?

Quartz2208 · 21/03/2022 07:30

I am assuming that the vagueness here is actually the OPs Dad explaining to his daughter rather than the actual will itself

@MsMiaWallace a life interest trust is fairly common and the life tenant should be liable for repairs etc. If your father is writing his will with a solicitor particularly one who is experienced in this all this should be covered

NeedleNoodle3 · 21/03/2022 07:44

I think it sounds fair as long as the upkeep issue is sorted out. The DF could end up outliving his DP.

Original poster
MsMiaWallace · 21/03/2022 08:30

Thank you for responses, very useful & some not so useful.
I can assure you I'm not a coffin grabber.

I tried to politely raise a couple of concerns with my DF yesterday but he became quite irate stating He doesn't ask me to maintain the property now & it's going to be my house. I replied that it's not my house now.
Also mentioned about potential that son may move in. He said that he would never do that as they're 'different people'.
In reality & I believe he would.

Hopefully the solicitor will make it tight in terms of maintenance.

OP posts:
BeanStew22 · 21/03/2022 08:32

@ivykaty44

Your father could put a caveat into his will that no one else can move into the house

I’d suggest to my father that it would upset me if a new partner was to move in and take his place, so would appreciate this clause

This would then mean if she needed long term care that would mean no one can move into the house to care for her, also her son

If this did happen an eviction could be possible?

I agree, but would like to ask of anyone has experience of how this is enforced

To me, this sounds like a loophole where (single) women move new partners into eg Council/HA properties but the man officially lives with eg a relative to avoid disrupting benefits

Juno22 · 21/03/2022 08:33

Your words were 'it sounds bitter but she's really fallen on her feet'.

It's his money, not yours.

Emsie1987 · 21/03/2022 08:35

My nan was in this situation. Slightly different though she was married to my step grandad for 25 years. They divorced for two years then got back together but they had already split the assets. My step grandad had his Will renewed which stated that my nan could live in the house until she passed, however she was liable for all bills and upkeep. There was certain stipulations about having to do maintenance as well so it didn't fall into disrepair and that she had to show his daughters building and contents insurance once a year. Also there is a condition that she isn't allowed anyone else to stay for longer than two weeks at a time.

Thinkingblonde · 21/03/2022 08:35

Similar happened with my male neighbour, they were married but she’d been married previously, she had two daughters to her first marriage, none to the second. The house was in her name, also two cars and a caravan, money in the bank. She died and willed 50% of the house to my neighbour and the other 50% to her daughters, the daughters then charged him rent to live there.

He came back from the solicitors in total shock,
He eventually bought them out, they tried to get him to pay full market value on it but got a shock when his solicitor told them no, you only own 50% of it so you only get half.