Will Labour ever get back in?

[Blueblossompinksky]

My understanding is that the labour majority was in part because of the Scottish vote, which seems to have gone to the SNP.

I realise it’s unlikely that the Tories will get back in with such a large majority as 2019 but will there actually be enough seats for Labour to win?

The one and only Labour MP, Rosie Duffield who has stated clearly that she stands for women's rights, has been blocked from attending Labour conferences.

The Tories simply haven't been captured in that way.

I can't stand the Tories. They're a bunch of wankers.
Can't vote Labour though 🤷.

Apparently Labour don't even want my vote and if I were a member I'd be expelled they've said so directly!!

@Ostryga

Not until they know what a woman is!!

I was a staunch Labour voter all my adult life - canvassed and campaigned for them, went to meetings the lot. They have completely lost my vote for their woke can’t call a woman a woman shite.

Even without that I think they will struggle in the 24 election. They’re not cohesive as a party and not a strong enough opposition.

This!

My exact initial response was not until the can identify what a woman is.

The Tories maybe a group of mysigonistic lying twats but if they aren't eroding woman's rights they will continue to get the vote.

KS is meant to be an intelligent lawyer. If he can't tell the different between a penis and vagina how can we trust him to run the country better than people who can't tell the difference between a work meeting and a party?

Eventually.
I don't expect the Tories to win every election for hundreds of years so yes, eventually labour will get in again.

We tend to go in cycles in the UK and put up with one party until we're totally fucked off then vote them out as opposed to voting the other one in iyswim. Yes, you've voting the other one in of course you are but it's more against one than for the other.
Just my take on it

So you're quite happy to see the Conservative Party reelected? How have they benefited or protected women while in government?

They blocked GRA reform. They know what a woman is. In the current climate that's showing some balls.

Serious question; Has anyone asked Boris what definition of a women is?

Not while Labour is like two opposing parties under one banner.

Not while they keep throwing women under the bus.

Not while they still can't get a grip on financial issues.

Not while they flip/flop on every single issue

It's a shame there's not a viable opposition party, a really shame, but there isn't!

Hopefully not. I don’t think the general public are that stupid.

@RubyTrees

Not until they know what a woman is!!

If they struggle to understand the definition of a woman, they won't be surprised when women decide not to vote for them.

I don't think labour realise how damaging the line TWAW is to them.

@WildPoinsettia

Labour are in in Wales and our lives are better for it, compared to those in England. I hope they stay in Wales and if they get into Westminster, even better.

You speak for yourself. Anything the WG touches seems to turn into shit. They're responsible for the Welsh NHS, which is failing. They're responsible for education in Wales, which is failing - and do I even need to mention just how appalling Transport for Wales are?

I find it utterly bizarre that people feel they have to agree with EVERY SINGLE policy point of Labour in order to vote for them! Meanwhile, the Tories destroy the country.

This is the Left’s problem- too principled / idealistic / stubborn.

We would rather sit comfortably on our high horse as the opposition, than compromise our own self-righteousness by supporting a less-than-perfect opposition for the wider good of the country.

Well that didn't take long.

Forget any wide ranging discussion on electability OP.

@ilovesooty a significant factor in electability is how you come across in interviews. Diane Abbot fell apart when trying to say how much it would cost to increase the number of police officers, her performance became symbolic to many people of the Labour party' lack of competence. So if all an interviewer has to do to make a prominent Labour politician fall apart is to ask a very straightforward question, then Labour are doomed.

I hope not, their stance on women is disgusting.

Raspberryjamchicken The current balance of rights issue is not something I would discuss outside my family as it causes such vitriol. It will probably determine my vote though, even though I would usually vote labour. I don’t see it as a niche issue myself. A friend told me last week that half her dd’s class are now saying they are trans. Puberty is a confusing time. Some of these young girls may harm their bodies with blockers/hormones/surgery. At the same time women are supposed to accept male bodied people into women’s sports, baking in failure for women and deterring their participation. Trans people should be treated with dignity and respect but so should women. Calling me a vagina haver is not treating me with dignity and respect. Denying sick women female only spaces in hospitals is giving precedence to others’ feelings over women’s safety and ability to recuperate. That’s before you consider the wider implications of the acceptance of totalitarian thinking, the witch hunting, the threats. How can we turn a blind eye to this and condone it? If Labour would promise a mature discussion how to balance these rights, and safeguard children, rather than behaving like terrified hostages, I would vote for them.

Labour are far too removed from what the working class actually wants and needs. They're too busy naval-gazing and arguing about bullshit topics like identity politics and other similar woke rubbish.

People care more about stuff like jobs, the economy, the welfare state, the NHS, transport, women's and children's safety, and immigration. Labour seem to have forgotten all of that, and have only the vaguest of policies with no underpinning data on affordability. They're lost in a sea of Westminster chatter, I can't see them finding their way back unless Momentum fucks off to form their own party.

Not until they stop pissing all over women’s rights.

Voting labour wouldn’t be for the good of the country though would it, as 50% of the country are women.
What I find frustrating is labour could absolutely smash the opposition out of the water with no effort at all….but instead they’ve decided not to and go down a line that alienates so much of the population!! Why!?

We need a new party to vote for!

@DdraigGoch I couldn’t disagree more vehemently. The Welsh NHS is bloody amazing compared to England. I had breast cancer identified, scanned, operated on and follow up treatment all in 3 months.
Meanwhile my friend in England is dying on a waiting list.

Education in Wales is being transformed with a new curriculum and arrangements for ensuring ANY child with ALN (the old SEN) gets a legally binding support plan and person centred support. In England the education system is crippled by profitmaking schools and providers companies hoovering up taxpayers money because money-starved Councils lose tribunals due to not being able to meet pupil needs. Meanwhile local schools miss out. It’s a shambles.

Transport for Wales is bad, but so is rail travel everywhere. The rail network needed investment, not privatisation.

*12:40 Overtheseas"

Unfortunately the woke Labour line of TWAW and how they've implemented it has insulted, offended and terrified me to such an extent that I can't ignore it, even "for the greater good".

Some women feel really really strongly on this single issue.

Unfortunately they've let themselves down in a few other areas which has resulted in them becoming entirely unelectable, which is sad because against Theresa May Labour were a breath away from winning and I voted for them then.

@DdraigGoch

Well that didn't take long.

Forget any wide ranging discussion on electability OP.

@ilovesooty a significant factor in electability is how you come across in interviews. Diane Abbot fell apart when trying to say how much it would cost to increase the number of police officers, her performance became symbolic to many people of the Labour party' lack of competence. So if all an interviewer has to do to make a prominent Labour politician fall apart is to ask a very straightforward question, then Labour are doomed.

Various members of the Conservative Party have had any number of car crash interviews since.

This reminds me of Ed Miliband and the bacon sandwich.

In the next election run up Labour MPs and Tory ones I expect are going to be asked by journalists time and time again to define a woman. Unless Labour MPs with the exception of Rosie Duffield come up with a clear, coherent answer they are going to make utter fools of themselves and cost Labour the election. I've always voted Labour and want to again but I am in two minds because of this issue, I would never vote Tory.

So you're quite happy to see the Conservative Party reelected? How have they benefited or protected women while in government?

Well just off the top of my head, Sajid Javid ordered a review into the guidance that allows male patients into female-only NHS wards.

They blocked the reform of the Gender Recognition Act.

Scrapped the tampon tax and started rolling out free period products in schools. Under a Labour government schools would probably be told they must give out sanitary towels to boys, seeing as Kier Starmer doesn’t seem to know which group of humans has a cervix and which doesn’t

A bunch of their MP’s are happy to go on record stating what a woman is.

@Overtheseas

I find it utterly bizarre that people feel they have to agree with EVERY SINGLE policy point of Labour in order to vote for them! Meanwhile, the Tories destroy the country.

This is the Left’s problem- too principled / idealistic / stubborn.

We would rather sit comfortably on our high horse as the opposition, than compromise our own self-righteousness by supporting a less-than-perfect opposition for the wider good of the country.

No, not every single point. Only the important ones are non-negotiable. Just a majority of the rest will do.

Looking through the detail of Keir's 10 pledges, I don't support much there, even if the headings might seem laudable.

I will never vote for the Labour Party. When I was Single, no children and working full time, not claiming any benefits, I was seen as a "cash cow" by them. Gordon Brown's mantra, it was all about "hard working families". Nothing for single people, happy to let them pay 75% rate for council tax. They bit the hand that was feeding them. I have a long memory.
Years later when I was living in a bungalow, Corbyn's master plan was to tax people locally according to how much land their property was built on. Wouldn't matter how many people were living in the property. I wouldn't mind but I haven't ever been a high earner. Never paid higher than the basic rate of tax. They are supposed to be the party that I should be drawn to.

@Linguini

So you're quite happy to see the Conservative Party reelected? How have they benefited or protected women while in government?

They blocked GRA reform. They know what a woman is. In the current climate that's showing some balls.

Erm, they proposed the GRA Reform under May. Crispin Blunt, Penny Mordaunt and other Conservatives are active TRAs, more take the stance YWAW.

How many floating voters are there in GB? The pollsters should get on to this and the issues.

There are too many safe seats throughout though there have been some surprise turnarounds (Churchill being turfed out, John Major winning, Blair's first win).

My prediction is that the LibDems and Greens will lose badly. Tories will only come through if they can mitigate the disaster of Brexit (the NI agreement is still in the air) Covid/energy prices/Ukraine/cronyism/partygate.

Labour need to sort their front bench and agree policies now. At the moment they seem more fractious than the Tories which is never good.

The SNP need to come clean and stop pretending they've improved medicine, education and care for the elderly.

In the end of the day votes tend to go for (a) tribal leanings (b) local issues and impact (c) economy (d) popularity of leader and local MP.

Then there's the hills you would die on. Clearly not enough people objected to the invasions of Iraq or our troops in Afghanistan.

I wonder if enough women will vote or know enough about the GRA and the politics of Transgender/trans issue to vote accordingly. We know Labour, Greens, SNP, Liberals are all on board with trans rights, but some Tories are on the same hymn sheet.