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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To seek assurances that I’ll be put on a single sex ward?

337 replies

Thoosa · 18/03/2022 19:21

Not single gender. Single sex.

Im due for one, maybe two, surgeries this year. I’m a DV and rape survivor.

I’m nervous.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
11
DdraigGoch · 18/03/2022 23:36

@Piper22 what can be more relevant to a discussion about male sexual violence against women in hospital settings than articles/research about male sexual violence against women in hospital settings?

lifeturnsonadime · 18/03/2022 23:39

[quote DdraigGoch]@Piper22 what can be more relevant to a discussion about male sexual violence against women in hospital settings than articles/research about male sexual violence against women in hospital settings?[/quote]
For some reason
@Piper22
thinks that gender identity means that transwomen are not really males.

Which is concerning given that they Piper is apparently a nurse.

Eyesofdisarray · 18/03/2022 23:43

@Thoosa and @risefromyourgrave- im sorry for your experiences and so sorry that the misogynists (because they make it very plain) are so denigrating/dismissive of your trauma. Best wishes
I find piper22's comments disgusting; nobody is being transphobic. This same old line is regularly trotted out and is frankly boring.
Piper's comments towards thoosa and rise are just plain nasty. And from a health professional??? That beggars belief. And enough of the marginalised stuff too- another hackneyed phrase.
I'm astounded by the lack of empathy towards women- you really do hate us don't you?

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 18/03/2022 23:45

I'd ask you how you coped with misogyny, but I doubt you have any relevant advice, Piper.

If you think what you are doing is supporting "biological women", I think the best thing you could do is go very far away, and never go anywhere near a woman again. You started off knowingly attacking a rape survivor for feeling scared about going into hospital, and you have only dug deeper since then.

You're using the word marginalised again.

1 in 5 women is subjected to attempted rape or completed rape during her life. I readily believe that transitioned females (as rapists care rather more about the exterior of their victim than whether the victim experiences gender dysphoria) have similar stats, especially as transitioned females (what you might call transmen) seem to be survivors of child sexual abuse at a disproportionately higher rate than the rest of the female population.

Do you have evidence to show that transitioned males are victimised at a "far higher rate" than women? As in, more than 1 in 5?

Do you have evidence to show that the population of transitioned males does not have an offending pattern that reflects the wider pattern of male offending?

You want to single out male transitioners out from other males. I want to treat them like everyone else. Do you hate men, or something? Confused

StillWeRise · 18/03/2022 23:46

are they Lindt ones?

SantaCarlaCalifornia · 18/03/2022 23:47

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

StillWeRise · 18/03/2022 23:47

the teddy bears

Featuredcreature · 18/03/2022 23:48

Tbh when I worked in the NHS it was done by bays not wards.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 18/03/2022 23:48

Piper's comments towards thoosa and rise are just plain nasty. And from a health professional??? That beggars belief. And enough of the marginalised stuff too- another hackneyed phrase.
I'm astounded by the lack of empathy towards women- you really do hate us don't you?

So many people are captured by this ideology across all sectors.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 18/03/2022 23:50

@StillWeRise

the teddy bears
Aldi. I don't have the budget to use Lindt teddies as a coping mechanism! Grin
Ereshkigalangcleg · 18/03/2022 23:51

post irrelevant articles

It wasn't irrelevant, a ward isn't single sex with males on it, and you have only made the point of how totally lacking empathy for women and girls so many supporters of the trans identity politics agenda are. Toodles.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 18/03/2022 23:52

extract

Ask almost any politician any question about gender identity — even if it’s specifically about women’s bodies or women’s rights — and you will inevitably hear the following sentence with minimal variation.

“What we must remember is that the trans community is one of the most marginalised, abused and vulnerable in society.”

(Continues)

In his much-mocked answer to a question about whether it’s bigoted to say only women have a cervix, Labour leaderSir Keir Starmersaid: “We need to bear in mind that the trans community are amongst the most marginalised and abused communities.”

Asked to give his thoughts on Kemi Badenoch’s reported comments that LGBT activism has gone from wanting freedom to marry who you want, to men wanting to use women’s bathrooms, London MayorSadiq Khanreplied: “The trans community is one of the most vulnerable in our society.”

Liberal Democrat leaderSir Ed Davey, presumably on his own accord, even tweeted that “The trans community is one of the most discriminated against in the UK” in order to condemn a story that the government was unlikely to introduce self ID in order to protect women’s spaces.

It is a shield, provided by their advisors, behind which they cower, and because it rarely receives pushback from informed journalists, it has the magical effect of shutting down the discussion before it even gets started. That’s why politicans love it. It’s the UK equivalent to the“thoughts and prayers”catechism recited by American politicians after every mass shooting.

There’s only one problem with it. It’s not true. It’s not even remotely true.

Let’s begin with the clearest indicator of the extent to which a community is“marginalised and abused”: the murder rate of those within it. Because there is no stable definition of what constitutes a“trans person”, there is no standardised method for recording the deaths of trans people across the UK. However, we know that there have beenjust eight reported murdersof people who defined themselves as transgender, transsexual or cross-dressers in the UK since reporting began in 2008. Even trans organisationTransrespect, which includes people who havecommitted suicideandpeople whose death was originally and erroneously treated as suspiciousin their numbers for“murdered” victims,says the number from 2008 to 2020is eleven.

Note that the UK is not a European anomaly — in Germany there hasn’t been a murder of a trans person since 2008, while 26 countries in Europe have reported no murders of trans people for the entire period.

Even though we’ve seen a sharp rise in the number of people who identify as transgender in the last few years, a trans person hasn’t been murdered in the UK fornearly three yearsand there are, for example, no reportseverof a trans person in Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland being murdered.

Moreover, not one of even the eleven people Transrespect says were murdered, were killed due to“transphobia”. The victim in each case was typically murdered by a male sexual partner due to drugs or money issues. None were killed by a woman — and one was killed by aman who identifies as a woman.

(Continues)

Of the five monitored strands that the police record as hate crimes, the transgender category has, every year, and by some distance, seen theleastnumber of“hate crimes” against it. In fact, religion — the next-lowest — saw nearly three times as many incidents in the last recording year.

Continues: thecritic.co.uk/neither-marginalised-abused-nor-vulnerable/

Featuredcreature · 18/03/2022 23:54

Expecting wards to be single sex is odd. I worked on wards 2005-2006 and wards weren't single sex apart from the obviously female ones. This is a strange hill to die on.

RealBecca · 18/03/2022 23:55

I say this kindly, he chance of anything happening is low. As low as a doctor or nurse committing a sex crime against you.

And I'm honestly not being goady but if you're all in a communal ward recovering from surgery the person is less likely to be capable and would be identified, witnessed and arrested quickly.

I understand your fear but I dont think your risk in thos specific situation from a trans person attacking you is any higher than a medical professional attacking you.

I'm not trying to up your fear but perhaps there are some stats on hospital crimes committed by patients against patients to compare against medical strike offs.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 18/03/2022 23:58

Expecting wards to be single sex is odd.

No, it isn't. Most people are under the impression that mixed sex wards are in a long term process of being "phased out" as this is what politicians have promised for years.

Eyesofdisarray · 19/03/2022 00:01

The chances may be low, but one rape/assault/attack/harassment/threat is one too many. All women ask for is safeguarding- not sure why people don't get it

SD1978 · 19/03/2022 00:03

The simple answer is you can't. The legal right to gender recognition trumps your request. The likelihood that you'll find yourself in this situation is very, very small. I would focus more on that to help with your understandable feeling on anxiety.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 19/03/2022 00:07

Now, let's discuss hate crimes.

If someone shouts insults out of a car window at my brother for either of the protected characteristics he has, he can report those things to the police as a hate crime.

To be honest, I'm all in favour of that. I get very pissed off when people discriminate against my brother. I like him! (You all would too. Well, probably not Piper. My little brother has strong feelings about how men should treat female athletes with respect and stuff like that.)

However, people (let's get real, men) yelling intimidating insults and threats at me, related to me being visibly female is not a recordable hate crime.

But what if it were?

extract

More than four-fifths of young women in the UK have been subjected to sexual harassment, according to a survey for UNWomenUK, which warns that most women have lost faith that the abuse will be dealt with.

Among women aged 18-24, 86% said they had been sexually harassed in public spaces, while just 3% did not recall ever having experienced sexually harassing behaviour. The remaining 11% chose not to answer the question.

According to the survey, published in areport by the all-party parliamentary group (APPG) for UN Women, 71% of women of any age said they had experienced sexual harassment in public spaces

“This is a human rights crisis. It’s just not enough for us to keep saying ‘this is too difficult a problem for us to solve’ – it needs addressing now,” said Claire Barnett, executive director of UN Women UK.

“We are looking at a situation where younger women are constantly modifying their behaviour in an attempt to avoid being objectified or attacked, and older women are reporting serious concerns about personal safety if they ever leave the house in the dark – even during the daytime in winter.”

The survey of more than 1,000 women, carried out by YouGov and seen exclusively by the Guardian, exposes a damning lack of faith in the UK authorities’ desire and ability to deal with sexual harassment – 96% of respondents did not report incidents, with 45% saying it would not change anything. Among those who said the event was not serious enough to report were women who had been groped, followed and coerced into sexual activity, said UN Women UK

from: www.theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/10/almost-all-young-women-in-the-uk-have-been-sexually-harassed-survey-finds

lifeturnsonadime · 19/03/2022 00:09

@SD1978

The simple answer is you can't. The legal right to gender recognition trumps your request. The likelihood that you'll find yourself in this situation is very, very small. I would focus more on that to help with your understandable feeling on anxiety.
Well this is simply not true. Sex is a protected characteristic in the Equality Act.

But even if it were true why should women have to work on their trauma to appease the feelings of men who identify as women?

Don't you see how sexist this is? Telling women to step aside and to deal with their trauma because men who identify as women, whatever that means, want to be in those spaces?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 19/03/2022 00:13

The legal right to gender recognition trumps your request

It's a misogynistic policy, not a legal right.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 19/03/2022 00:16

@Featuredcreature

Expecting wards to be single sex is odd. I worked on wards 2005-2006 and wards weren't single sex apart from the obviously female ones. This is a strange hill to die on.
2005-2006?

In 2010, after many years of public pressure and governmental promises, the then Health Secretary promised to introduce fines for hospitals that had mixed sex wards with certain exceptions, such as A&E and intensive care units. These came into effect in January 2011.

Incidentally, have you any idea how threatening it reads to see you asking if a rape survivor is willing to die on the hill of... asking if she can be placed on a single sex ward?

Seriously, examine that wording. Who, exactly, is going to kill her for not wanting to share space with strange males, whatever their gender identity? I think our problem is not the OP, but the person who you think will kill the OP!

Whatiswrongwithmyknee · 19/03/2022 00:26

Another bonkers thread showing no logic at all. If males come into female wards, it is no longer a female ward. You can argue for all mixed wards if you want but there is no logic to having a mixed ward called a female ward. If you think we don't need female only, campaign for all mixed. At least that would be honest.

Furries · 19/03/2022 00:37

@Boredoutmymind

This thread is so transphobic. Whether some one is male or female doesn't mean they are a bad person. Any one can assault anyone. If your so worried then pay for a private bed. Sex and gender are just legal terms. To all of you who are ignorant your sex/gender is determined by your brain not genitals.

many men have been assaulted by women but they don't cause a fuss and demand male only medical staff. If they did they would be told to "man up" by the majority on mumsnet.

most people who are in hospital are bed bound. If you can look after yourself the NHS will discharge you.

What a load of absolute bullshit.
alexio · 19/03/2022 00:46

Unfortunately there aren't many single sex wards anymore unless ob/gyn.

You could ask presurgery to be placed in a room close to the nurses station, possibly that could give you some peace of mind, there is usually always someone there (nurse, dr, ward clerk)
If the hospital has single rooms you could see if you could request that, bonus if the whole ward is single rooms
Request female nurse only, the ward I work on is more than happy to oblige to this and I'm sure others will be too

Bintymcbintface · 19/03/2022 00:48

Not to be an idiot or anything but... If there were trans people on your ward, how would you know? They're not going to be wandering around naked or anything, there are a great deal of female "passing" mtf trans people, unless you saw their nethers you'd have no idea that they were trans...

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