To not want to give people free advice?

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I work in the legal sector, studied Law at both undergrad and postgrad level and I am hoping to work towards becoming a barrister.

Since starting my undergrad Law degree I have always had people (family & friends) reach out to me to ask for advice. I have always tried to answer their questions based on what I know but warned them I am not a professional. Since gaining my current position I now specialise in a certain area of Law that a lot of people are wanting advice in. I don’t mind people asking me the odd question here and there but I am increasingly getting messages asking for advice and even people asking if I will meet them. I have told these people that I can’t do that and it’s constantly been met with “it’s not really legal advice I just wanted to meet for a coffee and a chat”.

I work very long hours. Sometimes I’m working 14+ hour days going over massive amounts of paperwork and I come home with my brain frazzled. I want to be able to switch off when I finish work and not constantly be asked my professional opinion. I have friends who are hair dressers and I wouldn’t ask them to do my hair for free, so to me this feels like the same thing. However, there is a part of me that’s thinking well it’s not like I’m doing their paperwork and legal advice is more important than that so should I be giving these people some time? A lot of the people who are asking my opinion are not well off and would probably struggle to afford professional advice so I’m not sure what to do. I obviously don’t want their lives to be negatively impacted by not gaining appropriate advice but if I did it for one person, how many would I be meeting? I’m not a charity As I said, I don’t mind answering messages here and there or even pointing people towards a solicitor in that area but suddenly it feels like a lot. I’m on a salary right now so even if I was giving these people advice through work I wouldn’t be paid any extra for it.

So AIBU to not want to give advice to these people? And if I am please can you help me come up with a reply because I just keep being met with “I only wanted a coffee and a chat” when I tell them I can’t meet up with them and give them legal advice.

In some circumstances you may have a duty of care towards others. (Probably not extension plans or boil lancing)

Many times I think Your shoes are bloody awaful and if they were transparent and you could see what was happening to your feet , all smooshed up like a bankrobbers face in a pair of tights ...well you wouldn't wear them but I don't share this gem with them

My response (not a solicitor, but another advising profession) is that I'm unable to give a professional opinion unless I'm being paid as my professional indemnity insurance only covers paid work that's been put through the office.

Ok, it's a little white lie. But it generally works.

But it is not a white lie. In most regulated professions, it would be potentially legally dangerous (and possibly financially ruinous) for anyone to give advice that is not covered by professional indemnity insurance. Even an informal chat down the pub or over a cup of coffee can have unintended consequences for the person giving the advice if the other party claims that they acted on this advice and subsequently suffered a loss of some kind.

I have worked in two regulated professions. In both professions, this was covered and drummed in on Day One of the respective induction courses for the companies that I worked for.

@70isaLimitNotaTarget what about spotting verrucous in a swimming pool situation, would you go full Jaws "get out of the water" ....

Oh gosh I can identify with you. I work with languages and I'm always asked 'can you just translate this for me'. It puts me in a really awkward position. I agree with what others are saying, have a polite but firm textbook response that you don't discuss work in leisure time.

I get this a lot. I am usually politely firm and decline but one person was really entitled, I had never met them and the CF was already sending papers to me (a friend gave them my number) to read in advance of our 'coffee and chat' and they even specified when we would be having the coffee and chat! All this before I had even read their first text!

I did my usual 'I only advise if you are my client, you can become one by..." to which they replied "I only have really quick questions" and repeated the day and time we would be meeting for coffee!

I told them was busy as I was meeting a dentist for coffee and a chat that day while they did a quick root canal surgery at the table for free. CF didn't get it, offered an alternative date to which I said I was meeting an accountant for a coffee and a chat whilst they completed my tax return for free.

They still didn't get it! They were so thick skinned I actually had a bit of a laugh seeing how far I needed to take it before they finally backed down. They then said "no need to be rude".

Say:

Unfortunately, I am not able to give legal advice outside of work. It is against the terms of my employment. I could be dismissed if I did so.

OP I feel your pain. I am a former legal professional and I’m now a midwife. People take the absolute piss.

I don’t have a solution for you but I’m now totally cool with asking if we can NOT talk about birth when I am on girls weekends away. I just can’t face it anymore.

Whilst legal advice seems expensive, and I think the law favours rich people, I think the OPs response not to offer free advice is the correct one.

It's not like a doctor helping a person who is ill, when off duty.

I get this too.

I am a genealogist - started off as a hobby, is now a business. People always ask if can just look up something, or help them located their granny's wedding certificate, or look into the history of their house or something - failing to realise that I have people who will PAY me to do that.

[quote TunaPaste]@70isaLimitNotaTarget what about spotting verrucous in a swimming pool situation, would you go full Jaws "get out of the water" ....[/quote]
Ha ! yes , I'd get a Klaxon

Actually without my glasses I'd be lucky to see the swimming pool let alone anyones verruca!

It's usually when I'm walking behind someone with really cracked heels in sandles or those Ugg-u-Like boots which are like a sock and the wearer is walking on the inner ankle bit .

Or their gastroc so tight in heels your waiting for the “snap” sound.

Luckily you don’t see that as much nowadays.

@Whadda

Same. I have a law qualification in a particular area and I’ve worked in this area for 15 years.

The amount of times I get hit-up tor free advice is shocking. I now give a very firm “no”.

I also find that, when they’re not paying you, people only tell you half the story to make themselves look better and then get upset when you advice you give isn’t relevant to them because they haven’t really told you what’s happening.

This! Exactly.

You can't advise unless you're instructed, with a client care letter.

Tell people you only give advice at work.

You need a “Oh I wish I could but I can’t” response.

You can go on to add that you’ve had to make this a blanket rule for absolutely everyone because “some people” (“of course I know YOU wouldn’t be like this but you wouldn’t believe what some people are like”) take the piss and it’s not the kind of thing you can afford to get wrong etc.

At the end of the day, if the guy who valets your car gets arsey you can get a new valet service. Former colleagues aren’t current colleagues etc.

@Picklerickflag

Make up soke story about you and the last person you gave free advice to ending up in the shit because of your advice, they didn't have insurance or any comeback or some other claptrap.

Alternatively start telling people you do something totally boring and different.

Don't do that. Why put yourself down to a cheeky so and so?.

OP - the issue is not whether or not you should be giving advice for free (the answer to which is that you should not, under any circumstances, for all of the legal and liability reasons that people have stated in numerous posts).

The issue is how you set the boundary. Since the boundary is "No advice outside of work" you need to work on saying this. Firmly and politely if possible. Bluntly if not.

Do not engage. Do not give the impression that you will engage. Change the subject. State clearly (and truthfully) that you are not allowed to do work outside of your employment contract. By all means point people in the right direction towards a suitably qualified solicitor etc. but don't offer any opinion and be prepared to walk away, hang up, or reply "sorry, can't help" to emails if necessary.

I sympathise. The legal profession (and expense) can be daunting and confusing. If the queries are somewhat related to your field of expertise, perhaps consider having business-type cards in your handbag with the contact details of relevant local help organisations - whether CAB, or support groups, advice lines? "I cant give direct advice but these people may be able to help you' .That way you do give them help and point them in a self-help direction and they feel they have 'got' something from an expert? Sounds it would be worth the effort!

I’m coming from a slightly different approach here but I was recently in a situation where a lawyer was needed urgently. I’m a savvy person, have a professional career and can usually figure out most things but finding someone in the right area of law was incredibly difficult. Had the lawyers I approached turned round and said to me “I’m not on the clock” things would have turned out very differently. Instead each of them generously put me in contact with someone who could help me and eventually an acquaintance agreed to take on the case (at cost of course). There are plenty of people - refugees, vulnerable people who wouldn’t even know where to start, it’s a minefield out there and had I not had those contacts things would have turned out very differently and I am eternally grateful for all of their support.

You are not a qualified lawyer so it’s slightly different, but could you set aside maybe an hour a week to offer probono work when you are - and by probono that could mean putting people in touch with the right people. That way you could factor it into your hours and not end up overwhelmed?

As other people have pointed out, most people in an area of skill (myself included) have given up their free time to help others in their hour of need. It just depends on you how much time you’re willing to give.

Good luck OP !

I work in a profession where 'friends' are constantly asking me to 'just take a quick look at' something which would entail hours of scrutiny. I once had an extremely close friend who should know better ask me to look at a 100k word document and then got offended when I said I couldn't do so for at least a month. She truly thought i should and could just drop my paid work ad family commitments to give her my unpaid, uninterrupted attention for the next few days with no warning.

Most of the time I just say no.

You can pre-empt it a bit by being very vocal about awful people who ask you for a 'coffee and a chat' assuming your very sparse hours of free time should be taken up giving them free professional advice.

Just learn to say, 'Sorry but I get asked several times a week and if I went for all the 'little chats over coffee' people asked me for, I'd be wired, so I have ot be fair and say no to everyone.'

@itsabouttimetoo

I’m coming from a slightly different approach here but I was recently in a situation where a lawyer was needed urgently. I’m a savvy person, have a professional career and can usually figure out most things but finding someone in the right area of law was incredibly difficult. Had the lawyers I approached turned round and said to me “I’m not on the clock” things would have turned out very differently. Instead each of them generously put me in contact with someone who could help me and eventually an acquaintance agreed to take on the case (at cost of course). There are plenty of people - refugees, vulnerable people who wouldn’t even know where to start, it’s a minefield out there and had I not had those contacts things would have turned out very differently and I am eternally grateful for all of their support.

You are not a qualified lawyer so it’s slightly different, but could you set aside maybe an hour a week to offer probono work when you are - and by probono that could mean putting people in touch with the right people. That way you could factor it into your hours and not end up overwhelmed?

As other people have pointed out, most people in an area of skill (myself included) have given up their free time to help others in their hour of need. It just depends on you how much time you’re willing to give.

Good luck OP !

That's the point though. These friends put you in touch with someone who could help. They could not help themselves and you had to pay in the end ofr proper advice. I used to say 'I cannot help you because - but here are the details of those who can'.

That is what the OP should do. She literally cannot help unless she wants to be disbarred before she is even barred.

I feel your pain, OP. I work in the construction sector and run my own small company. I get phone calls on Saturday evenings from friends of friends of friends who just want a chat with me about... People have no boundaries.

The thing is too, with regulated professions, is that you are seriously screwed if you offer advice that is not backed up by a client - professional relationshoip complete with a contract. It's really not worth some random family member or friend thinking it's really simple and not understanding that you might be in breach of your professional body regulations and vulnerable to all sorts, and losing your job, your livelihood and your repution. Most of our trade boy magazines are filled with disciplinary tribunal reports of people doing just that.

-body

@SnowWhiteLobelia without going into detail, I did get help from the people I was in contact with which led me to the right person - not one of them turned round and said “I can’t help because I’m not on the clock” - the actual full legal support was paid for, hence why I included it, but I wouldn’t have known who to approach and with what had I not been given advice by other friends. All of them have actually followed up to check on me and the case since. My point is that you can set a limit for the advice that you give - but there are plenty of lawyers who do probono work that isn’t full legal advice (and plenty who do too!)

We are arguing the same point @itsabouttimetoo

@SnowWhiteLobelia agreed!