It’s a birthday party invites one- twins

[MarianosOnHisWay]

DD has a set of boy-girl twins in her Year 3 class. Let’s call then John and Sarah (not real names).
John seems to be a boisterous type, I often hear his name from DD at the end of the day in conjunction with who has been in trouble or that he’s done something like pull her glasses off, talk about killer clowns etc. Sarah isn’t one of DD’s best friends but they get on fine.

The popular destination for 8th birthday parties this year (after they haven’t been able to have parties for so long) is either one of two large trampoline/bouncy park type things. We’ve been to around 4-5 parties at these so far this year. Because they’re large places, you don’t hire the whole place- there are members of the public bouncing too.

DD is having her party at one such place. She would like to invite all the girls in the class. However, what has happened at the last few parties like this is- Sarah is invited but the twins’ mum also brings John along and pays for him as a member of the public to enter and bounce. Obviously he doesn’t join in the party room, party food etc.

I get it- they’re twins, what one does the other wants to do. Also maybe mum doesn’t have childcare for John while taking Sarah to a party.

DD has now said she’s worried about inviting Sarah as it will mean John will come. She says at the other parties when he’s been there as a non-party member of the public he’s been rough, deliberately barged into the party members when bouncing, even strangled them, been rude and called out rude things etc. She doesn’t want this to happen at her party.

I’m not sure how to make the AIBU voting because as I see it there are three options:

-Don’t invite Sarah- very reluctant to do this as she’d be the only girl in the class not invited and why should she suffer due to her twin brother’s behaviour?

-Invite Sarah but have a work with mum and say please don’t bring John- so awkward and she may not have the option plus as a member of the public I can’t really control if she brings him?

-Invite Sarah and just accept that it means John coming too, and prep DD to come and report any incidents (again so awkward though? The mum will be sitting there at the cafe place and what will I say “John is playing rough and the girls don’t like it, please get him and ask him to stop”)

Or is there a fourth option??

Not inviting all the girls and doing the 8-10 list of closer friends plus a few from the other class makes the best sense. The whole 'you can't not invite Sarah' and 'you must be kind to John' debates are then obsolete. What matters here is your DD having a happy birthday or it's all pointless. She's told you her wishes. That's how to make it happen. Avoid the Sarah/John issue altogether and have a (hopefully) stress free party!

@FluffyScarves

OP. I like your idea of inviting 8-9 girls from the class. Not Sarah (if DD is not close). Then a handful from the other year class and her outside of school friends. Bish bosh!

This is the best option. Birthday girl gets her party and people she likes, and Sarah isn't singled out as only some of the class and girls in the class will go. Do this!

Re all the comments about it being 'cruel' and terrible' out to invite her. If she was the only girl in the class it looks harsh, yes. But primary can get harsh, lots of 'YOU'RE not invited' at times. I made it clear to my primary aged DC that no one was ever entitled to go to a party. If you got invited, that was lovely, but if not that's that and you don't get to moan. Teaching kids that it's a very upsetting thing not to be invited somewhere only leads to trouble.

I’m guessing the mum brings the other kid either because she has no other option
Though OP said there is another younger sibling who doesn't come, so the mum must have someone who can do childcare for her. Perhaps they are less keen to take John for some reason..

@WeatherwaxOn

Invite Sarah. Advise the mother its girls only. Also, speak to the venue and see if there is a limit in numbers you can supervise. Also the idea abput taking Sarah along yourself is great, if do-able for you. Unless they're conjoined twins there's no reason why John needs to be there.

Have you read any of the thread?

She can't stop the mother bringing John to the venue. It's open to the public. The party can be girls only but he can still go with him mother and then obviously he's going to hang around with the other children in his class.

The parents are staying and so she can't say she can't supervise John as his own mother will be there.

The OP can't take Sarah as she does not have space in her car.

I’d just invite Sarah and accept he’ll come. Supervise the bouncing yourself and tell him off he’s being rough. It’s open to the public anyway so you’re going to get boisterous children

include John and let him participate in the party

As pp have said, what message does that give to the birthday girl? That she must always give way to an aggressive male? That she's not allowed to say 'No, I don't want to do that'?

Hey it was you who mentioned 10 years, no competition from me. Yes I make a positive difference. Of course there is lack of engagement in deprived areas. Apology accepted.

I don’t understand why any parents stay at that age.

It is usual here for invitations to say ‘Drop and go party - no need for parents to stay’.

In fact by this age, most party organiser prefer other parents NOT to stay and actively discourage it - partly because if the sibling issues but also because these older kids like a bit of time without parents.

@Faevern

Hey it was you who mentioned 10 years, no competition from me. Yes I make a positive difference. Of course there is lack of engagement in deprived areas. Apology accepted.

I mentioned 10 years to say I was experienced (no comparison to how long anyone else has been working) and you then said you’d been doing it “many more years” than me- hence the making it a competition.

Not sure why parents stay at that age. I’ve honestly never stayed at a birthday party, I just wouldn’t do that especially not when they’re 8 years old. Sarah’s Mum should be dropping Sarah off and going home with John until it’s collection time. You can’t police this though so I wouldn’t invite Sarah because her brother sounds like a nightmare.

I get why you don't want to use your teacher voice but I think if you witness him being violent towards the party guests you are well within your rights to use your teacher voice.

@tkwal

I'm feeling a bit bemused that no one has picked up on the comment that "John" has "barged into the girls, even strangled them" I would be having a word with his mother. That along with knowing he's familiar with killer clowns raises a major red flag with me

I just noticed this, to be honest. I have no idea how I overread this. Sorry!

But yes, it really changes things, in my opinion.

I would openly tell her that the behaviour of John is not acceptable and that he is a danger to the other children and that she needs to get him help. Strangling someone is really dangerous and the OP might even be made responsible if something happens because she was watching the kids too.

People need to RTFT and all of OP’s updates.

1. OP cannot offer Sarah a lift (afaik - not enough space in car).

1. John’s mum is a CF. She brings John to the public places, lets him run riot and won’t parent him. She doesn’t intervene.

1. OP seems nice and doesn’t want Sarah to be the only girl from that class not invited.

1. Venue is not a drop and run - parent supervision expected. OP cannot therefore request all parents not to stay.

1. OP’s daughter wants the party she wants. She should not be forced to have a child hurting her/her friends as part of the package.

1. Sarah is not a great friend of OP’s daughter.

In my mind OP has two options open to her:

1. Invite half the girls from one class, and half from the other class/brownies etc. Therefore Sarah not invited but also not excluded.

1. Invite Sarah, ask another school parent to give her a lift/help supervise so that John isn’t brought in the car. If John still comes, then unfortunately you will need to flag to staff (but these places usually don’t have staff watching kids that closely) and also speak to John’s mum firmly each time something happens. You should also ask one other parent to help monitor. This won’t unfortunately probably work.

Personally I’d be going for option 1.

Can she invite a smaller group of girls? Just her immediate friendship group perhaps?

I always find my children enjoy the smaller parties more in the end.

@tkwal

I'm feeling a bit bemused that no one has picked up on the comment that "John" has "barged into the girls, even strangled them" I would be having a word with his mother. That along with knowing he's familiar with killer clowns raises a major red flag with me

Oh yes, it’s not as though he’s just coming along and then harmlessly bouncing around as a non-party-attendee. I wouldn’t really bat an eyelid about that. It’s the behaviour problems that come along with it. As I mentioned in my OP, my DD wears glasses and he seems to have developed a habit of pulling them off her, like pulling them down so they fall off her face and are round her chin/neck so she has to pull them back up. That’s unpleasant for my DD but relatively low level compared to the inappropriate chat about killer clowns coming to get you and also the strangling.

You invite all the girls. Don't even dream of leaving Sarah out, that would be incredibly cruel. Then if John is there you deal with it as you would any other child being disruptive. As you know the mother, a word with her if it becomes a problem is a good idea. These places are full of boisterous children, often upsetting each other. Unless you pay for exclusive use of a facility, its the nature of the beast.

Option 4. You don’t go to a trampoline park. You invite all the girls to yours or another place for a pamper party, or bowling or afternoon tea or a swimming party or laser tag or clip and climb - do something he can’t come to. Problem solved.

@Oriunda

People need to RTFT and all of OP’s updates.

1. OP cannot offer Sarah a lift (afaik - not enough space in car).

1. John’s mum is a CF. She brings John to the public places, lets him run riot and won’t parent him. She doesn’t intervene.

1. OP seems nice and doesn’t want Sarah to be the only girl from that class not invited.

1. Venue is not a drop and run - parent supervision expected. OP cannot therefore request all parents not to stay.

1. OP’s daughter wants the party she wants. She should not be forced to have a child hurting her/her friends as part of the package.

1. Sarah is not a great friend of OP’s daughter.

In my mind OP has two options open to her:

1. Invite half the girls from one class, and half from the other class/brownies etc. Therefore Sarah not invited but also not excluded.

1. Invite Sarah, ask another school parent to give her a lift/help supervise so that John isn’t brought in the car. If John still comes, then unfortunately you will need to flag to staff (but these places usually don’t have staff watching kids that closely) and also speak to John’s mum firmly each time something happens. You should also ask one other parent to help monitor. This won’t unfortunately probably work.

Personally I’d be going for option 1.

Thank you for this summary

So why not just invite fewer girls? Your dd isnt particularly close to Sarah so it's not like she's desperate for her to be there, and it's only unfair to leave Sarah out if she is the only girl from the class not to be invited.

@needingpeace

Option 4. You don’t go to a trampoline park. You invite all the girls to yours or another place for a pamper party, or bowling or afternoon tea or a swimming party or laser tag or clip and climb - do something he can’t come to. Problem solved.

Problem not solved as my DD wants to have her party at the trampoline park.

Private venue, school hall with entertainer or suchlike, drop off only, girls only. Done.

@LouisRenault

include John and let him participate in the party

As pp have said, what message does that give to the birthday girl? That she must always give way to an aggressive male? That she's not allowed to say 'No, I don't want to do that'?

I wrote this before I noticed that I had overread the strangling/extreme aggression part. This is extremely different and I would therefore change my attitude and openly talk to the mum and tell her that he can't come and that she needs to get him help. And I would be really firm about it. Not only could something happen but if something did happen she might be made responsible too as she was watching the party guests.

Again, I overread the part about the extreme aggression (sorry!) and thought he was just a bit wild and not easy to take care of.

Well, normally if the mum tagged someone along (not the child's fault after all) it would teach a child a valuable lesson such as:

• it is not nice to exclude people
• it is nice to be hospitable towards people
• it is good to be kind and understanding
• sometimes things change and we can't control them but we can try to make the best out of it
• we shouldn't hurt someone for someone else's mistake (the mum took him, he just happens to be there)

Sorry, but excluding a young child from cake and a party room just because his mum did something bad is just mean.

BUT this obviously doesn't apply when the child is a danger to everyone so therefore I apologise for overreading this. So the OP was right to exclude him and she is right in not wanting him to attend. I would just openly tell the mum.

You can hire indoor bouncy castles for community halls, we did for my daughters bday. Similar to a trampoline and no John?

@Porcupineintherough

So why not just invite fewer girls? Your dd isnt particularly close to Sarah so it's not like she's desperate for her to be there, and it's only unfair to leave Sarah out if she is the only girl from the class not to be invited.

I’m leaning towards this option now tbh.

@needingpeace

Option 4. You don’t go to a trampoline park. You invite all the girls to yours or another place for a pamper party, or bowling or afternoon tea or a swimming party or laser tag or clip and climb - do something he can’t come to. Problem solved.

This is certainly an option I'd put to DD. I'd tell her there was nothing that could reasonably be done to stop John (and potentially other unpleasant children) from spoiling her party in a public place, so she either had to take that risk or have a different party no one could spoil.

Crikey, I'm gobsmacked at how many would just roll over & accept a misbehaving uninvited guest. What a shit message to send out to your DCs

Tell Sarah's mum straight that your DD does not want to invite John, because she isn't friends with him & is upset by his behaviour in school. She does want to invite Sarah, but only if John doesn't gate crash her party & spoil it as a result... then offer the lift to Sarah by way of helping. I'm guessing the DM is fully aware John doesn't behave well & a good parent wouldn't want Sarah affected by that. How the hell is she meant to know if nobody tells her the truth