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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Dads joining coffee group

499 replies

CaptainMyCaptainn · 14/02/2022 14:25

So I strongly suspect I’m being UR and probably need a resounding yes to give me a head wobble.

A weekly coffee / lunch meet up in a pub for mums started a few months ago. It was advertised as mums and mums to be and it’s been a great space to meet other mums and talk about everything from boobs and PND to holidays.

Someone recently asked if there’s a similar group for dads and then all of a sudden, dads were being added to the WhatsApp group and have started to come. Today, one came on his own as he left sleeping baby at home with mum. I personally think it changes the dynamic to have men but I think I’m being UR here. Just hoping that whilst I’m UR, it’s understandable.

Just to add, there are dads who come to other baby groups I go to and it’s completely ok, and I happily chat to them. But it’s this particular one where it’s more of a support group that feels uncomfortable.

OP posts:
2Rebecca · 14/02/2022 14:58

Coming without a baby is odd. It sounds as though you may need to set up another women only group and see if any of the women in the Whatsapp group want a mums only group if that's what you want and limit how many people can add people to the group or make it clear this one is mums only

PleasantBirthday · 14/02/2022 14:58

I think if you joined a mother's group and then it became a general parents group without everyone deciding that was the direction they wanted it to go in, it's perfectly legitimate to not like the change.

It's a bit frustrating that women can't have anything for themselves in case there's a man who wants it somewhere. Why won't they do anything for themselves rather than cuckooing everywhere?

grapewine · 14/02/2022 14:59

Sorry FOJN, crosspost.

Peas252 · 14/02/2022 15:01

Why can’t they create their own Dads group though?

My dh did try to form one, and advertised it on the local Facebook group. He was quickly shutdown by the women on that group because it was "sexist" to exclude women and each time after he posted, it was deleted by the admin.

FOJN · 14/02/2022 15:02

grapewine

No need to apologise. We need to keep saying it. It is not a woman's job to organise a support group for men; women are allowed groups and spaces of their own if they want them. It is not unkind for women to put themselves first sometimes.

PrivateHall · 14/02/2022 15:03

YANBU op, it should be possible to maintain one bloody activity as a woman only support group. I would be pissed off too. I would make a point of continuing to talk openly as much as you want about female topics, in the hope they will see for themselves that it is a female support group.

MarshmallowSwede · 14/02/2022 15:03

Why can’t the men start their own group? Are they helpless?

In Sweden the men organize their own father meet up groups. It’s very normal to see fathers in groups with their children.

I don’t understand why the dads were added to a mum and mum to be group.

And it’s intrusive and makes me think these dads are entitled and just expecting women to do the organizing for them.

No.. organize your own dad and baby meet up group. I can’t imagine myself making my way into a dad group when I can easily arrange my own.

Learned helplessness. Fathers of course need support, but why can’t they organize a group for themselves?

Folklore9074 · 14/02/2022 15:04

If it was a general parenting group meet up then this wouldn't bother me. But your OP says it was a support group for mums specifically. So yeah, a bit odd for a dad to go along to something billed as a female space but personally it wouldn't bother me.

FebruaryFest · 14/02/2022 15:05

My baby group days are long gone.
I was not a great one for groups with newborns and sharing birth stories and was more into "activity" stuff at a bit of a later stage. I was always very happy to talk with dads, grandparents and childminders and used to go with one dad regularly for a post singalong coffee and juice stop.
What I'm trying to prove here is I'm not anti mixing with dads!
However I find the current shoehorning of blokes into sometimes quite raw women to women dynamics unsettling. Then women are made to feel mean for that feeling!
So imo yanbu.

emuloc · 14/02/2022 15:06

@Beamur

Parenting group - fine Mother's support group - not ok
This. There is a difference.
viques · 14/02/2022 15:06

@Moonface123

Personally it wouldn' t bother me as l know a couple of young widowed fathers raising young children alone and to be fair there isnt alot in the way of support out there for them. Plus l find mixed groups more interesting.
If you introduced them to each other they could support each other. It’s what women have done for generations. Men call it networking , women call it surviving.
Mollysocks · 14/02/2022 15:06

@MarshmallowSwede

Why can’t the men start their own group? Are they helpless?

In Sweden the men organize their own father meet up groups. It’s very normal to see fathers in groups with their children.

I don’t understand why the dads were added to a mum and mum to be group.

And it’s intrusive and makes me think these dads are entitled and just expecting women to do the organizing for them.

No.. organize your own dad and baby meet up group. I can’t imagine myself making my way into a dad group when I can easily arrange my own.

Learned helplessness. Fathers of course need support, but why can’t they organize a group for themselves?

Why can’t the men start their own group? Are they helpless?

Yes obviously all the make CEOs in this country got where they are because women set up the job for them 😂

PleasantBirthday · 14/02/2022 15:07

And it’s intrusive and makes me think these dads are entitled and just expecting women to do the organizing for them.

Can you really blame them though, for so many women on this thread, the default has been well, if he wants to go to a parenting support group, you should give him yours or set one up for the little princey.

SomeOwlsCoo · 14/02/2022 15:07

The poor dad who came didnt know he would be the only one. It changed the dynamics but maybe it would be kinder if your group could help set up a daddy or couples group.

Seriously? Mums should "be kind" and set up a Daddy group? Can men not set up their own group?

This reminds me of when my dc were small (16ish years ago.) I used to take them to a local toddler group one weekday morning. Then they announced there was also going to be one on a Saturday morning. Perfect I thought, something cheap and local on a Saturday morning that their Dad and I can take them to. Only when we got there we were told it was for dads only. But there were mums there. I could see them. Turns out they were there to set up/ clear away/make tea and coffee and keep an eye on the kids while the dads relaxed.
So when I went to my midweek toddler group I paid 50p, supervised my children. Took my turn at making drinks, we were strictly limited to 1 drink each at the specified time in the specified room. Helped tidy up at the end.
When the dads went on a Saturday they paid 50p and sat around drinking unlimited teas and coffee whilst the volunteer mums kept an eye on the kids and tidied up.

whiteworldgettingwhiter · 14/02/2022 15:07

@Peas252

Do dads not need support too?
Yes. But then they should organise their own group, not crash a group for women🙄
MaChienEstUnDick · 14/02/2022 15:08

oh I'm really conflicted about this! It's really important for men to play their part in bringing up children, shared parental leave is part of this, so we want parental leave to work for men. That means men should be free to access groups, particularly once the DCs are past that newborn stage when it's all nips and rips.

But otoh, there is just something about men colonising women's spaces that gives me the ick. And it's weird to go to any baby group without the baby, no?

cherrysthename · 14/02/2022 15:09

Fucking hell they are forever encroaching! I'd be pissed off.
Men, make your own group, or join a parent group. Don't elbow your way into a mum-to-be space. Fuck sake.

lottiegarbanzo · 14/02/2022 15:09

Who established the group and who did they say it was for?

It's possible it started as a 'parents' meet up' and just morphed into being a mum's support group, because that's who turned up. In which case it could stick as what it is now, or morph again.

But if it was set up as mum's group, then you'd be very reasonable to speak up, or to suggest a break-away mums' only meet-up.

Notanewusertool · 14/02/2022 15:10

YABU. One of my closest friends is, shock, male. He was also the main carer for both his children when they were small, one of whom has significant additional needs. He definitely suffered from PND and felt terribly isolated. I know he'd have loved a support group like the one you are describing. How will dads being fully engaged in their children's lives become normalised, if we isolate the men who are willing to step up and care for their children? The exception is of course breastfeeding support groups which should absolutely be kept women only, but anything else should be open to all parents.

georgarina · 14/02/2022 15:10

What was the response to 'is there a similar group?'

If it was 'no, but you're welcome to join this one' then they've received a fair invite. If not then they're BU?

NumberTheory · 14/02/2022 15:12

There are a number of reasons for wanting a women only support group. Men do not have the same experience of pregnancy, childbirth or parenting as women. While there’s a lot they do share with us there are some areas that they don’t and wanting a space that gives more space to those things isn’t wrong. In mixed groups the conversation tends to change and women tend to get less support for issues that are specific to being female or that are predominantly experienced by women.

If women are all bringing their babies along, a man turning up on his own having left the baby at home with the mum really highlights this difference in experience and support needs. (It would also raise my predator radar, though it’s not a given.)

So long as there are plenty of groups that fathers can go to too, it’s totally reasonable to have a female only group.

But it’s hard to make that happen when some people have already let men in. You need to sound out some of the other women and see it your feelings on needing this to be a women only group is shared.

fairycakes1234 · 14/02/2022 15:13

Are you sure hes not doing a hugh grant in about a boy???

Notanewusertool · 14/02/2022 15:15

And it's all very well saying "dad's set up their own group" but round here the ratio is about 1 SAHD to about 15 SAHM.

Brainwave89 · 14/02/2022 15:15

My DH was a SAHD. He found it very isolating as I think this thread illustrates. A SAHD often gets excluded from social activities. Kids do not get asked to playdates and they are excluded from social events. There may be a case for some women only events, but this does not sound like one of them. Think of how this would feel if you were on the receiving end. We need to make sure it is as acceptable for a man to be at home with a child as it is a woman.

Thewindwhispers · 14/02/2022 15:15

Ugh I’m sorry OP. Of course men change the dynamic. They interrupt more, talk louder, don’t ask questions of quiet people, etc.

As for the guy who leaves his baby at home with the mum so he can go out on his own to make friends with other women? Creep.

I wish women were stronger at telling men to stay out of womens meetups. Of course the men love it, they get a load of female attention and to lord it over them all.

As for the person who said that mumsnet is mixed sex and supportive 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️ Have you read half the posts on here?? I’m in some single sex mums online groups. They are supportive. Mumsnet is not.